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Thread: 2012 Cup of Russia Men FS.

  1. #106
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    MEN'S FREE SKATE - VIDEOS & RESULT (Updated)

    1. Patrick CHAN (CAN) - 262.35 Free Skate
    2. Takahiko KOZUKA (JPN) - 229.99
    3. Michal BREZINA (CZE) - 224.56
    4. Konstantin MENSHOV (RUS) - 223.72
    5. Nobunari ODA (JPN) - 217.92 Free Skate
    6. Richard DORNBUSH (USA) - 210.89
    7. Artur GACHINSKI (RUS) - 209.84
    8. Zhan BUSH (RUS) - 199.37
    9. Denis TEN (KAZ) - 177.77

  2. #107
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    I love Patrick's LP. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zM0i...1&feature=plcp
    He skates with a lot of freedom. And I don't get those who say he has no emotion. I thought he skated with a lot of passion. And I love his music. But you really can't go wrong with Puccini, can you?

  3. #108
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    Let's talk, please respect your own user name. I'm sure you understand the difference between "talk" and "attack". You have been attacking Patrick Chan, not talking about Chan or his programs. The very biased way of talking about a specific skater and lack of respect for other forum users is disgusting IMHO.

  4. #109
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    I have never liked Chan, especially last year. I didn't like his programs and the fact that he was winning everything with lots of mistakes and overscored PCS (please, I don't want to fight). And he was ruinining the competition, there was no fun watching when already knowing the winner. And he was very confident after each 3 or 4 falls program that he is going to win anyway because of his PCS. I am a Daisuke fan ( and this year I like all the japanese men), so Chan was the enemy. This year I first saw him at Japan Open with a poor skating and for my big surprise I kind of like his program and maybe I liked the fact that he didn't won and he got the right points. Then, at SC where I expected him to win with no doubts, I liked also his SP. And I also liked the fact that he didn't win, he didn't deserved it and it was Canada after all. So, I kind of sympathized with him. And I really but really disliked him last season. I still think his PCS are too high but I like his programs and costumes, he left a nice impression with the long today. Too bad for de double jumps but that shows that he is not perfect. I don't like jumping machines. They spoil the fun of competition.
    Unfortunately, my favourite, Daisuke, unlike last year, doesn't have very good programs. The SP is ok, but LP... I wanna kill Morozov for that. I had a bad feeling about it since I first heard they would work together. But I trusted Dai that he knows what he is doing and will not let Morozov tell him what to do, beacuse there is nothing he can teach him, maybe the opposite. Anyway, I worry for Daisuke this season. But if Chan will be better, than I have nothing to say. I just hope he will not win again everything, it's nice to share
    I am happy for Kozuka, I know he is always undescored, it is his curse and I don't know if it will ever change. But he is in GPF, he defeated Chan once, he should be happy. He skated well today, too bad for the quad, I like his LP, if he could just smile or do something with his face to join the beautiful expression of his body.
    I am sad for Oda. My dream was a final with Chan and 5 japanese skaters)
    I hoped Menshov would medal, he is not my type but I admire him for his perseverence and nice jumps at his age. I thought he deserved a medal,especially for being the best russian in competition. But... I am also happy for Brezina. I hope she will get better from now on.

  5. #110
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    Well PChan get tired of peoples complaining him about winning with falls and triple splats, so he goes to a new approach. Winning with doubles jumps and inflated PCS.
    Look on the bright side, 3 doubles jumps is a huge improvement from 3 falls. LOL Expect to see his PCS hit 100, by world.

  6. #111
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    What happened to Weir. I had a feeling in my gut that he might pull out but I didn't want to believe it.

    I'm more of Dai, Taka fan but Chan's programs are so jam packed with choreography and transitions that it's just hard not to notice. So minus the programs where he falls several times and maybe last years worlds I totally get how he can dominate. Also his overall ss are pretty stellar. He just has this effortless glide going on.

    Congrats to Chan and Taka
    Last edited by lavender; 11-10-2012 at 01:38 PM.

  7. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by IleK View Post
    I have never liked Chan, especially last year. I didn't like his programs and the fact that he was winning everything with lots of mistakes and overscored PCS (please, I don't want to fight). And he was ruinining the competition, there was no fun watching when already knowing the winner. And he was very confident after each 3 or 4 falls program that he is going to win anyway because of his PCS. I am a Daisuke fan ( and this year I like all the japanese men), so Chan was the enemy. This year I first saw him at Japan Open with a poor skating and for my big surprise I kind of like his program and maybe I liked the fact that he didn't won and he got the right points. Then, at SC where I expected him to win with no doubts, I liked also his SP. And I also liked the fact that he didn't win, he didn't deserved it and it was Canada after all. So, I kind of sympathized with him. And I really but really disliked him last season. I still think his PCS are too high but I like his programs and costumes, he left a nice impression with the long today. Too bad for de double jumps but that shows that he is not perfect. I don't like jumping machines. They spoil the fun of competition.
    Unfortunately, my favourite, Daisuke, unlike last year, doesn't have very good programs. The SP is ok, but LP... I wanna kill Morozov for that. I had a bad feeling about it since I first heard they would work together. But I trusted Dai that he knows what he is doing and will not let Morozov tell him what to do, beacuse there is nothing he can teach him, maybe the opposite. Anyway, I worry for Daisuke this season. But if Chan will be better, than I have nothing to say. I just hope he will not win again everything, it's nice to share
    I totally agree with you, and this is exactly how I felt last season about Chan, because, well, I'm an unforgiving Daisuke fan You first paragraph took the words right out of my mouth. I didn't like Chan winning everything when sometimes I didn't think the win was justified. However, I never hated Chan, and this season I find myself liking him a little bit more. Still not a fan, but I can appreciate his skating. His free skate is very good this season, and he no question deserved to win this competition.

    Daisuke's programs aren't bad, he had a lot to live up to after his magnificent programs last year. I actually like his SP a alot, but I think his free skate is just okay. I guess my problem with it, is that it seems like a program and music that anyone could skate to, whereas Blues I felt was something only Dai could pull off so magnificently. To me it seems "average", and Daisuke is far better than that. I can only wish him the best.

  8. #113
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    MEN'S FREE SKATE - VIDEOS & RESULT (Updated)

    1. Patrick CHAN (CAN) - 262.35 Free Skate
    2. Takahiko KOZUKA (JPN) - 229.99 Free Skate
    3. Michal BREZINA (CZE) - 224.56 Free Skate
    4. Konstantin MENSHOV (RUS) - 223.72
    5. Nobunari ODA (JPN) - 217.92 Free Skate, 2nd Copy
    6. Richard DORNBUSH (USA) - 210.89 Free Skate, 2nd Copy
    7. Artur GACHINSKI (RUS) - 209.84 Free Skate
    8. Zhan BUSH (RUS) - 199.37
    9. Denis TEN (KAZ) - 177.77 Free Skate
    Last edited by Mao88; 11-10-2012 at 06:09 PM.

  9. #114
    Spending too much time at the arena CdnSkateWatcher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    You also conveniently forgot to count falls and hands down, step outs or edge calls, which you are very capable of counting when it is Patrick Chan who made those mistakes. None of the above can be reflected in the BV but there were plenty of those tonight. Chan's GOE is high in part because he made no deductible error whereas other skaters made several in their programs, including at least one fall from each of the top 5. Therefore, GOE in these cases are objective in that they properly reflected the deductible errors that have to be considered and a fall on jump usually produces around -3 for GOE, about 99% of the time.

    What you are doing is quoting the protocol out of the context, in your very deliberate attempt to continue your infamous "Chanflation" allegation. Unfortunately for you, the vast majority of members here are quite knowledgeable. People here know for example, when Kozuka UR both of his Quads, including a fall on one of them, he may have relatively high BV for those attempts but he would also rightfully receive lesser GOE, plus a mandatory deduction that is not being reflected in the BV. So yes, you could make an argument his overall program was more difficult but it remains a paper tiger if he can't land them properly. I could load a program with Quad Flip, Quad Lutz and other Quads and my BV would look superb - only if it were so easy.

    I don't know if you realize it but your continuous outrageous and verbal assaults on Patrick Chan has turned many otherwise ambivalent members who were previously indifferent re: Chan to sympathize with him. The fictional outrage really isn't working very well because people aren't stupid. Not a single soul here has contested the result but you can somehow dig the BV in an attempt to create a controversy when there is none to be found. Take my advice, just let it go, otherwise very soon, no one is going to take your posts seriously.
    Last edited by Mathman; 11-10-2012 at 03:42 PM. Reason: Fix quote.

  10. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by let`s talk View Post
    Surely when the skater doesn't challenge top class elements like 3A and ends up with double jumps, it's quite easy to get high GOE for safe elements.
    Although...Patrick got only 0.13 for his safe 2A, 0.13 for his safe 2LO and 0.30 for his safe 2S. If the jump's not there, no need to play macho man by forcing a 3A<< and falling.

    Where he got his big GOEs was from his 4T+3T (2.14) and his solo 4T (2.71). No other skater did a quad combo, so I don't think we can say that Patrick backed away from the competition, even with the unsuccessful triple Axel.
    Last edited by Mathman; 11-10-2012 at 03:59 PM.

  11. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by let`s talk View Post
    It doesn't work like that. Kozuka's UR on quads IS reflected in BV as any UR or downgrades. That's what BV is about. And yeah, I am sure the majority of members here know that, unlike you . So, your attempt to call the opponent some unknowledgeable idiot ended up with looking at the mirror.
    Sorry to say that you've totally misinterpreted Wallylutz's original meaning. I don't blame you. I, myself, often misinterprete posts, too.

    The BV could explain something but it could not bring the whole picture. As Wallylutz and many have already explained in details, in this case, it doesn't stand well by using only BV on arguing at which position the skaters, particularly Patrick, as you were aiming, should be.
    Last edited by Bluebonnet; 11-10-2012 at 06:10 PM.

  12. #117
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    Oh, dear, look at Gachinski so far down on the list. This really hasn't been a good competition for Russian singles skaters, has it.

  13. #118
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    Congratulations to Chan, Kozuka, and Brezina! Very happy for Brezina! Chan and Kozuka (also Machida) are on to the GPF! Yay!!!!!!

    I have to say that I don't understand some of Kozuka's interpretation for the music. He often leaves the music aside and does something irrelevant. Deedee, you are right to worry about Kozuka's PCS because I think he's going to continue to get hammered on PCS based on this kind of music, interpretation, and choreography.

    On the contrary, Patrick's music is magnetic! He skated with a lot of passion! Though I think Wilson's choreography was not perfect. Too many places with the same arm movements. But good enough to stand out in the crowd! Huge PCS, and rightfully earned! Too many double jumps in his skating but oh, well, there is always next time. Glad he didn't lose his quad jumps. He wants to improve artistically. He has improved.

    Haven't watched other skatings yet. Can't comment them.

  14. #119
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    Patrick's program is absolutely stunning. The big sweeping movements that go with the big sweeping music are perfect for him as a skater with his incredible speed and effortless flow across the ice. The whole thing just comes together beautifully.

    He seems to be on track to peak later in the season (as he should), and I can't wait. He's never been an early season skater but each performance has been better than the last and I have high hopes that he'll have all of the technical down in a couple of months.

  15. #120
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    Patrick usually has his own agenda and schedule. He wanted to improve the artistry and he is bringing it and converting critics. In the CBC interview he said his goal for this event was to lay down the quads and so he did. With that in his pocket, next is to work on the later section of the program. Step by step, he is on his way to bringing us two amazing programs in late season.

    Good work, Patrick. Stay on track.

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