The New judging system kills figure skating and loses the beauty of sport | Page 2 | Golden Skate

The New judging system kills figure skating and loses the beauty of sport

Joined
Jun 21, 2003
I kinda fail to see what the system has to do with this. I think it can tweak the number of attempts to do some jumps, but not if they are going to be landed. That depends on skater, not on the system.

Under the 6.0 system, if you fell you were pretty much dead meat.

In the current system if you fall on a quad you still score higher on that element than for a satisfactory triple Lutz. The scoring system encourages skaters to try tricks that they can't really do, and rewards their failures.
 

WeakAnkles

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 1, 2011
Of course all the men used to wear variations on the tuxedo, which would rather make them look like skating waiters. Hmmm, I sense a theme restaurant here (as long as you don't mind the temps! Then again, you would probably get a lot less complaints about food being cold...all things being relative).
 

Daniel5555

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 27, 2009
I am not blaming the scoring system, but how strange it seems that for all those 14-year olds doing 3Lz+3T, where are the top seniors who can manage such content at 18?
I think the answer is very simple - weight. And also the fact the center of mass of the body changes. And many other things.

Let's be honest, doing quads in case of men seems to be on the edge of human possibilities. Doing 3Lz+3T or 3A seems to be something similar in case of ladies. So those elements will always remain extremely difficult and will have relatively high probability of failure. Figure skating can't advance linearly, from doubles to triples, from triples to quads and from quads to quintuples. There must be a limit somewhere there.

And it's not like before skaters did this stuff routinely, it's just that people always focus on top skaters or phenomenons. You can't make another Midori Ito unless you use genetic engineering.

It does seem like there is an exchange -- easier jumps, higher PCSs.
Because PCSs essentially come with experience. And jumps tend to go away with age.
 

Daniel5555

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 27, 2009
The point is the base value. You get a lot of points for fully rotating the quad, despite taking a fall on the landing.
Under the 6.0 system, if you fell you were pretty much dead meat.

In the current system if you fall on a quad you still score higher on that element than for a satisfactory triple Lutz. The scoring system encourages skaters to try tricks that they can't really do, and rewards their failures.
Yeah, but I read another guy (or not?) complaining that skaters don't try difficult jumps. I don't think that after reducing to 0 the points rewarded for making an almost successful quad with a fall we will see more quads than now. Successful or not.
 

WeakAnkles

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 1, 2011
It just goes to show you...there ARE no new ideas. Sigh. Another brilliant idea dashed to bits on the rocks of reality...
 

drivingmissdaisy

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Joined
Feb 17, 2010
I'm kind of mixed on this topic. I think the men generally handle the new system well, but it is more challenging for women because we have lower muscle mass so it is difficult for ladies to perform so many transitions and do jumps and spins. COP eliminated the spiral sequence, which only impacts the women. The catchfoot requirement (to achieve higher levels) makes most of the spins look the same. COP has really made men and women programs almost identical, whereas before a well skated woman's program looked quite different than a well skated men's program, and I don't like that aspect of the scoring system.
 

starryxskies

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 2, 2012
It just goes to show you...there ARE no new ideas. Sigh. Another brilliant idea dashed to bits on the rocks of reality...

I think creativity is not popular with the old and outdated judges. If they get some young and hip judges, maybe new creative programs like Blues for Klook would get it's recognized scores. I don't see why skaters would want to push creative boundaries if they're never going to win. Cookie cutter is what gets you that gold, unfortunately.
 

Bluebonnet

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Joined
Aug 18, 2010
I don't know for the people in this forum. But, for me, I'm a figure skater and I begin to hate figure skating even if it was the sport that I like the most to do.

Many skaters and skating fans who have grown up in 6.0 system have been having a hardtime adapting the CoP. I believe that the younger skaters and fans as well as the fans who are familiar only with CoP have much less issues with this current system. I personally think CoP is a much better system for figure skating. There are so many more beautiful, and actually in fact more interesting programs under it than under 6.0 system. Wondering why you haven't found them?:rolleye:
 

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
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Joined
Jun 27, 2003
actually a lot of 6.0 skaters embraced it when it started, and still find good things about it - moreso than bad. The retired ones that don't are the ones that didn't want the change to begin with - Kurt Browning changed his mind about it after skating in a pro comp with it this year.
 

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
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Jun 27, 2003
I don't think he ever underappreciated the work skaters put into their skating... he was there once upon a time...
 

Bluebonnet

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Aug 18, 2010
True. Kurt is actually one of a few famous 6.0 era skaters who have appreciated and very much understood the CoP.:yes:
 

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
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Jun 27, 2003
True. Kurt is actually one of a few famous 6.0 era skaters who have appreciated and very much understood the CoP.:yes:

he's one of those "live in the moment" types... so while I think he looks fondly on the past, he doesn't get stuck in it. he's a "let it go" kinda guy - by his own admission.
 

camion

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Isn't this sort of what's happening to gymnastics too? required elements, more skills to put in, less choreography, less individuality in certain aspects, more checkpoints to mark off, difficulty vs how well the element is executed, advancing difficulty, etc.

he's one of those "live in the moment" types... so while I think he looks fondly on the past, he doesn't get stuck in it. he's a "let it go" kinda guy - by his own admission.

I'm sure that attitude is what got him through when he burned down his own house with a leaf blower.

But joking aside, I think John Nicks, Brian Orser and Morozov are all CoP savvy guys from starkly different judging systems. I'm not sure how much they appreciate it, but they're definitely shrewd about it.
 

plushyfan

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Jun 27, 2012
Country
Hungary
I don't know for the people in this forum. But, for me, I'm a figure skater and I begin to hate figure skating even if it was the sport that I like the most to do.

I think the new scoring system ensures that skaters do not take any risks and make all things easier. For example, women no longer try the triple lutz and replaced by triple toe / triple toe.

Also, I think it becomes redundant, the skater spins with the new system are not at all original, everyone does the same positions to get levels 4.

Really figure skating has lost its beauty, in the past, spins were much more perform to give style and elegance at the choice of music, today's skaters are no longer spins to properly interpret music . Skaters are spins to earn points even if the positions are ugly and they do not fit with the music.

The footwork are also much less interesting. Why skaters can not interpret their music as they want and can not put it the turn and the step like they want to.

For example this kind of skating is missing for me :(
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMwXYdkSK4g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UlVeNEBFKE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1gJ5H3ubfA

You can really see that in the debut of the new scoring and in the past with the 6,0 system, that the skater was more free and skate more fabulous program because they try the difficulty and the footwork sequence and spin was simply art and beauty for being with the music.

It's sad because, I tell myself that if I begin to not like the sport, guess how the people who knew nothing about skating, how can they love our sport? Nowadays, the element in the program are completely redundant ... What are your thought? Do you think like me that the new system kill figure skating and is the reason why figure skating is less popular year by year?

I agree with you, totally, this is my feeling, too. I adored the FS in my whole life, but not now. I can't explan, I'm only bored of many programs.
 
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Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
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Jun 27, 2003
I'm sure that attitude is what got him through when he burned down his own house with a leaf blower.

Not one of his finer moments, but having had a fire myself - I can totally sympathise with a lack of judgement moment...
 

camion

On the Ice
Joined
Apr 30, 2005
Not one of his finer moments, but having had a fire myself - I can totally sympathise with a lack of judgement moment...

Oh, I'm really sorry about that. Totally distasteful on my part. I meant it in the most light-hearted way knowing that his wife & kids weren't hurt, but yeah totally uncalled for. Sorry again.
 
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