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Thread: Was Suzuki twice a victim of underscoring and pageantry in PCS?

  1. #61
    Custom Title demarinis5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    All I know is, now that we've had the chance to see Akiko's program on TV here in the eastern U.S., that's an awfully impressive second-place performance! She was magnificent, easily the best in the long program.
    This!

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    I think the judges also give you some extra credit if you are doing a triple-triple, boost your PCS, and in general are more generous in your scores.
    This absolutely should not happen. More difficult 3-3's are a TES achievement, not a PCS one. The ISU has got to figure out a way to properly reward difficult combinations instead of leaving it to the judges to add points somewhere else where they see fit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by drivingmissdaisy View Post
    This absolutely should not happen. More difficult 3-3's are a TES achievement, not a PCS one. The ISU has got to figure out a way to properly reward difficult combinations instead of leaving it to the judges to add points somewhere else where they see fit.
    The way the judges score PCS is ridiculous in many respects. I criticized them as well for scoring all 5 program component categories the same way and same order from skater to skater, even though some skaters are stronger in some and weaker in others, but then was told the judges are told to do this and are punished if they vary too much. That is ridiculous. Someone like Sasha Cohen for instance not only got the best scores in things like interpretation and performance, but a category like skating skills where she is mediocre. Someone like Chan not only gets great scores in skating skills and transitions but in interpretation and performance where he isnt far and away the greatest by any stretch, even when he has sloppy performances with mistakes.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by drivingmissdaisy View Post
    This absolutely should not happen. More difficult 3-3's are a TES achievement, not a PCS one. The ISU has got to figure out a way to properly reward difficult combinations instead of leaving it to the judges to add points somewhere else where they see fit.
    I don't think 3-3 brings much PCS adavantage. Some skaters who do a 3-3 get lower PCS than they deserve, for example Juulia Turkkila. I don't think she or anyone should do a 3t-3t in their LP if they only have one or two other triples. Now she has to fill the other six passes with triple salchows and doubles.

  5. #65
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    Mao Asada landed 3 triples in her FS---she doubled 3 other intended triples. Yet she got a higher SS score for the FS than she did for the SP. My biggest gripe is Mao's 8.14 for IN. There was little if any interpretation in her FS. In fact, she rivaled Nagasu for the most blank-faced FS performance of the competition.

    OTOH, Suzuki landed 6 triples (her final 3lo was <), and her "bird" interpretation was wonderful. Yet she got a grudging 7.82 in IN for what was for me (and apparently for the audience) the best performance of the night.

    Even Mao seemed shocked and embarrassed by her win.

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    Dont you get most of the value for a < under the new rules anyway, while only losing most for a <<. In that case Suzuki still had 7 triple or more like 6.5 half. I am surprised the gap in their TES wasnt even bigger as well. Mao must have outscored on spins and spirals.

  7. #67
    Custom Title ks777's Avatar
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    no. I also think she is overrated as well. She needs to work on all of her spins. Her spins are so UGLY that I can't get into her programs. Her camel is one of the worst at this level. I don't like her arms through out her programs either.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by ks777 View Post
    no. I also think she is overrated as well. She needs to work on all of her spins. Her spins are so UGLY that I can't get into her programs. Her camel is one of the worst at this level. I don't like her arms through out her programs either.
    Are you referring to Asada or Suzuki?

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Are you referring to Asada or Suzuki?
    I believe she is talking about Suzuki, since she is affirming that she did not think Suzuki was a victim of underscoring.

  10. #70
    Custom Title ks777's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Are you referring to Asada or Suzuki?
    Of course I was talking about Suzuki. I don't know anyone with uglier camel..

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by ks777 View Post
    Of course I was talking about Suzuki. I don't know anyone with uglier camel..
    Kira Ivanova:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDT8ucTwPh0
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dc6neZWi05w
    Last edited by pangtongfan; 11-26-2012 at 03:56 PM.

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    I think Suzuki was rather overmarked after last year's NHK trophy. Since Ando is skipping the whole season and Murakami has bombed badly at COC, the JSF needed to promote Suzuki as #2 for saving worlds spots. NHK trophy (known for its home favoritism) was the most suitable place to do that. Suzuki was blessed with more luck at GPF. I don't think she was given that generous scores if Asada was actually competing. Suzuki was very useful when Asada was absent or faltered. But she was never recognized as #1 Japanese woman. Despite her higher status on WS and Nice worlds than Asada, Suzuki was treated as #2 at Japan Open (earlier starting order). Her treatment at SC shows little respect to a world medalist. Rather, Murakami's not-so-bad performance there reduced Suzuki's value as the worlds spots saver. Suzuki's position hasn't improved because the JSF doesn't want to make her a serious threat to Asada. As a result, they stopped overmarking of Suzuki.
    Last edited by NMURA; 11-26-2012 at 04:58 PM.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by ks777 View Post
    no. I also think she is overrated as well. She needs to work on all of her spins. Her spins are so UGLY that I can't get into her programs. Her camel is one of the worst at this level. I don't like her arms through out her programs either.
    I am with you on Suzuki's camel spin, and generally her spins are a little on the slow side. What I simply cannot agree with you on is the use of her arms, which I think is exquisite- and the notion that she is overmarked. Suzuki is, to me, a beautiful skater with 'it' and I think she should be Japan's number 1 lady at this point in time.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by NMURA View Post
    I think Suzuki was rather overmarked after last year's NHK trophy. Since Ando is skipping the whole season and Murakami has bombed badly at COC, the JSF needed to promote Suzuki as #2 for saving worlds spots. NHK trophy (known for its home favoritism) was the most suitable place to do that. Suzuki was blessed with more luck at GPF. I don't think she was given that generous scores if Asada was actually competing. Suzuki was very useful when Asada was absent or faltered. But she was never recognized as #1 Japanese woman. Despite her higher status on WS and Nice worlds than Asada, Suzuki was treated as #2 at Japan Open (earlier starting order). Her treatment at SC shows little respect to a world medalist. Rather, Murakami's not-so-bad performance there reduced Suzuki's value as the worlds spots saver. Suzuki's position hasn't improved because the JSF doesn't want to make her a serious threat to Asada. As a result, they stopped overmarking of Suzuki.
    LOL so blunt but probably all true. People might not like your various theories but every single one, especialy relating to any Japanese skaters, I have ever read was right, including the one about Ando's scores (to my dismay) in 2011. I like Akiko but it looks like tough sledding for her from here. Her only real option at this point is to probably skate so lights out and well the judges have no choice, but if she had any illusions after last years Worlds she was the new Japanese #1 and would get that kind of backing from the Japanese fed., she was gravely mistaken it seems. I feel sorry for her as one would think she earned that respect, but apparently not. Maybe they just dont feel she has the gold potential of the likes of Asada and Ando, and I know their popularity is insane at home, that is probably another reason they want one of them as their #1 at all times.
    Last edited by pangtongfan; 11-26-2012 at 10:59 PM.

  15. #75
    Custom Title christinaskater's Avatar
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    Last year she removed that ugly camel spin but she brought it back to life. I wish she would remove it.

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