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Thread: State of American Ladies: 2012-13 Season

  1. #871
    can't come down to Earth prettykeys's Avatar
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    roundboypete.

  2. #872
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Good to see you again, roundboypete!! I love your rhymes Where have you been?

  3. #873
    Down With It
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    Man...still in rehab after last night...how's that for craziness?

    Looking forward to Worlds - Wagner now has had TWO mediocre free skates in a row and might be losing her consistency. And to top it off, she still has no 3-3. Safe to say the world podium is slipping out of reach. She may be 4th again but she'll probably be looking at closer to 7th at this point.

    As for Gracie Gold - she is 1 for 3 in the short program...she has shown an inability to control her nerves in high-pressure situations...what's to make me think she can get it together in time for Worlds? The best freeskate in the world will get you almost nowhere on the World stage if you don't do your job in the SP, as Wagner found out last year.

    I hate to say it, but I think we'll be stuck with 2 spots for the second straight Winter Olympics...

  4. #874
    At the rink. Again. mskater93's Avatar
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    Don't count Wagner out - she got injured at the GPF, had to take time out of her training for that and again with the bad salad. With the full time between Nationals and Worlds to prepare, I expect to see the spicy, saucy, attacking Wagner back.

    Don't count Gold out either - she may have been 1/3 so far this season in the SP but this is the first time she's had a completely clean LP in competition and this is going to do two things:
    1) boost her confidence
    2) she will analyze what went RIGHT about the LP preparation and use that going forward to mentally prepare for each phase

    If she puts down a similar LP content to Nationals and gets a 55 PCS as Flatt Fan is suggesting (which, she got a 58 for a not great skate at RC, so I think she can get a 60+ with a clean LP if she hits in the SP), she'll still score at least a 120 with very stingy GOEs (5 total points in GOE). If she can hit on the SP like RC (which she is perfectly capable of doing), She'll be in the 180-190 range.

  5. #875
    she takes the audience on her journey of emotions Layfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.D. View Post
    Man...still in rehab after last night...how's that for craziness?

    Looking forward to Worlds - Wagner now has had TWO mediocre free skates in a row and might be losing her consistency. And to top it off, she still has no 3-3. Safe to say the world podium is slipping out of reach. She may be 4th again but she'll probably be looking at closer to 7th at this point.

    As for Gracie Gold - she is 1 for 3 in the short program...she has shown an inability to control her nerves in high-pressure situations...what's to make me think she can get it together in time for Worlds? The best freeskate in the world will get you almost nowhere on the World stage if you don't do your job in the SP, as Wagner found out last year.

    I hate to say it, but I think we'll be stuck with 2 spots for the second straight Winter Olympics...
    Maybe but that would most certainly be the outlook with any two combination of girls we could have sent this year. What does that tell you? Tells me the USA ladies deserves two spots. Let's hope Ashley and Gracie prove us wrong!

  6. #876
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    Quote Originally Posted by mskater93 View Post
    If she puts down a similar LP content to Nationals and gets a 55 PCS as Flatt Fan is suggesting (which, she got a 58 for a not great skate at RC, so I think she can get a 60+ with a clean LP if she hits in the SP), she'll still score at least a 120 with very stingy GOEs (5 total points in GOE). If she can hit on the SP like RC (which she is perfectly capable of doing), She'll be in the 180-190 range.
    Do you think she deserves 60+ for PCS?

    Young phenoms in the past don't break 60
    Miki in 2007 W championship where she actually WON the world
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9U76uPa8Ss

    Mao asada at 2007 gpf
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYJ_mG6Qvno

    Gracie is a mid 50 PCS kind of girl. Just because it's inflated to incredible level doesnt make it right.

  7. #877
    At the rink. Again. mskater93's Avatar
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    I am saying if an international panel gave her a 58 for a flawed FS, a 61 for a squeaky FS at NATIONALS isn't out of the question or truly inflated. In addition, you can't compare where scores were (average wise) in 2007 with now because PCS scores have been creeping upwards in general since the last Olympics. That same performance in 2012 would have scored MUCH higher in PCS than it did in 2007.

  8. #878
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    unfortunately to be it girl (sell products in u.s has you have to have face). i been told i was homely and ugly since i was born. i don't have the photographic/photogenic face . it helps in job interview, meeting with public, perception. they hold you in higher standard.help people watch you and overlook mistakes etc. sad but true--now with social media, internet, you tube etc. comments on looks, etc. shouldn't but does automatically consciously or unconsciously

    in my order of ranking of photographic/photgenic faces best top to worst last
    sorry but going into last half of this year/next year olympics.
    looks help.

    i
    1) alissa
    2)ashley
    3) gracie
    4) caroline
    5) mirai & christina
    6) rachel
    7) courtney
    8) agnes.
    didn't count senior ladies who hasn't skated in a senior event -went back to juniors.

  9. #879
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    Quote Originally Posted by mskater93 View Post
    I am saying if an international panel gave her a 58 for a flawed FS, a 61 for a squeaky FS at NATIONALS isn't out of the question or truly inflated. In addition, you can't compare where scores were (average wise) in 2007 with now because PCS scores have been creeping upwards in general since the last Olympics. That same performance in 2012 would have scored MUCH higher in PCS than it did in 2007.
    The reason I picked those performances was the age of the skaters then. They were "freshly" out of the junior circuit just like Gracie now. They didn't crack 60 as newbies even when they were phenoms and with tremendous reputation and expectation preceded them.

    PCS are still quite low for someone like Gao, Cesario, Hicks, etc... So I don't see how Gracie can get that kind of PCS (even at the national level)

    And just because they gave her 58 doesn't make it right. She's a mid 50 kind of gal. The good thing, I said again, is she can fix it. If they continue to inflate her PCS like this, she has no incentive to fix her package, and then when time comes, they will put her down for the likes of Mao, Caro, Yuna even when these girls are messy. It won't be pretty for her down the line. Fix it now.

  10. #880
    At the rink. Again. mskater93's Avatar
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    That is your opinion (that she's a mid-50s kind of gal), but her good performances are generating better scores that that (high 50s-60); she's all about the execution and if she doesn't execute the technical content, it will drop to the low-mid 50s (there's that string that ties a big TES to a bigger than expected PCS - it's that hard tech content that's completed well often drives up PCS). Even so, if she goes out and executes her technical content in the FS and gets say a 55 or 56 in PCS (as you believe she deserves), she'll be around 125 in the LP which, the last time I looked, is a pretty big score (her GOEs are hard to really reduce if she delivers; her technical BV is 60+ and she got 11 points in GOE at Nationals and that wasn't outrageous). If she also delivers in the SP, she'll score somewhere in the low 60s total there. A 185-190 is a pretty darn good first year score, even if your PCS is way lower than your TES because that's the aspect you're working on...which I would say is on the priority list of things "to do" for her since she's made a couple trips to Canton to work with Marina and her team this year on the SS aspects.

  11. #881
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    I have no doubt about her TES. Her PCS, I have big problem with. She is no where near the level of the phenoms, and the phenoms didn't get 60 in PCS for a long time.

  12. #882
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fairly4 View Post
    unfortunately to be it girl (sell products in u.s has you have to have face). i been told i was homely and ugly since i was born. i don't have the photographic/photogenic face . it helps in job interview, meeting with public, perception. they hold you in higher standard.help people watch you and overlook mistakes etc. sad but true--now with social media, internet, you tube etc. comments on looks, etc. shouldn't but does automatically consciously or unconsciously

    in my order of ranking of photographic/photgenic faces best top to worst last
    sorry but going into last half of this year/next year olympics.
    looks help.

    i
    1) alissa
    2)ashley
    3) gracie
    4) caroline
    5) mirai & christina
    6) rachel
    7) courtney
    8) agnes.
    didn't count senior ladies who hasn't skated in a senior event -went back to juniors.
    AW, gee. Couldn't you have just said that Alissa, Ashley, and Gracie are pretty, and stopped there?

  13. #883
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    AW, gee. Couldn't you have just said that Alissa, Ashley, and Gracie are pretty, and stopped there?
    Why is that better? You are still stating that the other women are not pretty, only implicitly. Also, why the cutoff at Gracie, mm?

  14. #884
    Keeper of the Kweens OGM. MK's Winter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brightphoton View Post

    Why is that better? You are still stating that the other women are not pretty, only implicitly. Also, why the cutoff at Gracie, mm?
    There is no reason to put in number order how pretty any skater is. I think any skater who will go out and do what they love for their country is beautiful.

  15. #885
    :) aftertherain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK's Winter View Post
    There is no reason to put in number order how pretty any skater is. I think any skater who will go out and do what they love for their country is beautiful.
    I don't mean to be cynical, but I definitely think it's way more for themselves than for their country. And who could fault them for that? Skating is expensive. Gotta love the sport to continue for years on end as well.

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