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Thread: 2013 US Nationals Senior Ladies LP

  1. #466
    skating philosopher Mrs. P's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImaginaryPogue View Post
    Are you asking me who I felt had two great skates at Nationals? If so, the answer is no one.
    Actually, all things considered, I think a few skaters had two great skates. They were just not the top contenders. For their potential/ability/etc: I think Courtney Hicks, Yasmin Siraj and Samantha Cesario had two great skates.

    And I'd argue that skaters 4 to 12 had great skates last night. I think that's what made the top three poor performances so disappointing.

  2. #467
    Banned Reginald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImaginaryPogue View Post
    Are you asking me who I felt had two great skates at Nationals? If so, the answer is no one.

    If you're asking me what equals brilliance, I'd argue attack, technical strength, strong choreography and performance skills together can make brilliance.
    Do you think that Ashley's long program was the second best of the night?

  3. #468
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leafygreens View Post
    What's wrong with that?
    Are you asking what's wrong with fans not wanting to pay money to see a figure skating contest? Or what's wrong with no one wanting to sponsor figure skating coverage on television?

    What's wrong with that is this: with no money coming in except from parents of skaters, the sport will become ever the more folded in on itself to the exclusion of both fans and participants.

    If it's that big of a deal, why doesn't the ISU get rid of the SP?
    A good question. I think it deserves serious discussion.

    It's not the federation's or scoring system's fault if fans are too stupid to know there's an SP or pay attention to the results...

    If fans are sooo frustrated then maybe they should watch the entire broadcast or buy tickets to the SP too.
    That is the iSU's attitude toward its fans, IMHO. The skating establishment is cutting off its nose to spite its face.

    No, wait. I mean, they are biting the hand that feeds them.

    Or do I mean, he who pays the piper calls the tune?

  4. #469
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    Actually, all things considered, I think a few skaters had two great skates. They were just not the top contenders. For their potential/ability/etc: I think Courtney Hicks, Yasmin Siraj and Samantha Cesario had two great skates.

    And I'd argue that skaters 4 to 12 had great skates last night. I think that's what made the top three poor performances so disappointing.
    Then in a balanced judging system, they should have won.

  5. #470
    skating philosopher Mrs. P's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reginald View Post
    Then in a balanced judging system, they should have won.
    Noticed I said for their potential/ability. That's not the same as saying they should have won or are the best of the field.

  6. #471
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    Noticed I said for their potential/ability. That's not the same as saying they should have won or are the best of the field.
    Do you think that Ashley's long program was the second best of the night?

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    Wow. I just recently started watching figure skating again after the 2010 Olympics, and I thought the judging was hilarious. More hilarious than probably any US Nationals I have ever watched. I'm not too familiar with any of these skaters, but in the SP, I saw skaters that did triple triples successfully and were otherwise clean, and yet they were all behind Ashley, who skated an average program. Then, in the LP, I saw a bunch of skaters skating totally clean programs, I saw a few skaters attempting triple triples, then I see Ashley who skates an average program with two falls get the win. I have no idea who Ashley is, maybe she has a great reputation and whatnot, but in my mind, there is no justification whatsoever for allowing her to win in that situation. Even Michelle Kwan, the most decorated skater in the history of US figure skating, would never have been allowed to win Nationals with 2 falls.

    I can't understand it. I think it's extremely unfair to all the girls that worked just as hard, put in all those years of grueling training, and managed to stay on their feet and give clean performances at Nationals. It left a really bad taste in my mouth.

  8. #473
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    Quote Originally Posted by cheerio2 View Post
    Wow. I just recently started watching figure skating again after the 2010 Olympics, and I thought the judging was hilarious. More hilarious than probably any US Nationals I have ever watched. I'm not too familiar with any of these skaters, but in the SP, I saw skaters that did triple triples successfully and were otherwise clean, and yet they were all behind Ashley, who skated an average program. Then, in the LP, I saw a bunch of skaters skating totally clean programs, I saw a few skaters attempting triple triples, then I see Ashley who skates an average program with two falls get the win. I have no idea who Ashley is, maybe she has a great reputation and whatnot, but in my mind, there is no justification whatsoever for allowing her to win in that situation. Even Michelle Kwan, the most decorated skater in the history of US figure skating, would never have been allowed to win Nationals with 2 falls.

    I can't understand it. I think it's extremely unfair to all the girls that worked just as hard, put in all those years of grueling training, and managed to stay on their feet and give clean performances at Nationals. It left a really bad taste in my mouth.
    You and me both.

  9. #474
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reginald View Post
    Do you think that Ashley's long program was the second best of the night?
    the judges didn't even think she was 2nd best in the LP - didn't she come in third.

    *gasp* the same sort of results happened in 6.0 OMG! what is this world coming to?!

  10. #475
    skating philosopher Mrs. P's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reginald View Post
    Do you think that Ashley's long program was the second best of the night?
    Yes, but by default. On a good night, that program would be the best by far. Yes, she had those two falls, but that doesn't change that she scored high levels on her non-jump elmements, still performed the choreography fairly well (though I'm sure your opinion differs). She can score 128+ on that program, so it makes sense that she scored 121+ with her errors.

    Courtney Hicks has the jumps, but lacks the refinement. Christina and Caroline lost on non-jump elements.

    Actually you could make a case that Samantha and Yasmin should have score a few more points in PCS....but I still think it wouldn't come close to that 121 mark.

  11. #476
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    the judges didn't even think she was 2nd best in the LP - didn't she come in third.

    *gasp* the same sort of results happened in 6.0 OMG! what is this world coming to?!
    No, she was second in the LP.

    And when in 6.0 did you hear people arguing that the 11th placed skater should have won?

  12. #477
    "Hold an edge and look sexy!" museksk8r's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cheerio2 View Post
    Even Michelle Kwan, the most decorated skater in the history of US figure skating, would never have been allowed to win Nationals with 2 falls.
    Interesting you say that, because Michelle Kwan did just that in 2000 when she fell once in the SP on a 3toe and once in the LP on a 3loop attempt to defeat Sasha Cohen and Sarah Hughes.
    Last edited by museksk8r; 01-27-2013 at 02:53 PM.

  13. #478
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    Quote Originally Posted by leafygreens View Post
    I can't believe people are saying Gracie should have won. Did nobody watch the SP?

    Also, the fluff pieces and commentary on Gracie throughout the SP were a bit nauseating. If she wants the attention then she needs to earn it, by performing in the SP like she did in the LP. Then next year do the fluff pieces.
    Totally agree. Also, while her jumps were spectacular in the LP, I hope in the future she can work on connecting with the music and audience a bit better. I imagine she was v. nervous last night, but she looked a bit stiff and wooden compared to, say, Hannah Miller, who's such a lyrical skater and who projects so much joy and warmth.

  14. #479
    :) aftertherain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reginald View Post
    No, she was second in the LP.

    And when in 6.0 did you hear people arguing that the 11th placed skater should have won?
    You do have an inclination to misunderstand people when it involves your favorite skaters.Tonichelle's point was that skaters who were deemed favorable in the judges' eyes won and were propped up, even in the 6.0 system. She never said anything about 11th placed skaters (Caroline) that "should have won".

  15. #480
    Spiral Lover tulosai's Avatar
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    I think a lot of these posts saying certain skaters are done/should retire (Mirai, Caroline, Christina in particular) are ridiculous. None of them are 20 yet. If they choose to, and with some hard work and luck, they could well remain in the sport and in contention for 2018 regardless of what happens this year and next. It's not like Mirai's career has to be over unless she says she wants it to be- she could be in the mix for many years to come.

    Guess I am in the minority but I wish USFSA would send Gao/Wagner to worlds. I actually think that may be our best chance of 3 spots. Gao was seriously lowballed. I think she should have been third.
    Last edited by tulosai; 01-27-2013 at 03:04 PM.

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