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Thread: 2013 US Nationals Senior Ladies SP

  1. #496
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Icey View Post
    Well, who made the smart decision to hold it then? lol
    Not that I'm an expert but even when the Kween was skating, the ladies SP had a lot of empty seats. 2005 I was able to sit front row instead of where my seats really were. My whole group did, in fact. We weren't as lucky for the LP, of course.

  2. #497
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Sigh, those scores for Caroline Zhang are heartbreaking. She should have gotten credit for 3Lo+3Lo< , with no -GOE. The -GOE on the Triple Flip was also too much. AND she also only got a Level 3 call on her Flying Camel when it was CLEARLY Level 4???

    She was actually a bit overscored for the Layback spin, though. LOL.

  3. #498
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    Mirai skating last could be good or bad. The only time i can remember her skating last and as a leader and skating great is at the 2010 Nationals. Of course she was great at the Olympics too but she really didn't have a chance to win there. How will she respond if the girls ahead of her knock it out of the park? At least she won't have a lead to protect so maybe she will go out and attack the ice.

  4. #499
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    I always prefer Mirai to Caroline but I'm so sorry for Caroline this time! That was really harsh! How could the judges just dump her like that? Ridiculous.

    I like Ashley's SP this year. She did well and deserve to be first. I think the top three ranking is fine. Anges did have more flair this time. I don't like Mirai's hands movement, too much flex and too often. She needs to get some refinement and control over her hands.

  5. #500
    Custom Title Gymfan15's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers
    Mirai skating last could be good or bad. The only time i can remember her skating last and as a leader and skating great is at the 2010 Nationals. Of course she was great at the Olympics too but she really didn't have a chance to win there. How will she respond if the girls ahead of her knock it out of the park? At least she won't have a lead to protect so maybe she will go out and attack the ice.
    Eh, I say. Pile on the pressure. I'm very lukewarm when it comes to Mirai...I adore her, have always adored her, but these last few years have been nothing but a frustration. USAG cannot afford to keep their skaters comfortable and make everything a pleasant experience...that's how we've had some epic meltdowns at Worlds.

    It is fairly safe to say that Ashley Wagner is now someone that USAG can be fairly confident in to pull off a respectable performance. For everyone else, though, it remains to be seen. If Mirai has got her act together enough to go to Worlds and not embarrass herself, then she might as well go knowing that she was able to handle the pressure of Nationals. If she can't pull it off here, she is NOT going to do it there. If her nerves are going do her in, it's better that it happens at Nationals when only a Worlds berth is on the line, rather at Worlds where an entire athlete's ticket to the Olympics rides on her shoulders.

    Same goes for Gracie, Agnes, and yes, Ashley (although I'm more comfortable watching her skate, although I hesitate to say that in fear of jinxing her, haha!). If they can't handle the pressure of Nationals, then I've no interest in adding any more gray hairs to my head by watching them at Worlds.

    Sorry if that sounds a little harsh, but as you can tell I'm a bit frustrated with my girls at the moment! USA has SO MANY beautiful, talented skaters that have every right to be the best in the world, but they CANNOT GET IT TOGETHER in competition. It's driving me insane.

  6. #501
    Down With It
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    Forgive me but what's USAG?

    Are you referring to USFS?

  7. #502
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.D. View Post
    Forgive me but what's USAG?

    Are you referring to USFS?
    Judging by ""Gymfan" it's probably United States Artistic Gymnastics? Or USA Gymnastics? Commonly used acronym for gymnastics.

  8. #503
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    Quote Originally Posted by mskater93 View Post
    You have to look at the take off as well as this has been a point of emphasis in the last year or so with tech panels. If you look at the amount of pre-rotation on the second 3Lo, it's definitely << with the amount short on the landing.
    Ugh, you're supposed to take off with around half pre-rotation on a loop. If you don't it's a take-off flaw, if you look at the skaters who have very consistent and high quality triple loops like Mao Asada she does pre rotate by about half a turn. On the other hand if you look at Kim Yu-Na's loop which has been proven inconsistent, she takes off with a quarter. So no, unless it's a toe jump you can't say that pre rotation is grounds for a downgrade unless it's an insanely cheated salchow.

  9. #504
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Well pre-rotation matters, in that you need to look at where the jump actually left the ice.

    The << call for Zhang's second 3Loop was not the worst call ever, but it does feel unfair. A << really means 2 turns or less in the air. The very top of her toepick maybe touched back down on the ice right at the 2 turn mark, but to me it's unfair to call a jump as landed right at that point. Why? Because most people teach that proper form for a jump dictates the toes being pointed in the air, pointed downward. A skater's toepick is therefore going to reach the ice slightly earlier if they point their toes in a jump, in comparison to not pointing them.

    I feel that Zhang's second 3Loop was just enough past 2 turns in the air at the point where it should be considered landed, which means a < call. Similarly, that first 3Loop should not have gotten a < call. Even worse, though, is the -GOE she got for the jump. It's SO dumb how the rules dictated that underrotated jumps should receive -GOE. If a skater cleanly lands an underrotated Triple, they've done more than a double. Or even if the skater does a << Triple, they still shouldn't get PENALIZED for it in comparison to doing just a double. This is one of the several ways in which CoP makes absolutely no sense mathematically. And it creates stupid competition results like this.

  10. #505
    Down With It
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    ^ I don't agree with you often, but took the words right out of me in that case

  11. #506
    Custom Title Cherryy's Avatar
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    Man, I'm so sorry for Caroline, she looked heartbroken. I'm glad the audience reacted the way they should have and I hope Caroline knows a lot of people liked her program, just look at this thread.

    So now it's pretty much obvious Ashley is going to worlds, the second one will be pobably Agnes or Mirai, unless they both bomb and Christina has a great performance. The judges won't give the second spot to Courtney, no matter how well she skates when the spots for the Olympics are on the line, which is somehow reasonable considering she has never skated in a senior international competition.
    We know that ice is slippery but sadly there's probably now way Gracie can place 2nd or even 3rd. I can't imagine her getting 12 points more in the long than Agnes or Mirai. But there's a way she can place 4th and go to 4cc.
    The scoring was really weird.

  12. #507
    Custom Title Gymfan15's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by willdu View Post
    Judging by ""Gymfan" it's probably United States Artistic Gymnastics? Or USA Gymnastics? Commonly used acronym for gymnastics.
    You're right; my main sport is showing, lol. USFS is what I meant.

  13. #508
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gymfan15 View Post
    Eh, I say. Pile on the pressure. I'm very lukewarm when it comes to Mirai...I adore her, have always adored her, but these last few years have been nothing but a frustration. USAG cannot afford to keep their skaters comfortable and make everything a pleasant experience...that's how we've had some epic meltdowns at Worlds.

    It is fairly safe to say that Ashley Wagner is now someone that USAG can be fairly confident in to pull off a respectable performance. For everyone else, though, it remains to be seen. If Mirai has got her act together enough to go to Worlds and not embarrass herself, then she might as well go knowing that she was able to handle the pressure of Nationals. If she can't pull it off here, she is NOT going to do it there. If her nerves are going do her in, it's better that it happens at Nationals when only a Worlds berth is on the line, rather at Worlds where an entire athlete's ticket to the Olympics rides on her shoulders.

    Same goes for Gracie, Agnes, and yes, Ashley (although I'm more comfortable watching her skate, although I hesitate to say that in fear of jinxing her, haha!). If they can't handle the pressure of Nationals, then I've no interest in adding any more gray hairs to my head by watching them at Worlds.

    Sorry if that sounds a little harsh, but as you can tell I'm a bit frustrated with my girls at the moment! USA has SO MANY beautiful, talented skaters that have every right to be the best in the world, but they CANNOT GET IT TOGETHER in competition. It's driving me insane.
    I don't worry much when Ashley skates. At least she doesn't hold back and attacks the ice unlike Mirai or Alissa who look petrified at times when the pressure is on. Same with Agnes who needs to prove she can handle the pressure too. Ashley's problems in the past have been she almost wanted it to much. But no one will ever say she doesn't got for it. If only more of our girls had that mentality.
    Last edited by Jammers; 01-26-2013 at 09:27 AM.

  14. #509
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    Sigh, those scores for Caroline Zhang are heartbreaking. She should have gotten credit for 3Lo+3Lo< , with no -GOE. The -GOE on the Triple Flip was also too much. AND she also only got a Level 3 call on her Flying Camel when it was CLEARLY Level 4???

    She was actually a bit overscored for the Layback spin, though. LOL.

    All of which leads me to believe she was judged based on past performances/practice rather than the program that was actually skated. I did not see more then the allowable .25 on the loops...however, someone here says that the primary UR was on the take off. Maybe so, but I sure can't find it.

  15. #510
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    Quote Originally Posted by shallow edging View Post
    Ugh, you're supposed to take off with around half pre-rotation on a loop. If you don't it's a take-off flaw, if you look at the skaters who have very consistent and high quality triple loops like Mao Asada she does pre rotate by about half a turn. On the other hand if you look at Kim Yu-Na's loop which has been proven inconsistent, she takes off with a quarter. So no, unless it's a toe jump you can't say that pre rotation is grounds for a downgrade unless it's an insanely cheated salchow.
    It has been about 100 years since I did a triple loop, but you are correct. There is naturally pre rotation-at least for most of us. (I'm seeing it in my head and feeling it, and yes, there is pre-rotation on the arc of the takeoff-too much arc and splat, so that problem takes care of itself.)

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