2012 GPF Men's Free Skate LP | Page 11 | Golden Skate

2012 GPF Men's Free Skate LP

FlattFan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jan 4, 2010
Thinking of Javi winning the free skate, but still landing off the podium - how often does this happen? not very often, I'm guessing? Still, I suppose he'll get a small gold medal for the free - do they have separate small ceremonies at the GPF? - in which case Liza will have a small silver also, which thought would console me somewhat...

Miki Ando at the 2011 GPF. She won the LP, but was 5th overall.
 

figuristka

Medalist
Joined
Dec 15, 2003
I admire Patrick for improving artistically, as he is really looking like he feels the music more, but my dream is he also works with Brian, and Yuzuru and Javi on a quad salchow too. Must be such an advantage to train with other top skaters ;)
 

kimganos

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 9, 2012
My what great performances by Yuzuru and Javi. I was not expecting that. I still felt Yuzuru had the best skate overall. He showed alot more expression than at NHK. What a great talent he is. Last season i could watch his Romeo and juliet program over and over. I think javi was great getting 3 quads but i still think his spins are slow and overall not quite at the level of Yuzuru,Patrick, and Dai.Still i like his personality on the ice. Dai even with a few errors commands your attention, hope oneday i see him live. Patrick really was not quite as bad for him as i expected. Looked abit nervous but overwise he would have scored well if he didn't make the mistake of cancelling out the combinaton at the end, and if he would have managed the 3 toe at the end of the quad toe it would have helped. Still adore his program, but i do worry about how he is improving technically jump wise, as the others are improving fast. Must be new to him that not only Dai but Yuzuru and Javier have marks that only he could reach before. In a way its good for fans to see a competiton and not know who will end up the winner. Patrick still wins the PCS. Patrick, Yuzuru, and Dai are my favourite so if i cannot have Patrick at the top iam glad its one of them.

:agree:
 

sky_fly20

Match Penalty
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
Maybe he'll realize he won't be handed World gold or Olympic gold on a silver platter! Karmic payback for his disrespectful statements re Plushenko ("36 or 37 year old landing quads" - arrogant!)

that one really ticked me off :mad:
no doubt he knows Zhenya's real age, he said 36-37 to mock that he is an "Old' skater

I hope Yuzuru kicks his butt from now on, Go My Prince :thumbsup:
 

lea

Rinkside
Joined
May 14, 2012
It's a gradual phase-out and there is no doubt. He is no longer able to rely on those inflated pcs to win competitions despite big mistakes. The PCS gap is narrowing. Takahashi got almost the same pcs while both made mistakes. This has never happened in the past. If Chan continues to make technical mistakes, which I'm pretty sure he will, he will be in big big trouble since judges appear to have shifted attention to Hanyu, the spaniard. Takahashi also gets renewed respect, probably because of Monorov.

Agreed
 

clairecloutier

Final Flight
Joined
Aug 27, 2003
I don't think the judges are abandoning Chan. I think other skaters are catching up with him. For a while, Patrick had a real advantage with his 2-quad LPs because he was landing the quads really consistently. But now he's not landing them consistently. And the other guys are upping the ante, with all the top men now attempting 2 quads in the long, and Fernandez of course having 3 quads. Add to that the fact that all the other guys are doing 2 3Axels, while Chan only has 1 3Axel (and a shaky one at that), and it means trouble for Chan.

It was interesting seeing his LP. Initially this season, I thought Chan had really made strides artistically. Now I'm not so sure. It's always beautiful to watch him skate, just from a technical standpoint--such gorgeous motion as he bends deep in his knees to gain speed and then ascends more upright. His skating has its own rhythm, I feel. BUT--the problem is, his movement sometimes has nothing to do with the music he's skating to. In the LP, his highlight moves didn't match highlights in the music. Maybe he was just off in this performance. But real musicality was once again missing.

Hanyu, on the other hand, does have that innate musicality. I find him very unpolished and imprecise in his presentation--he needs better posture and crisper movement IMO--yet somehow, he does capture the flow and mood of the music. Whereas Chan sort of skates to his own soundtrack.
 

Butterscotch17

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 26, 2012
I haven't read the thread, and will probably post more after I do, but I just have to say that I am so happy for Daisukee to win this! I wasn't sure that he could do it, but he did, and he proved to everyone that said he was "done" that he was still one of the best. Dai was the only one in the men's GPF who didn't win a gold medal during the regular season, since he qualified with two silvers, so now Daisuke has his gold, too. Every one of those men won a gold this season, so it is perfect :)

Also, I have to add how impressed I was by Javier! He really killed it! What a performance! It's a shame that he didn't win a medal :( It would've really been something if Javi had knocked Chan off the podium. I think everyone would've been shocked.
 
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lea

Rinkside
Joined
May 14, 2012
Yes. After seeing the COR I though Chan improved artistically.
But now I doubt about that. After all It's not that easy to improve.
I guess he just has a better lp than last season.

But Dai's program is worse than before and made mistakes but got 90 in pcs. the same pcs with Chan.
That didn't happen before..So..

I don't think the judges are abandoning Chan.
They just don't treat Chan like before.. a little. And I think it's a good thing.

As for Hanyu Yes He has a great musicality and he is expressive. But that expression looks awkward for me. In lp...
His execution is a little awkward overall too.
His program has no transition. He looks just go element to element.
So I think the judges give that PCS to Hanyu because of his potential. not what he actually does in competition.
But it's just my opinion. maybe he is just not my style.
I thought he was overscored at 2012 worlds too and Joubert should have been on podium.:p
 
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phaeljones

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 18, 2012
I was in awe of all the skates, and any one of those five top skaters could have won if but for the position of the moon and the stars and the way that wind was blowing.

Ya. Takahashi's did good short and long so the points added up (with a little vodka boost on the PCS). But yay. He had two great skates. He won. of all the skaters, my sense is that Takahashi skates the smartest.

Chan still has it, and the mistakes he made were stupid, stupid, stupid. He is not the type of skater to repeat those kind of mistakes though, so now they are behind him. I would not count him out and I think he is still the one to beat at worlds and Sochi. When he is at his best, he is the best, but when he is not at his best, he will be beat and then some. No wiggle room. Fact of life now. (I like his coaching change. I find him easier to watch this year compared to last year. )

Hanyu really amazed me. His stamina was good, and I thought he skated better than he ever has. He had little chance to win with his crappy short though. But with the two amazing short skates he has done this year, he should be forgiven for not skating this one short not so well. I think that it will be him and Chan for the worlds (providing Chan shows up in himself, and Yuzuru can keep his focus for two days of skating rather than just one). As well, Yuzuru's skills seem to be improving by the week. But, oh my, forget the scoring, that was a beautiful skate to watch.

Javier? Where did he come from all of a sudden. This is his second totally amazing long program performance. Three quads. But, as well, he is just way better than he was last year. Some of his skating (his landings especially) reminds me of Yuzuru's, but he also has his own style in his own right. (Yuzuru will never do Charlie Chaplin though.) This kid could be the dark horse for the podium

Kozuka. I just feel sorry for him. What a phenomenal skater and he skated well. He had a few glitches, but: The field that night was just to strong. He still needs to achieve better skates, but, still, just as he is, he is amazing to watch.

At any grand prix event, I would have been happy to just see one of those skates. But there were five. I am almost sorry that there had to be scoring.
 
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Violet Bliss

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 19, 2010
I don't see the judges scoring Patrick differently. He got what he deserved by the system just as he did in previous seasons. I see him adjusting to a different skating mindset and emphasis. He used to take on the jumps full on, getting high points for full rotations even if he fell, causing much harsh criticism from detractors as undeserving and necessitating lower PCS. He was also known and complimented for being able to think on his feet (or in his skates) for adding missed combo jumps later in the program. Well, it's great to be able to think on one's feet but not at the highest performance level when an athlete is in the proverbial zone. Skating is an extremely difficult sport, partly because of the necessary frequent switches from expressive artistry to a highly technical super athletic high risk jump and back again to expressive skating on ice. I believe as Patrick turns his focus to artistry in his performance this season, he is skating more with his feelings and less with his head about the COP. The right brain is taking on more than before and the left brain is functioning less. It is a transition to the optimal balanced whole brain functioning and I think he will reach it. He has a bigger vision than winning competitions but the competitiveness is still there and unhappy about not winning. :)

I enjoy his journey.
 
Joined
Aug 16, 2009
Yes, when you see five great skaters, you want them to throw away the scores and put them all on the podium. Even more agonizing is the fact that there are more great male skaters in Japan than there are spots on their world team--that makes all of us losers, not just the guy(s) left off the Japanese team.

Orser must be dancing around somewhere near the ceiling after his two skaters did so well. It certainly validates him to have results like these.

Takahashi is my favorite, so I can't really be objective, but I like your observation that he might be the smartest strategist of all the skaters.

I said on one of the other threads that it seems to me that Daisuke's jumps are higher this year. They have almost a vertical lift. Does anyone else see that, or is it just my imagination?
 

emma

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 28, 2004
I love these three posts above mine and agree with wholeheartedly.

I do think Dai's jumps look higher this year - and although I don't love his programs as much this year as last, I feel like (without going back and watching/checking) they are appearing cleaner (not seeing as much of some of the scratchy landings, for examples, that he sometimes has when he is fighting for the program)
 

seniorita

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2008
I hope someday Takahiko will get the pcs he deserves! When he does a mistake his pcs tank..

He was also known and complimented for being able to think on his feet (or in his skates) for adding missed combo jumps later in the program.
Not to take anything away from Patrick but 90% of the skaters know what to add or not if the miss a combo as an alternative, almost anyone who is not Oda knows by now what to add or substract during the program and they usually do it, even junior girls do it.
 

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Not to take anything away from Patrick but 90% of the skaters know what to add or not if the miss a combo as an alternative, almost anyone who is not Oda knows by now what to add or substract during the program and they usually do it, even junior girls do it.

More noteworthy is that Chan's made COP combo mistakes twice this season (his SP at COR, the LP here)
 

Layfan

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
I admire Patrick for improving artistically, as he is really looking like he feels the music more



Thank you I agree! Actually, I always liked Patrick artistically and I never understood the criticism. Yes, true, he doesn't reach the audience in the same easy, sizzling way that Daisuke does but I never saw a problem with Patrick's musical intrepretation.

I think the difference this year is that he stayed away from the war horses and picked a difficult piano piece that simply shows off Patrick. It's hard to interpret something that doesn't have a character like Phantom of the Opera. But when your skating itself is lovely, a piece like Rachmaninov's Elegie is perfect because it's all about you and your gorgeous skating and the music.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
But when your skating itself is lovely, a piece like Rachmaninov's Elegie is perfect because it's all about you and your gorgeous skating and the music.

True, but Patrick has yet to show that he can perform a competitive short program to this music with the same qualities as his exhibition version.
 

SGrand

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 22, 2011
True, but Patrick has yet to show that he can perform a competitive short program to this music with the same qualities as his exhibition version.

How could he though? I'm not being a smart *** or anything, I just think it would be tough. Am I wrong to assume that COP would make it harder to just throw yourself into it and lose yourself in the moment......I mean, not only technically is it different, but also mentally, there's no pressure for a gala that has only a couple jumps thrown in. I know what you mean, the performance maybe suffers a tad, but I think that's kinda normal. :)
 
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