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Thread: Kaetlyn Osmond 2013 World Champion?

  1. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    Soldatova competed at future Worlds for Belarus, just never finished in the top 10.
    Ah i missed that! Well, my stats still stand.

  2. #107
    Custom Title Nadia01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    I'm not a fan of Kaetlyn, but I honestly feel like she seems happier than Mao or Yuna (when they were her age) when she's on the ice. It's not a happiness that is borne by portraying a character, but it seems more ... genuine.

    Exudes happiness, this one.
    I can't talk about Mao, but as for Yuna, it's not easy to be happy when you're competing with a painful back injury...

  3. #108
    Ya'll just need to ignore it. aftertherain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadia01 View Post
    I can't talk about Mao, but as for Yuna, it's not easy to be happy when you're competing with a painful back injury...
    True, but I honestly don't think she exuded happiness throughout her programs regardless of when she was competing. (By exuding happiness, I mean that we are seeing the real Yuna's happiness; not that of some enchanting character or alluring lpersonality.)

    Don't get me wrong, I do love her skating, but she tends to portray characters on the ice (yes, including Tango de Roxanne and Fever count, etc) and when she doesn't (like Piano Concerto in F; etc, etc), she seems relatively more reserved-- then again, I felt that she was still portraying a character in that program. I think the closest to "wearing her heart on her sleeve" that she came to was in her "Lark Ascending" program. Other than that ... nope.

    But maybe that's her personality. She's just more of a reserved person.

    Same goes for Mao, but I think Mao actually does sometimes. And that's a big sometimes.

    Feel free to disagree.
    Last edited by aftertherain; 01-20-2013 at 11:02 PM.

  4. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    True, but I honestly don't think she exuded happiness throughout her programs regardless of when she was competing. (By exuding happiness, I mean that we are seeing the real Yuna's happiness; not that of some enchanting character or alluring lpersonality.)

    Don't get me wrong, I do love her skating, but she tends to portray characters on the ice (yes, including Tango de Roxanne and Fever count, etc) and when she doesn't (like Piano Concerto in F; etc, etc), she seems relatively more reserved-- then again, I felt that she was still portraying a character in that program. I think the closest to "wearing her heart on her sleeve" that she came to was in her "Lark Ascending" program. Other than that ... nope.

    But maybe that's her personality. She's just more of a reserved person.

    Same goes for Mao, but I think Mao actually does sometimes. And that's a big sometimes.

    Feel free to disagree.
    To be fair, the pressure on their shoulders were also enormous at their very young age for both Asada and Kim. Part of it is cultural, but a lot of it comes from extremely high expectations and constant media coverage in their countries. In comparison, Osmond is relatively under the radar and the expectations on her are no where as high as they were on Kim and Asada.

  5. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    True, but I honestly don't think she exuded happiness throughout her programs regardless of when she was competing. (By exuding happiness, I mean that we are seeing the real Yuna's happiness; not that of some enchanting character or alluring lpersonality.)

    Don't get me wrong, I do love her skating, but she tends to portray characters on the ice (yes, including Tango de Roxanne and Fever count, etc) and when she doesn't (like Piano Concerto in F; etc, etc), she seems relatively more reserved-- then again, I felt that she was still portraying a character in that program. I think the closest to "wearing her heart on her sleeve" that she came to was in her "Lark Ascending" program. Other than that ... nope.

    But maybe that's her personality. She's just more of a reserved person.

    Same goes for Mao, but I think Mao actually does sometimes. And that's a big sometimes.

    Feel free to disagree.
    I don't disagree with the fact that Yuna is a more reserved person. She is naturally shy, and she said she was stunned at the media attention and pressure (not to mention the fact that everyone in Korea scrutinized everything she did, even if it's as minor as making a face or frowning a bit before a comp or after her program, and the enormous pressure on her from so many people around her). She even said that nothing less than a victory was good enough for people around her, and that it made her sad that people didn't think it was good if she got 2nd or 3rd.

    Mao is also the same. Mao never struck me as an outgoing person. She seems shy and reserved, and she doesn't seem to like the insane pressure everyone's putting on her.

    It is not easy to compete, knowing that if you're not #1, people will act like you've failed. Not many ladies compete with that kind of pressure.

  6. #111
    can't come down to Earth prettykeys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eyria View Post
    This girl is very, very talented. Just a natural performer. What I like is she's a very complete skater, especially for her age. Great jumps, good difficulty, excellent transitions and choreography, wonderful performance quality and speed, good overall skating. The other younger girls--Tukt, Adelina, Julia, Gracie--have a half-baked feel. There's something missing with each of them, either musicality and performance quality, or consistency with the jumps, or overall packaging. Not so with Kaetlyn. She really has it all--no serious weaknesses. So far.
    Ooh, this is a very popular post, and along with Olympia and shine, I agree with it. Kaetlyn is a very captivating, all-around performer and skater; there's something very effortless about how she does it, too.

    As for "more impressive for their age", I do believe that, say, Michelle Kwan, Mao Asada, YuNa Kim--in that order--were more impressive than Kaetlyn at earlier ages. But...I don't really put much stock into that evaluation. So what? Some skaters peak earlier than others, and fizzle earlier, too. Other skaters (e.g. Shizuka Arakawa) reach their full potential later into their careers, and are just as impressive.

    I would definitely put Kaetlyn in my top-five-to-watch-skaters from the women.

    ^ Nadia - I don't think Mao is quite as shy as YuNa is. But I love the spark that bubbles from YuNa when she's around people she feels comfortable around. ^__^ She loves to laugh.

  7. #112
    can't come down to Earth prettykeys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    Don't get me wrong, I do love her skating, but she tends to portray characters on the ice (yes, including Tango de Roxanne and Fever count, etc) and when she doesn't (like Piano Concerto in F; etc, etc), she seems relatively more reserved-- then again, I felt that she was still portraying a character in that program. I think the closest to "wearing her heart on her sleeve" that she came to was in her "Lark Ascending" program. Other than that ... nope.
    I guess you didn't see YuNa's 2011 LP...that's about as close to "wearing her heart on her sleeve" as she has gotten, from what I can tell. No, it's not a simple, joyful, "happy" heart on the sleeve, but it was no character...all soul.

    BTW, it's weird that you don't consider Mao to be a skater that exudes much "happy" during skating, while describing YuNa as too performer-like. Compared to Mao, who to me projects direct happiness/joy from her heart quite often, Kaetlyn is more performer/character.

    To me, at least.

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    Okay I think Osmond has great potential but she is not a world medal or gold medallist contender - yet at least. She could grow but she still lacks some finesse, she lacks stamina at the end of her routines, she still lacks presence, her spins and body line could be better, she doesn't have the amplitude on her jumps like an Irnina, Joannie or Kostner when on. She could sneak in if the stars align up by some fluke but that would mean Suzuki, Kostner, Korpi and probably Asada all had poor skates and count on the Russians to crumble. I don't think Korpi should be a contender but she is a lucky and pretty skater. I had happened with Lepisto it could happen again

  9. #114
    Ya'll just need to ignore it. aftertherain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    To be fair, the pressure on their shoulders were also enormous at their very young age for both Asada and Kim. Part of it is cultural, but a lot of it comes from extremely high expectations and constant media coverage in their countries. In comparison, Osmond is relatively under the radar and the expectations on her are no where as high as they were on Kim and Asada.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nadia01 View Post
    [Yuna Kim] is naturally shy, and she said she was stunned at the media attention and pressure (not to mention the fact that everyone in Korea scrutinized everything she did ... and the enormous pressure on her from so many people around her).
    Mao is also the same. Mao never struck me as an outgoing person. She seems shy and reserved, and she doesn't seem to like the insane pressure everyone's putting on her.
    I think both wallylutz and Nadia01 make really good points. Pressure can stifle a lot of "joyous" expressions, especially when someone is stressed-- and expectations of an entire nation is on a whole 'nother level of its own. It definitely remains to be seen if Kaetlyn will succumb to it or rise to the occasion.


    Quote Originally Posted by prettykeys View Post
    I guess you didn't see YuNa's 2011 LP...that's about as close to "wearing her heart on her sleeve" as she has gotten, from what I can tell. No, it's not a simple, joyful, "happy" heart on the sleeve, but it was no character...all soul.
    Nope, I did. And I respectfully disagree. Well, somewhat. "Homage to Korea" was definitely a personal choice for her and it really struck a chord within her to be skating to her nation's unofficial anthem. I think the difference is that while Yuna isn't too emotive facial expression-wise, she performs with her whole body-- as in, she uses her whole body and expressive movements to interpret the music-- perhaps this is why we disagreed? Still, I can't shake the feeling that she looked a little less motivated than ideal at that competition and that takes away from the "happy" (a better term does not come to mind right now) of the program for me.

    I actually think "All of Me" is as close to "wearing her heart on her sleeve" as she's gotten. She definitely looked a lot freer than I've ever seen her in a performance (exhibition or not) and there were plenty of genuine smiles to go around. Of course, one can argue that she was portraying a man, but I think that might lead into gender debate which is not my intention. Also, I haven't seen every Yuna program there is to see, so if there are anymore, please post some links and I'd be glad to watch them.

    On the other hand, I hope Kaetlyn doesn't lose her emotive quality. She's still a bit juniorish, sure, and I'll withhold further judgement until we see more of her programs.

    Quote Originally Posted by prettykeys View Post
    BTW, it's weird that you don't consider Mao to be a skater that exudes much "happy" during skating, while describing YuNa as too performer-like. Compared to Mao, who to me projects direct happiness/joy from her heart quite often, Kaetlyn is more performer/character.
    I said "sometimes"! And I believe it to be true. Despite her light and lyrical skating, Mao often looks like she concentrates too hard on what she will do next, but I do agree that she can be a happy skater as well. When she exudes happiness (as she does at the end of most programs), it is absolutely infectious. An example would be her short program this season. (I know some people complained and said it was "too juniorish", but I thought it might be because she's wearing a ponytail instead of a bun. )

  10. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    I said "sometimes"! And I believe it to be true. Despite her light and lyrical skating, Mao often looks like she concentrates too hard on what she will do next, but I do agree that she can be a happy skater as well. When she exudes happiness (as she does at the end of most programs), it is absolutely infectious. An example would be her short program this season. (I know some people complained and said it was "too juniorish", but I thought it might be because she's wearing a ponytail instead of a bun. )
    I agree with the bolded part. That's why I don't enjoy watching Mao's competitive programs as much, but I find her exhibition to be rather enjoyable b/c she's skating w/o worrying about executing her next element well.

    Of course, we can say that about every skater out there, but it seems more pronounced w/ Mao (to me at least). And that seems to be a shame since if she can transfer the joy and freedom of her exhibition to her competitive programs, I think she will do even better.

  11. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadia01 View Post
    Of course, we can say that about every skater out there, but it seems more pronounced w/ Mao (to me at least). And that seems to be a shame since if she can transfer the joy and freedom of her exhibition to her competitive programs, I think she will do even better.
    I think it's because since she's such a light skater (skate blades on ice are like a knife to room temperature butter), we would expect to see some emotion on her face as per the music-- like you would a beautiful ballerina on stage. But we don't because she looks like she's trying hard to remember what she's supposed to do next, mostly before she does jumps.

    Sometimes!

  12. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    You must have not seen Yuna's debut at Worlds in 2007. She had everything even then to become a Olympic champion. And this was from when she was just 16. Osmond is good but i don't think this good. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bYtM0vmtkM
    I have seen Kim's debut at Worlds 2007 - being a long tim fan, how could I have missed it? Sure she was very impressive, technical mastery and all. But we are talking on relative terms here. I'm not saying she was not a great skater, but performance wise I find Osmond to be on an even higher level than she was. Osmond LIVES her choreography, Kim just excuted hers as she was taught, as expected for someone her age. She excuted it very well, of course. And that certainly doesn't make her a bad skater, just not exceptional. The point I was trying to make was really just that Osmond's one of the most outstanding 16 year olds I've seen because of some of the exceptional qualities that she has. Kim and Asada happen to be the most recent golden standard for talented teens and that's why I mentioned them at all.
    [
    Quote Originally Posted by jaylee View Post
    It's just bizarre to lift her up past the reigning Olympic gold and silver medalists, who have three World titles, six GPF titles, and fifteen (!) GP wins between them, as well as having won every competition on the junior level. Osmond never won a single competition as a junior and that's actually why she was only able to get one GP. Had she had more success on the junior level, she would have earned two GP slots this season.
    Why is it bizzare? First of all, you obviously missed the fact that I was comparing Osmond to the current Olympic gold and silver medalists when THEY WERE 16. Secondly, being Olympic gold and silver medalists doesn't mean their skating is on some saintly level that no one shall be compared to, and it certainly doesn't mean they do EVERYTHING better than EVERYONE else. Who's talking about results at all? I'm excited about Osmond because of what I see in her skating NOW, not because of what medals she has won, so why do you need to state the obvious?
    Quote Originally Posted by prettykeys View Post
    As for "more impressive for their age", I do believe that, say, Michelle Kwan, Mao Asada, YuNa Kim--in that order--were more impressive than Kaetlyn at earlier ages. But...I don't really put much stock into that evaluation. So what? Some skaters peak earlier than others, and fizzle earlier, too. Other skaters (e.g. Shizuka Arakawa) reach their full potential later into their careers, and are just as impressive.
    That is true, compared to a lot of the so called prodigies, Osmond is a later bloomer jump-wise and therefore didn't have very impressive junior results. I also agree that skaters have different growth curves and each team has different strategies. I rarely get excited about wonder babies lading all kinds of 3-3's, because 1) that's not what excites me about figure skating 2) even if they can do them now, there's never a guarantee that they can do it later. But I'm always impressed when I see a young skater having performance quality and the ability to do transitions that are beyond their age (which is even rarer than having kids whipping out a bunch of 3-3's imo) because these are the things that will last and they promise a further artistic growth trajectory. And I get excited about that.

    I see I've effectively turned this into another "No, you must see Yuna Kim skate to this and this, she really was so great" thread. It's unfortunate. 1) This is a thread mainly about Osmond, 2) We KNOW what Yuna's skating is like.
    Last edited by shine; 01-21-2013 at 09:56 AM.

  13. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by shine View Post
    Why is it bizzare? First of all, you obviously missed the fact that I was comparing Osmond to the current Olympic gold and silver medalists when THEY WERE 16. Secondly, being Olympic gold and silver medalists doesn't mean their skating is at some saintly level that no one shall be compared to, and it certainly doesn't mean they do EVERYTHING better than EVERYONE else. Who's talking about results at all? I'm excited about Osmond because of what I see in her skating NOW, not because of what medals she has won, so why do you need to state the obvious?
    I'm not jaylee, but I think Mao and Yuna were both far superior in their technique and execution than Osmond even when they were 16-17.

    Mao and Yuna won everything there is to win as juniors, which Osmond didn't manage to do.

    We can twist things around around and claim that maybe politicking helped Mao and Yuna (which is dubious for the latter, but whatever). Osmond, as she is from Canada, did not suffer from not having a strong federation behind her as a junior skater.

    So comparing Mao, Yuna and Osmond at 16, the first two accomplished far more than Osmond as competitors. And Mao was an excellent jumper when she was a junior-level skater. Even Yuna said that Mao's lightness and seemingly effortless jumps were very impressive when recalling their junior years.
    Last edited by Nadia01; 01-21-2013 at 09:48 AM.

  14. #119
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    If by "far superior in their technique and execution than Osmond" you mean they had harder jump content, I'm not disputing that. WHY would I, or you, be arguing about the obvoius? If you mean something else, you need to back up your claim with a good argument. Go read my post again. WHERE do you see me twisting things around?
    Last edited by shine; 01-21-2013 at 09:57 AM.

  15. #120
    Custom Title Nadia01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shine View Post
    If by "far superior in their technique and execution than Osmond" you mean they had harder jump content, I'm not disputing that. WHY would I be arguing about the obvoius? If you mean something else, you need to back up your claim with a good argument. Go read my post again. WHERE do you see me twisting things around?
    Harder jumps, good spins, speed and presentation.

    Why? You think they just hand out Jr Worlds Medals to anybody who shows up for the comp?

    You are the one who keeps insisting that Osmond "lives her choreography". I don't see that at all. I think Yuna and Mao lived their choreography when they were 16-17, while Osmond is just being young and happy but somewhat juniorish. I'd love to have Osmond prove me wrong by doing programs that are vastly different in tone and mood than this season's, to show that she's capable of a wider range than just a bubbly new kid.

    Until that happens, it's premature to call Osmond vastly superior to Yuna and Mao artistically.

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