Last edited by Bluebonnet; 10-25-2012 at 12:21 PM.
I don't get why Tatsuki should be punished for doing something well rather than putting in subpar quad. He already got docked in the BV for attempting less difficult content. His SP was the highlight of the competition for me and in fact in the aftermath of the competition, I've actually watched his program more times on YouTube, even over Yuzuru's amazing one.
And Jeremy did outscore Tatsuki anyway in the BV, TES and overall, despite the bad quad attempt and low spin levels.
Last edited by Mrs. P; 10-25-2012 at 12:56 PM.
People will still do Quads if they were worth less for sloppy execution. One of the problems in 2010 was that the value of the Quad wasn't high enough in relation to everything else. That has been changed. A really good quad will now get you about 12 points, in comparison to only 4 points for a good Double Axel (similarly, for the Short Program, the value of the Quad in comparison to a Triple Flip is also considerably higher than it used to be). The other issue of underrotating a Quad has also been fixed; you don't get ridiculously hammered for it now like you did back then, unless you drastically underrotate it, and THAT was the biggest deterrent to people even trying the Quad during the past Olympic cycle.
Remember, falls and other big mistakes on jumps in the 6.0 judging system meant the jump was worth nothing in the eyes of the judges. And yet, the Quad was of utmost importance back then. People WILL do the Quad if it is worth a lot of points. BAD jumps should not be worth so many points as they currently are, though. Saying otherwise completely flies in the face of how the sport has always been judged and how most everyone WANTS to see it be judged.
Rewarding failures on difficult jumps moves the sport forward because, as others have said, it encourages athletes to perfect these moves through trial and error. I wouldn't mind seeing the ISU recalibrating the penalty for Worlds and Olympic competition to encourage clean skating over risk taking, but I'm happy to see the athletes take this risk during the GP.
Last edited by drivingmissdaisy; 10-25-2012 at 01:52 PM.
For what it's worth Tatsuki DID try a quad in the FS and got full credit for it (though he did fall)...so I don't see it as playing it safe. And he has a fantastic 3A -- nice height and there's no doubt he's going to land that jump. And we all know for some the 3A is more a menace than the quad!
One possible suggestion Mr. P had for the falls issue is perhaps docking the fall in base value.
Doris made an interesting point in the ice dance threads that skaters lose so many points in the BV in the pattern dances for not getting the key points, that they're better of getting the technical component even at the cost of getting more GOE.
I think part of the issue with falls, that relatively speaking falls, which is mainly docked in -GOE and in the overall programm, ranks less poorly than a UR, which gets docked in BV AND GOE. If a fall on quad would be equal to the UR quad in BV + the -GOE, then you are still rewarding the skater for trying it, but you're also sending the message that they're better off staying upright on the jump.
This idea probably has to be fleshed out...but to me it seems logical.
No scoring system should reward "trying." No scoring system should reward taking a risk but failing. (See definition of "risk" ) No scoring system should reward attempting to do something without success.
(That's my story and I'm sticking to it. )
To answer the thread topic it is far too early to make even an early assessment as many skaters havent even been seen yet. However excluding Chan who is not part of the actual "competition" for Worlds, but has already been awarded and coronated the gold medal even if he goes on a trip to Hawaii and chooses to not attend the World Championships, this is who I would rate those fighting for the silver, bronze, and all other postions down at Worlds so far:
1. Takahashi- very solid performances in his only outing so far.
2. Hanyu- will likely recover from his bombing at Skate America. Arguably is likely to beat Takahashi now if both skate well as he is technically stronger.
3. Plushenko- good first outing so will be a factor should he choose to compete at Worlds.
4. Kozuka- very good first outing, but seems to still not have scoring potential of others and requires mistakes from others to be up there.
5. Fernandez- shows potential but still needs major consistency improvements.
All we have to go on so far is last place marks for a bad skate at a cheesefest in Japan, and second place marks for a hot and cold Hanyu at Skate America.
Lets' see what happens as the new season progresses.