Page 1 of 8 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 119

Thread: The New judging system kills figure skating and loses the beauty of sport

  1. #1
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    400

    The New judging system kills figure skating and loses the beauty of sport

    I don't know for the people in this forum. But, for me, I'm a figure skater and I begin to hate figure skating even if it was the sport that I like the most to do.

    I think the new scoring system ensures that skaters do not take any risks and make all things easier. For example, women no longer try the triple lutz and replaced by triple toe / triple toe.

    Also, I think it becomes redundant, the skater spins with the new system are not at all original, everyone does the same positions to get levels 4.

    Really figure skating has lost its beauty, in the past, spins were much more perform to give style and elegance at the choice of music, today's skaters are no longer spins to properly interpret music . Skaters are spins to earn points even if the positions are ugly and they do not fit with the music.

    The footwork are also much less interesting. Why skaters can not interpret their music as they want and can not put it the turn and the step like they want to.

    For example this kind of skating is missing for me :(
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMwXYdkSK4g
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UlVeNEBFKE
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1gJ5H3ubfA

    You can really see that in the debut of the new scoring and in the past with the 6,0 system, that the skater was more free and skate more fabulous program because they try the difficulty and the footwork sequence and spin was simply art and beauty for being with the music.

    It's sad because, I tell myself that if I begin to not like the sport, guess how the people who knew nothing about skating, how can they love our sport? Nowadays, the element in the program are completely redundant ... What are your thought? Do you think like me that the new system kill figure skating and is the reason why figure skating is less popular year by year?

  2. #2
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    5,609
    I became a fan of figure skating because I though what COP was rewarding is what should be rewarded. I think the footwork is way better. I think the artistry is more interesting. I think the programs are more fascinating.

    I do think it's harder to become a fan of figure skating nowadays, but I think IJS/COP is like the third or fourth ranked reason for that.

  3. #3
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    The Bluegrass State:)
    Posts
    219
    Oh lord. No offense or anything but I am sick to death of this type of thread. First, the current judging system isn't new, it's almost a decade old. Stephanie Rosenthal competed under the COP and perhaps this is just me, but I'm not seeing this huge difference in how people skate now and how they skated then. If anything, COP has made skaters pay more attention to their edges and their jump positions when they take off and when they land. A lot of skaters won a lot of medals with under rotated jumps in the 6.0 (Hello Sarah Hughes) and skaters won medals with falls ( see Ice Dance at the 2002 olympics) so that isn't exclusive to COP. Also, there was some ugy choreography and atrocious footwork going on under 6.0 as well.

    I personally think that the COP only kills the beauty of figure skating if the skaters themselves allow it to happen. There have been many beautiful and memorable programs under COP, just like they were under the 6.0 system, but they're has been just as many clunkers.

    Again, I mean no offense by anything, I just think this is a tired complaint.

  4. #4
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    1,700
    It's easy to put a rosy glow on the past, but yes, there were indeed PLENTY of mediocre and unmemorable programs in the past. There were PLENTY of judging scandals (my personal favorite being Ice Dance at the SLC games, where Tracy Wilson predicted exactly--and I mean EXACTLY--how Bourne and Kraatz would be screwed--I mean scored--out of a bronze medal). And frankly I agree with both comments above. COP has broadened the scope of focus on more aspects of figure skating besides jumps and spins. And hooray for that.

    Of course any system of scoring that depends on subjective opinion (no matter how well-informed) is going to have its problems. That's simply human nature. And people will always argue about the results. And that isn't limited to sports where part of the judging is interpretative rather than quantitative. You want nasty arguments? Come to where I live--New York City-- during the baseball playoffs when the Yankees are, to put it kindly, Not Playing Their Best. Now that is real nastiness.

  5. #5
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    The Bluegrass State:)
    Posts
    219
    Tracy Wilson predicted exactly--and I mean EXACTLY--how Bourne and Kraatz would be screwed--I mean scored--out of a bronze medal).
    I think B&K got the placement they deserved at the 02 games. The real outcry should have been that D&V were screwed out of medal and placed 5th behind two teams who fell and imo, weren't all that great to begin with.

  6. #6
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    1,700
    See? There will always be debates about who should have placed where at a competition. It's part of the fun of being a fan. I mean, you can't talk about the weather all the time, right?

    PS I agree with you Whitneyskates. It really was a splatterfest of a competition, and not just ON the ice. LOL!

  7. #7
    On the Ice
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    34
    I personally don't take side of old systems.
    There were good performances but they were kind of impressive in "impressive" ways.

  8. #8
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Detroit, Michigan
    Posts
    27,110
    Quote Originally Posted by coolboogie22 View Post


    For example this kind of skating is missing for me :(

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMwXYdkSK4g
    Here is the short program that goes with this LP.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rnkku5aJzZM

  9. #9
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    2,181
    Quote Originally Posted by coolboogie22 View Post
    I think the new scoring system ensures that skaters do not take any risks and make all things easier. For example, women no longer try the triple lutz and replaced by triple toe / triple toe.
    Have you watched the men's discipline lately? The men skate under the IJS too, but at the Grand Prix Final this weekend, of the 6 men who competed, 5 of the 6 attempted at least 2 quads in the LP, and one even went for (and landed!) 3 quads! Even Machida, who is not exactly a top-tier skater per se, went for a quad as well. And the programs were all packed with complex footwork, choreography and transitions. The level of men's skating is possibly the highest it's ever been...ever. Just because the women are in a slump right now doesn't mean the IJS is entirely to blame.

    That said, I do agree that the IJS is far from perfect and could definitely use some more tweaks. But I believe the system is slowly improving--the IJS of today is a far different (and IMO, better) creature than earlier incarnations such as the IJS of the mid-2000s. For instance, the recent implementation of the choreographic sequence in the LP has been a great idea, and I think the ISU would do well to further explore down that avenue--like putting in more level-free choreographic elements in the LP, such as a spin or two.

  10. #10
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Lloret de Mar, Spain
    Posts
    377
    Quote Originally Posted by coolboogie22 View Post
    It's sad because, I tell myself that if I begin to not like the sport, guess how the people who knew nothing about skating, how can they love our sport? Nowadays, the element in the program are completely redundant ... What are your thought?
    Well, 4 years ago I knew nothing about skating, and then suddenly I became a fan, first watching ladies, then starting watching men. Then Yuna Kim, who hooked me into it, temporarily retired, but I kept watching it, because I liked the sport itself. And now I'm very interested in pairs and ice dance, even though before I thought that ice dance is the most boring thing ever.

    Quote Originally Posted by coolboogie22 View Post
    Do you think like me that the new system kill figure skating and is the reason why figure skating is less popular year by year?
    No, I think the main reason why skating is not popular are the fans that constantly whine without any reason. If I had known about the general state of community 4 years ago, I wouldn't join, I think. No offense to those fans, who are actually reasonable and passionate about the sport.

  11. #11
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    1,191
    I think COP has been fine for men's skating and for ice dancing but not for pair skating or the ladies' event. In the ladies event, I miss beautiful spirals and spiral sequences and find that the requirements result in slow and labored footwork and crazy (and ugly) spins. And the strict technical requirements have resulted, not in better technique, but eliminating difficult jumps like the lutz and rewarding things like a double axel-double loop or toe--something Janet Lynn did as a 14 year old a the 1968 Olympics. The ubiquity of the Biellmann position is not a positive development. The men are better able to power through the footwork and spirals and beautiful layback spins were never part of what made their programs memorable. And pairs has become unwatchable under COP, with ugly foot-grabbing and pretzel positions. So I don't disagree entirelywith the original poster.

  12. #12
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    407
    From a spectator standpoint, the sport has declined a lot in recent years. The programs seem much more "cookie cutter" now, not only in terms of what is actually performed on the ice, but also in terms of costuming, music choice, etc. Previous generations of skaters have projected a lot more personality than the current crop, and when you do have someone who's different one year, they are a lot less unique the next year.

    The men almost all wear black outfits. Except for Javier, I think everyone else did on today's televised GPF. The music is heavy, serious, non-famous classical music. Daisuke, who in the past did tangos in bright costumes is now just one of the crowd (although I at least recognized his song). The ladies all have buns, also favor very heavy music and seem to favor black (though it's not as bad as with the guys). One program seems to run into another. Agnes Z. and Murakami tried something different one year, but came back the next year with buns and heavy music. You never see tomboy types like Tonya or Debi or Irina, and you don't see showmen like Candeloro, either.

    I don't know if the judging system is to blame, but it seems like a lot less personality is projected. Every skater used to have more of a unique style, but as a non-skating tv watcher, I'm just not seeing that anymore. As for Stephanie Rosenthal, she was never seriously a contender, so she had nothing to lose to try something different. Had she learned all the triples and become in the running for a medal, I'm sure she'd put away the robot music and take out the violin concerto.

  13. #13
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    5,609
    Quote Originally Posted by Whitneyskates View Post
    I think B&K got the placement they deserved at the 02 games. The real outcry should have been that D&V were screwed out of medal and placed 5th behind two teams who fell and imo, weren't all that great to begin with.
    Yep.

  14. #14
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Detroit, Michigan
    Posts
    27,110
    Quote Originally Posted by evangeline View Post
    Have you watched the men's discipline lately? The men skate under the IJS too, but at the Grand Prix Final this weekend, of the 6 men who competed, 5 of the 6 attempted at least 2 quads in the LP...
    This would, however, be more impressive if a higher percentage of the quads were actually landed. The typical men's program these days seems to begin with 4T(fall). Then, having gotten the obligatory fall on the quad out of the way, he goes on with the program.

  15. #15
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Lloret de Mar, Spain
    Posts
    377
    Quote Originally Posted by jenaj View Post
    And the strict technical requirements have resulted, not in better technique, but eliminating difficult jumps like the lutz and rewarding things like a double axel-double loop or toe--something Janet Lynn did as a 14 year old a the 1968 Olympics.
    Yeah, I love this type of argument. Those days most of top junior ladies that are 13 or 14 years old are able to execute 3Lz+3T, but because Janet Lynn executed 2A-2T 40 years ago, the system definitely sucks.

    And then some people wonder why I don't like to come to forums, well, because after reading things like those you may start to lose your faith in humanity.

Page 1 of 8 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •