2012 Skate America Men's LP

**bekalc** · 10-21-2012, 12:06 AM

Originally Posted by FTnoona

I wonder if Hanyu would have done better if he went safe and done a 3S instead of a 4S. Those falls looked like it knocked the wind out of him.

Sometimes you have to fall in order to succeed. I think its a good idea for him to get use to both those quads now...He may need them at the Olympics.

**figuristka** · 10-21-2012, 12:08 AM

I didn't realize i got this on icenetwork as iam outside the US but managed to try and catch Kozuka, Abbott, and Hanyu. Shame i didn't check sooner. Love Hanyu but that wasn't a good skate. Perhaps getting that record for the short added to the pressure. Iam sure missing the quads takes alot of energy away especially with his asthma.

**FTnoona** · 10-21-2012, 12:09 AM

Originally Posted by bekalc

Sometimes you have to fall in order to succeed. I think its a good idea for him to get use to both those quads now...He may need them at the Olympics.

I agree that it's good that he stuck to the layout b/c he's gonna have to learn or condition himself to keep going with falls on the quads.

**bekalc** · 10-21-2012, 12:11 AM

Originally Posted by FTnoona

I agree that it's good that he stuck to the layout b/c he's gonna have to learn or condition himself to keep going with falls on the quads.

Exactly.. He can't not go for those jumps here and then expect they will magically be there at the Olympics/Worlds..

**herios** · 10-21-2012, 12:19 AM

Originally Posted by bekalc

Sometimes you have to fall in order to succeed. I think its a good idea for him to get use to both those quads now...He may need them at the Olympics.

Olympics is not like tomorrow. He has plenty of ime till then. The japanese field is deep and with Oda back, one of the big guys at the minimum will be left holding the bag. His first target sgould be making the national team again.

**gmyers** · 10-21-2012, 12:19 AM

There were several reasons brezina left his former coaches but there was open disagreement about changing of jumps depending on the competition. Brezina didn't want to

**herios** · 10-21-2012, 12:23 AM

Originally Posted by mikeko666

My problem is that Hanyu and Machida have about same PCS.

And Jeremy who was only 8th in the FS, outscored both of them in PCS

**Bluebonnet** · 10-21-2012, 12:31 AM

Originally Posted by herios

And Jeremy who was only 8th in the FS, outscored both of them in PCS

As it should be.

**Art&Sport** · 10-21-2012, 12:33 AM

Originally Posted by herios

And Jeremy who was only 8th in the FS, outscored both of them in PCS

Yes, plain as day that Jeremy could have won had he brung it, or at the least come in second had he recovered immediately and not had a melt down. If the jumps are not laid out wisely in his program, he has to fix that. Unbelievable that someone with his talent hasn't managed by this point to overcome the mental pressure.

Hanyu obviously needs more experience, and yes, Hanyu was over-scored in the sp, and over-scored in the fp too.

I do like Kozuka, so I'm happy for him. Machida has got a lot of talent. I am not partial to Menshov's skating; although he's very athletic, Menshov flails his arms too much, and he's not a polished skater. His PCS scores were OTT -- that's what I mean by politics playing a role.

**bekalc** · 10-21-2012, 12:33 AM

Originally Posted by herios

Olympics is not like tomorrow. He has plenty of ime till then. The japanese field is deep and with Oda back, one of the big guys at the minimum will be left holding the bag. His first target sgould be making the national team again.

When does he start doing the quad sal then? Now's the perfect time because its not Japanese nationals or Worlds. He can test it out and get use to it. If its not more consistent by Grand Prix final he can take it out for Japanese nationals. That jump gives him a huge advantage over most of the field But if he doesn't start doing it now. When?

As for Oda, if I'm the Japanese fed; he's the one likely holding the bag. All of the other guys have done a much better job of putting it together delivering at least a world medal for Team Japan whereas Oda's unable to count. In fact I think Oda's biggest weakness has been NOT committing to a jump layout and playing it safe way to many times.

So Hanyu placed second at Skate America-the world and his shot at the Grand Prix final didn't end.

Now is the time for Hanyu to find out what he can and cannot do. Perhaps a quad sal in the program too is to much for him. Better to find this out this season then next season. Better to find out at the GP than later on.. If he realizes he can't do it how much easier will things be for him psychologically next year. Thats what Tarasova did with Kulik a year before the Olympics she gave him a program way too difficult for him, and then gave him an easier one the next year. And Kulik won the Olympics..

Now's the time for Hanyu to put the quad sal in.

**Bluebonnet** · 10-21-2012, 12:49 AM

Poor Hanyu! With 10 points lead from SP but still lost over all.

**pangtongfan** · 10-21-2012, 01:19 AM

LOL at the idea one of Takahashi, Hanyu, or Kozuka will have to cede their spot on the World team for Oda. Oda is a has been, who frankly never achieved much of anything comparatively speaking to the others even in his prime. Even if Oda placed top 3 at Nationals I wouldnt be surprised if they still didnt send him to Worlds (and I doubt he will place top 3 at Nationals, even if Hanyu had a competition like here his SP would keep him above Oda overall I bet). Machida has a better chance of making the World team than Oda at this point, which is still virtually none. Those 3 are the team until after Sochi atleast.

**bibi24** · 10-21-2012, 01:23 AM

I watched a clip of Hanyu doing a 4S + 3A in exhibition, hopefully him and Orser will get better luck with it soon.

Originally Posted by bekalc

Thats what Tarasova did with Kulik a year before the Olympics she gave him a program way too difficult for him, and then gave him an easier one the next year. And Kulik won the Olympics...

Great call there!!