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Thread: Most powerful federation?

  1. #31
    Tripping on the Podium
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    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    Yuna is one of the world's richest female athletes and her sponsors mean a lot of money to the ISU.
    She's become rich after she won GP events and Worlds. Are there any Korean sponsors support ISU? Just curious. Heard that 60-70% of ISU events sponsors are Japanese companies.
    I think USA and Russia were the strongest federation in political, and most of ISU money came from USA. But now, Japan is in that role. So overall, USA-Japan-Russia-Canada.

  2. #32
    lowtherlore
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    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    Yuna is one of the world's richest female athletes and her sponsors mean a lot of money to the ISU.
    Not true. None of Yu-Na endorsed companies sponsor ISU events, except for Samsung who had sponsored CoC for some years in the past (it no longer does, AFAIK). Other than pushing its own PR campaign in a certain market, a sponsor for a specific event does not have direct politicking power to promote its compatriot federation or athletes.

    Korean federation? I bet it’s the weakest of them all that produced a world or Olympic champion. They couldn’t eke out a win for Yu-Na at the 2008 Worlds, at the 2011 Worlds, or even at the 2008 GPF in Korea (her only international competition at home to date, junior or senior), where at each event the call could have gone either way.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtherlore View Post
    Korean federation? I bet it’s the weakest of them all that produced a world or Olympic champion. They couldn’t eke out a win for Yu-Na at the 2008 Worlds, at the 2011 Worlds, or even at the 2008 GPF in Korea (her only international competition at home to date, junior or senior), where at each event the call could have gone either way.
    I think this is true, but I also think that the coaches play a big part of lobbying for the skaters as well. Most of the time the right skater wins despite politics, and I think this was the case in 2008 & 2011 WC and the 2010 Olys.

  4. #34
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtherlore View Post
    Korean federation? I bet it’s the weakest of them all that produced a world or Olympic champion. They couldn’t eke out a win for Yu-Na at the 2008 Worlds, at the 2011 Worlds, or even at the 2008 GPF in Korea (her only international competition at home to date, junior or senior), where at each event the call could have gone either way.
    I'm actually not sure this is true, as there have been a number of World champions who were not from big federations. In the past decade, they include Stephane Lambiel, DenStavs, and Savchenko & Szolkowy (and the latter did not have much support from their federation in their earlier years, due to Steuer's past). I don't know that the Chinese fed was all that powerful in Lulu's day, either - as some of her results would attest. Actually, they'e still not that strong.

    What makes Kim unique is that she was such a pioneering skater for her country (though the same could be said for Chen, too).

    If Fernandez can achieve top results for Spain, and it looks like he is on the way to accomplishing this, I think that could provide a serious boost to Spanish skating.

  5. #35
    lowtherlore
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    Quote Originally Posted by drivingmissdaisy View Post
    I think this is true, but I also think that the coaches play a big part of lobbying for the skaters as well. Most of the time the right skater wins despite politics, and I think this was the case in 2008 & 2011 WC and the 2010 Olys.
    No doubt coaches can play a big role in moulding a winner. And federations and coaches can have influence by reputation and inner-circle relationship on the CLOSELY contended matches. But, most of Yu-Na’s wins, junior or senior, were decisive. I don’t think any of her wins came from lobbying, either by her coach or by her federation. And I don't think her coaches, compatriot or foreign, or her federation, have been much of a factor in helping her win closely decided competitions by lobbying, either.

    I agree with your saying that most of the times the right skater wins despite politics. But we all know that there are as many instances where some skaters win with the help of politics -- especially when the stakes are major, which is especially bad for the sport because the major events are exposed to more viewers and potential new fans, who could turn indifferent. We have witnessed, with various sports, the adverse effects match/score fixing controversies can have on the sport in the long run.

  6. #36
    Simply the best. l'etoile's Avatar
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    I think Glam is misunderstanding the difference between personal endorsements Yuna has, and ISU sponsorships which coincidentally Japanese federation shares many of them with.
    Last edited by l'etoile; 10-31-2012 at 12:06 PM. Reason: unnecessary details.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtherlore View Post
    No doubt coaches can play a big role in moulding a winner. And federations and coaches can have influence by reputation and inner-circle relationship on the CLOSELY contended matches. But, most of Yu-Na’s wins, junior or senior, were decisive. I don’t think any of her wins came from lobbying, either by her coach or by her federation. And I don't think her coaches, compatriot or foreign, or her federation, have been much of a factor in helping her win closely decided competitions by lobbying, either.

    I agree with your saying that most of the times the right skater wins despite politics. But we all know that there are as many instances where some skaters win with the help of politics -- especially when the stakes are major, which is especially bad for the sport because the major events are exposed to more viewers and potential new fans, who could turn indifferent. We have witnessed, with various sports, the adverse effects match/score fixing controversies can have on the sport in the long run.
    I think you see more of an effect of politicking just outside the medals, where the placements are important for international assignments but people don't make much of a fuss because it doesn't impact the top of the leader board. This hurt skaters like Malinina and Czacko because they often finished behind skaters from bigger countries, even when they skated well.

  8. #38
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    by media/coverage, the US is still the best but the problem is the viewers aren't there as it used to be thus
    this sort of trying of revival back to the good old golden years' of US FS

    I'd rank:

    Canada
    Japan
    Russia
    USA
    Italy - Chinquanta
    China/Korea

  9. #39
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    I do find it intriguing that people think because Orser's Canadian he's really high ranked in the Canadian hierarchy. The only Canadian he coached was Cynthia Phaneuf and that was for a couple months (Nationals, 4CC, WTT). He's fairly international. If Orser is really THAT good at politicking, though, it would be an impressive feat.

    Otherwise, what Buttercup said.

  10. #40
    Custom Title EricRohmer's Avatar
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    Japan = USA = Canada = Russia > EU >>> China,Korea,Kazakhstan,Australia etc.

    In a grand frame, equilibrium of power between 4 federations.
    EU : european no.1~2 bonus

  11. #41
    Custom Title skateluvr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by drivingmissdaisy View Post
    I think you see more of an effect of politicking just outside the medals, where the placements are important for international assignments but people don't make much of a fuss because it doesn't impact the top of the leader board. This hurt skaters like Malinina and Czacko because they often finished behind skaters from bigger countries, even when they skated well.
    Re you referring to the very tiny thin Tatiana Malinina? I always felt she was undermarked. I cannot recall specific skates, but I loved her...how I wish she had a break. No question her scores would be better had she skated for US in the 90's or any skating power.

    Canada and Orser made Yuna into WC and Oly C. She made the perfect move at the right time. Amazing the luck all the way/along with talent. So sad for Orser it ended so poorly. I'd love to see Javier be his second WC. Javi is wonderful and belongs on podium with the best in the world.

  12. #42
    Custom Title EricRohmer's Avatar
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    It is interesting, thinking that back then Yuna‘s move to Orser was considered risky by many and was scoffed by a few.
    Not that Yuna went to OGM coach & IMG speaker which are Orser‘s present position.
    Last edited by EricRohmer; 11-01-2012 at 01:53 AM.

  13. #43
    Simply the best. l'etoile's Avatar
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    If Canada, which is not even Yuna's nationality, supposedly "made her champion," what does it say for the rest of the champions from US, Japan, Canada, or Russia? It would definitely be much easier for them to make their skaters champion, then they must have all earned their titles not with their skating, but witha push of their OWN strong federations. Even though it is a hard fact that figureskating is a political sport, to say a skater was backed by a federation other than their own is much far-fetched to say the least.

    Plus, Canada had Joannie as rising hope for their own champion in the meantime. It doesn't make any sense.

  14. #44
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    If Canada were so powerful then Chan would still be winning and Davis and White would be relegated clearly to second and that is NOT the case. Now if we were talking PR or media attention then the Japanese and American skaters would be the clearest faves.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by skateluvr View Post
    Re you referring to the very tiny thin Tatiana Malinina? I always felt she was undermarked. I cannot recall specific skates, but I loved her...how I wish she had a break. No question her scores would be better had she skated for US in the 90's or any skating power.

    Canada and Orser made Yuna into WC and Oly C. She made the perfect move at the right time. Amazing the luck all the way/along with talent. So sad for Orser it ended so poorly. I'd love to see Javier be his second WC. Javi is wonderful and belongs on podium with the best in the world.
    I wonder how Canada failed to make Orser OC in 1988 and how Canada chose a korean skater instead of its own Joanni.

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