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Thread: 2012 GPF Ladies' Short Program

  1. #91
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    Hard to pick the winner among the top four. Mao's SP was not impressive. Akiko did great in jumps! Ashley was very well all around. Korpi's skating was beautiful and dreamy. I prefer Ashley. Wish all of them good luck tomorrow!

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by calstudent View Post
    Well you can't judge a program by what she doesn't do but by what she does. After all, we are talking hours worth of music and dancing condensed to 4 minutes. I think she is using every note of the music, bringing something different after every music cut and Mao has a lyrical, balletic style to begin with. I do concede that Mao somewhat lacked energy at the NHK trophy after making numerous mistakes on her jumps.

    But I understand where you're coming from. I love Swan Lake too =]
    The problem is that she does so little with the music. Yes, I understand she's trying to put the ballet into 4 minutes. But I'm not sure what she's trying to do with the music. Is she trying to tell the story? Is she trying to portray a character from the ballet? Or she just wants to hop around and look pretty in a feather-motifed dress?

    Swan Lake is intensely passionate and full of high drama (the curse, love, pledge/vow, betrayal, etc. etc. etc.), yet there's no passion or intensity in her program. She could be skating to any other music, and it won't make a particle of difference to her program. That's what I mean by "what she doesn't do with the music." And that's why I dislike certain skaters who skate over whatever music that happens to be playing in the background.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirunna View Post
    They DID marked her 3F as UR in China, 3 out of 3. And while her 3Flip was questionable today, her 3Loop was good
    IIRC, one of her 3Lo combination (2Lo, I guess) looked UR, but didn't get <. And her 3F in the SP at NHK...
    You're right, Mirunna. Her 3Lo was great today

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadia01 View Post
    The problem is that she does so little with the music. Yes, I understand she's trying to put the ballet into 4 minutes. But I'm not sure what she's trying to do with the music. Is she trying to tell the story? Is she trying to portray a character from the ballet? Or she just wants to hop around and look pretty in a feather-motifed dress?

    Swan Lake is intensely passionate and full of high drama (the curse, love, pledge/vow, betrayal, etc. etc. etc.), yet there's no passion or intensity in her program. She could be skating to any other music, and it won't make a particle of difference to her program. That's what I mean by "what she doesn't do with the music." And that's why I dislike certain skaters who skate over whatever music that happens to be playing in the background.
    Not every program has to tell a story. Yes, it's skated to Swan Lake and Mao doesn't take complete advantage of the highs and the lows of the Swan Lake ballet but she took the music from the ballet and created a program that is beautiful and quite artistic.

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadia01 View Post
    Maybe they decided that they don't need the jump to win so they all deleted it from their repertoire? Makes sense, esp. for those getting e on 3Lz.
    Ashley has not been attempting 3Lz in SP since the 3Lo's base value was increased as she is more likely to get a higher score on a well-exected 3Lo than on a 3Lz (e)

  6. #96
    Custom Title Nadia01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by calstudent View Post
    Not every program has to tell a story. Yes, it's skated to Swan Lake and Mao doesn't take complete advantage of the highs and the lows of the Swan Lake ballet but she took the music from the ballet and created a program that is beautiful and quite artistic.
    No it doesn't. You're right.

    But there's no point in using music that so many are familiar with and does...whatever she does. I don't understand what she is trying to do on the ice. I don't see artistry, but rather lazy interpretation of the program and music. It would've been better if she selected a piece without any well-known story or characters and created a program.

    And to make another point -- the music was composed specifically for the ballet. It's not like people decided to grab a bunch of pieces by Tchaikovsky and dance to them (compare this to: Swan by Saint-Saëns, which was never meant to be a dance/ballet piece, or non-narrative Les Sylphides which is danced to a collection of compositions by Chopin, which were never meant to be ballet music). So to me, it's an odd thing to pick Swan Lake, a piece w/ such a strong story & intent to tell the story and yet do none of those things and just skate around aimlessly w/o any attempt at character portrayal or storytelling, while wearing a swan dress. I do not understand what artistic point Mao is trying to make at all, or if she ever had any artistic intent to this particular program. I like it far less than her Vancouver LP or Debussy.

    ETA: I should add that this doesn't mean Mao's good skating qualities are not noticeable or gone. They're still there, but again, they don't serve the program because of the weakness in the program from my point of view.
    Last edited by Nadia01; 12-07-2012 at 10:58 AM.

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadia01 View Post
    No it doesn't. You're right.

    But there's no point in using music that so many are familiar with and does...whatever she does. I don't understand what she is trying to do on the ice. I don't see artistry, but rather lazy interpretation of the program and music. It would've been better if she selected a piece without any well-known story or characters and created a program.

    And to make another point -- the music was composed specifically for the ballet. It's not like people decided to grab a bunch of pieces by Tchaikovsky and dance to them (compare this to: Swan by Saint-Saëns, which was never meant to be a dance/ballet piece, or non-narrative Les Sylphides which is danced to a collection of compositions by Chopin, which were never meant to be ballet music). So to me, it's an odd thing to pick Swan Lake, a piece w/ such a strong story & intent to tell the story and yet do none of those things and just skate around aimlessly w/o any attempt at character portrayal or storytelling, while wearing a swan dress. I do not understand what artistic point Mao is trying to make at all, or if she ever had any artistic intent to this particular program. I like it far less than her Vancouver LP or Debussy.
    I think we've come to a point where we should agree to disagree because clearly we have different ideas on the nature of an artistic achievement. Yes, I can see your point but at the same time, it doesn't convince me because what you are saying is there can only be one way to interpret Swan Lake, the way Tchaikovsky wanted in the first place, and I'm saying it doesn't have to be. Swan Lake is a wonderful score and most people that do not even know the storyline or understand the psyche of the characters that the music is portraying recognize and appreciate the beauty of the music. Mao does a great job of picking up on the notes, incorporating beautiful moves and creating a wholesome program that captures Mao's light and lyrical skating style.

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadia01 View Post
    No it doesn't. You're right.

    But there's no point in using music that so many are familiar with and does...whatever she does. I don't understand what she is trying to do on the ice. I don't see artistry, but rather lazy interpretation of the program and music. It would've been better if she selected a piece without any well-known story or characters and created a program.

    And to make another point -- the music was composed specifically for the ballet. It's not like people decided to grab a bunch of pieces by Tchaikovsky and dance to them (compare this to: Swan by Saint-Saëns, which was never meant to be a dance/ballet piece, or non-narrative Les Sylphides which is danced to a collection of compositions by Chopin, which were never meant to be ballet music). So to me, it's an odd thing to pick Swan Lake, a piece w/ such a strong story & intent to tell the story and yet do none of those things and just skate around aimlessly w/o any attempt at character portrayal or storytelling, while wearing a swan dress. I do not understand what artistic point Mao is trying to make at all, or if she ever had any artistic intent to this particular program. I like it far less than her Vancouver LP or Debussy.

    ETA: I should add that this doesn't mean Mao's good skating qualities are not noticeable or gone. They're still there, but again, they don't serve the program because of the weakness in the program from my point of view.
    So, just out of curiosity, do you feel the same way about Meryl and Charlie's SD this year?

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by calstudent View Post
    So, just out of curiosity, do you feel the same way about Meryl and Charlie's SD this year?
    I don't watch ice dance so I can't comment on it.

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadia01 View Post
    I don't watch ice dance so I can't comment on it.
    That never stopped some people! But good for you for sticking with what you know!

  11. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadia01 View Post
    I don't watch ice dance so I can't comment on it.
    Do let me know if you come across their SD to Giselle. It'd be interesting to see how you might take on their masterpiece this season.

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by calstudent View Post
    So, just out of curiosity, do you feel the same way about Meryl and Charlie's SD this year?
    No, it's a PR worker for Yuna's comeback, applied to Mao only. All the rest can skate Swan Lake, others ballets ...

    Hey, almost all dance music was created for dancing on the floor. What fs is supposed to do in that case... Jeez...

  13. #103
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    I'm thrilled to see Akiko in the top three after the SP instead of further behind. I like her spunk and this program has many cool features or choreo - just still not loving the music cuts but love the energy she brings to it.

    Mao's a great skater - this program is cute and light and it is fun to see her in that 'character' but it isn't my favorite SP this season or from her.

    Didn't watch Kiri yet - but, I'm just over the moon with Ashley's SP. I think her loop exit looked a little tight, but overall, I really love the choreo on this, love, love, love her confidence, love the way she takes her time with the elements, and love the falling leaf and stag jumps after the axel and loop. Looking forward to the LPs

  14. #104
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    I made a bit of comparison between Ashley's and Mao's SPs and here's the result:
    Jumps Mao 18.21/Ashley 18.58
    Spins Mao 11.11/Ashley 11.27
    Steps Mao 5.70/Ashley 5.10
    So, we can see that Mao won the TES basically because of the StSq!
    And, Mao's PCS was higher (and this is fair, I think). So, this SP is an example of how important the steps/artistic part are now!

  15. #105
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    Top 3 are secure unless someone has a disaster.

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