Page 7 of 12 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 LastLast
Results 91 to 105 of 178

Thread: 2012 TEB Men's Long Programs LP

  1. #91
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    996
    Quote Originally Posted by bixby View Post
    I know. Had he at least completed the last triple he might have enough to win. Doubles are for novice... what's wrong with him. Such a head case!!!
    See my immediately preceding post. What's the point of being mad at Jeremy? IT is what it is. You might as well be more mad at the fact he's injured, and the fact he isn't getting any younger, and the fact that trying to perfect the quad actually takes a lot out of skaters to the point of harming their ability to perform clean programs and be consistent on all of their jumps.

  2. #92
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Toronto, On
    Posts
    1,799
    Quote Originally Posted by Art&Sport View Post
    I'm a Jeremy fan too, but only sad for him, not mad. As you can see from my previous post, it's fairly upsetting to see someone as uber-talented as Jeremy unable to break through consistently due to nerves mainly, and now apparently coupled with physical problems (age becoming a factor as well). There's no point in being mad at him though. Things are what they are, and we can only hope for better. If it never happens for him the way we think it should, then that's the way it goes.

    But, of course, it doesn't seem to make any logical sense in the universe that skaters like Mura, Machida, Oda and Menshov are such more confident and talented jumpers but possess none of Jeremy's magical artistic gifts. Why can't Jeremy combine technical confidence and precision with his naturally superb artistry??? Such a conundrum -- I'm gob-smacked.

    Actually, I can't help but kinda partly blame the insistence and obsessiveness with quad, as well as CoP's dumbing down the importance of artistry in fs.
    Age is a factor? Think about that Menshow is 29.

  3. #93
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    3,008
    Quote Originally Posted by herios View Post
    Age is a factor? Think about that Menshow is 29.
    Not everybody is the same. I think Jeremy does show that he's losing jumping abilities he had before. So in this case, I agree that he shouldn't focus on quad jumps any more.
    Last edited by Bluebonnet; 11-17-2012 at 11:29 AM.

  4. #94
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    996
    Quote Originally Posted by herios View Post
    Age is a factor? Think about that Menshow is 29.
    Well you zeroed in on "age is a factor," and looked at none of the other points I made. Menshov is a one-dimensional skater, who even though he can land the jumps, he never looks pretty doing it. Menshov looks like a "wannabe" even against Oda. Both Oda and Menshov have the jumps, but the difference is at the least Oda has great smoothness and ice coverage, even if Oda lacks top-notch presentation skills, whereas Menshov has nothing but the jumps. Give me a break -- Menshov without the jumps would roll into last place precisely, as the rest of his skills are sorely lacking. Forget about age -- he seems ageless as far as the jumps, but the jumps are his only asset. So what!
    Last edited by Art&Sport; 11-17-2012 at 11:31 AM.

  5. #95
    Banned
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Japan
    Posts
    2,188
    ...and no one is talking about the winner of TEB. Mura got ignored.

    Never mind.

  6. #96
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    160
    Jeremy seems to aged rather quickly by the look on his face. His body looks the same but his face has sagging fatness to it.

  7. #97
    Custom Title plushyfan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    2,677
    Quote Originally Posted by Art&Sport View Post

    But, of course, it doesn't seem to make any logical sense in the universe that skaters like Mura, Machida, Oda and Menshov are such more confident and talented jumpers but possess none of Jeremy's magical artistic gifts. Why can't Jeremy combine technical confidence and precision with his naturally superb artistry??? Such a conundrum -- I'm gob-smacked.

    ETA:
    Actually, I can't help but kinda partly blame TPTB insistence and obsessiveness with quad, as well as CoP's dumbing down the importance of artistry in fs.
    Look at their body types..I no wonder...

    ----------

    And you don't forget, this is a sport, a competition.

  8. #98
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    403
    I do, actually. Especially at Nationals, where both Weir and Lysacek have had training and competition setbacks. It makes no sense to put in a quad if you can't even fully rotate triples, let alone not be able to rotate a quad consistently.

    Jeremy just needs to get back to basics. Get those triple passes first, then work on the Lvl 3 or 4 spins, and then the quad.

    He won the short program handedly at TEB without needing a quad, and he could have done it again in the free program at TEB too. With his prowess in PCS, a quad-less program with clean triples and triple-triple combinations can put him on the podium, while everyone else becomes a technical mess trying to put in a quad and not addressing the rest of their skating.

    That's the problem with the quad nowadays. It has turned every program into a mistake-ridden mess where skaters neglect the rest of their skating for the sake of one jump element.

  9. #99
    skating philosopher Mrs. P's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    The land of Agent Dale Cooper
    Posts
    8,590
    Quote Originally Posted by let`s talk View Post
    ...and no one is talking about the winner of TEB. Mura got ignored.

    Never mind.
    Noooo! Mura was great! I won't ignore him! I will curse him for ruining my predictions But I will express joy that he won!

    ETA: Seriously, though. He was quite impressive. I looooved his jumps. He has such a pretty quad and 3A -- great height and flow out of the jump. It's been awesome to discover all these Japanese skaters that I haven't really looked at much in the past...
    Last edited by Mrs. P; 11-17-2012 at 11:39 AM.

  10. #100
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    996
    Quote Originally Posted by let`s talk View Post
    ...and no one is talking about the winner of TEB. Mura got ignored.

    Never mind.
    Never mind is right!

    Mura is okay and obviously not as bad as Menshov. I'm pretty sure that the sport would never go so far as to have Menshov actually winning gold in a field like this even. His PCS would have to keep him down, whereas they give Mura not so bad PCS. I think Mura as a young skater has way more opportunity to improve his presentation skills than Menshov will ever be capable of accomplishing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    Not everybody is the same. I think Jeremy does show that he's losing jumping abilities he had before. So in this case, I agree that he shouldn't focus on quad jumps any more.
    I agree that not everybody is the same when it comes to aging and physical abilities. Look at Plushenko who just has a strong will that overcomes his physical decline. Not the same with Johnny, who has admitted as much. Your mind might be willing, but your body doesn't always go along. Same thing goes for dancers and athletes in other sports.

  11. #101
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    160
    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    Noooo! Mura was great! I won't ignore him! I will curse him for ruining my predictions But I will express joy that he won!

    ETA: Seriously, though. He was quite impressive. I looooved his jumps. He has such a pretty quad and 3A -- great height and flow out of the jump. It's been awesome to discover all these Japanese skaters that I haven't really looked at much in the past...
    I enjoyed Mura... he was great. He reminds me of the guy at the end of Twilight Saga: Breaking Dawn, Part 2.

  12. #102
    Custom Title LRK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    2,194
    Quote Originally Posted by draqq View Post
    I do, actually. Especially at Nationals, where both Weir and Lysacek have had training and competition setbacks. It makes no sense to put in a quad if you can't even fully rotate triples, let alone not be able to rotate a quad consistently.

    Jeremy just needs to get back to basics. Get those triple passes first, then work on the Lvl 3 or 4 spins, and then the quad.

    He won the short program handedly at TEB without needing a quad, and he could have done it again in the free program at TEB too. With his prowess in PCS, a quad-less program with clean triples and triple-triple combinations can put him on the podium, while everyone else becomes a technical mess trying to put in a quad and not addressing the rest of their skating.

    That's the problem with the quad nowadays. It has turned every program into a mistake-ridden mess where skaters neglect the rest of their skating for the sake of one jump element.
    The Nationals I was slightly unsure about, but I'm perfectly willing to "give you that", so to speak - especially as I'm not sure about US men. (Who has a reliable quad anyway? Joshua Farris?)

    But 4CC was what I was really wondering about. Worlds', frankly, I don't think there's any chance without a quad - or, at least, I hope so! as otherwise it would mean that it was a dismal splatfest, as we know most of the top guys will be going for quads.

  13. #103
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    2,376
    To me it's obvious that the US men need some help big time at the moment. Jeremy is not reliable and all the other US men have been disappointing this season. Weir and Lysacek are not the answer though at least with Evan you know he will usually lay down a good skate and is a fighter. But the others are either headcases or just don't have it. Which means looking to the Junior ranks for the future. Farris should have gotten two assignments because he could not do any worse then what we have seen this season plus he needs the experience. But the US men are lacking right now.

  14. #104
    Tripping on the Podium
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    57
    The 3A seems to have given Abbott problems a while, which is a shame because he used to have such a difficult entrance into it. That should be priority one to fix. The 3A's back to back could be such a beautiful moment, but at this point, I don't believe it's something he can achieve reliably, especially halfway through the program as they are. Since his quad tends to be under rotated, he desperately needs the points from the 3As.

    I'm so happy for Mura! For a while, I thought he was terribly deserving of a GP and it disappointed me that he had so few chances to get one. I hope he skates more confidently from now on! I think his FP has the best music and theme of the Japanese men this year.

  15. #105
    Custom Title LRK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    2,194
    Quote Originally Posted by Art&Sport View Post
    Never mind is right!

    Mura is okay and obviously not as bad as Menshov. I'm pretty sure that the sport would never go so far as to have Menshov actually winning gold in a field like this even. His PCS would have to keep him down, whereas they give Mura not so bad PCS. I think Mura as a young skater has way more opportunity to improve his presentation skills than Menshov will ever be capable of accomplishing.
    Er, what in the world has Menshov to do with Mura? So, all you can come up with is that Mura isn't as bad as Menshov?!? Honestly, that's a bit "thick". Yes, I know you were talking about Menshov earlier - but that has nothing to do with Mura, nor his performance here today.

    So, I for my part will say again: Congratulations Mura! And well done to him!

Page 7 of 12 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •