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Thread: 2013 US Nationals Senior Ladies LP

  1. #481
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    She never said anything about 11th placed skaters (Caroline) that "should have won".
    I can't say Caroline should have won, but she warmed the cockles of my wee heart.

  2. #482
    :) aftertherain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    I can't say Caroline should have won, but she warmed the cockles of my wee heart.
    ... Scott Hamilton and I cried together.

  3. #483
    :) aftertherain's Avatar
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    Protocols: http://www.usfigureskating.org/leade...0/results.html

    Free Skates of the Top 12:

    1. Ashley Wagner - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgsQhWNP2t8
    2. Gracie Gold - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IU78A1ezsJA (Second highest FS score at Nationals after Sasha Cohen in 2006!)
    3. Agnes Zawadzki - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jGvxPJ5kTI
    4. Courtney Hicks - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uk7VhedT2zk
    5. Christina Gao - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dC6TRVzTik (Fifth ... Again.)
    6. Yasmin Siraj - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0Rsb6UXIn0
    7. Mirai Nagasu - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HeFWQROmYA ( ) -- Thanks for the link, yuki!
    8. Samantha Cesario - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPoy2XEGtWQ
    9. Angela Wang - No video yet. (Did you see that 3Lz+3T+2T though? Wow! -- Shizuka Arakawa ... come baaaack!)
    10. Hannah Miller - No video yet.
    11. Caroline Zhang - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zl9oqmW7NE4 ()
    12. Ashley Cain - No video yet.

  4. #484
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    Quote Originally Posted by museksk8r View Post
    Interesting you say that, because Michelle Kwan did just that in 2000 when she fell once in the SP on a 3toe and once in the LP on a 3loop attempt to defeat Sasha Cohen and Sarah Hughes.
    You're overlooking the fact that Sasha and Sarah both fell in the LP too. And in the LP, Kwan actually completed more clean triples than either of them, if I recall correctly. So not the same situation at all.

  5. #485
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    I can't say Caroline should have won, but she warmed the cockles of my wee heart.
    She was splendid, wasn't she? She has a grace and musicality that integrates her program and gives it magnetism.

  6. #486
    Down With It
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    Wow, wow, wow. That was UGLY!

    In the end, Wagner "defended" her title, but she hardly did so in convincing fashion. I have a hard time saying she was gifted the win, though- because you have to consider the SP as well. Wagner did what she had to do, while Gold had a fall AND a singled axel. in fact, some people were even saying Gold's SP score was generous...

    The more accurate thing to say is that Wagner backed into the win - or got TREMENDOUSLY lucky that the two skaters that could have easily passed her also failed to seize the moment. Only Gold did - but then, she was 13 points back in the short, and at the end of the day it was just a WEE BIT too much ground to cover.

  7. #487
    Custom Title yuki's Avatar
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    Found Mirai's LP (complete with misspelled name): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HeFWQROmYA

  8. #488
    "Hold an edge and look sexy!" museksk8r's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cheerio2 View Post
    You're overlooking the fact that Sasha and Sarah both fell in the LP too. And in the LP, Kwan actually completed more clean triples than either of them, if I recall correctly. So not the same situation at all.
    I never said Cohen and Hughes were perfect. You, however, said Kwan never would have won with 2 falls at Nationals when, in fact, she did. None of the contenders in 2013 was perfect either when you look at both programs.

  9. #489
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    Protocols: http://www.usfigureskating.org/leade...0/results.html

    Free Skates of the Top 12:

    1. Ashley Wagner - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgsQhWNP2t8
    2. Gracie Gold - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IU78A1ezsJA (Second highest FS score at Nationals after Sasha Cohen in 2006!)
    3. Agnes Zawadzki - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jGvxPJ5kTI
    4. Courtney Hicks - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uk7VhedT2zk
    5. Christina Gao - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dC6TRVzTik (Fifth ... Again.)
    6. Yasmin Siraj - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0Rsb6UXIn0
    7. Mirai Nagasu - No video yet. ( )
    8. Samantha Cesario - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPoy2XEGtWQ
    9. Angela Wang - No video yet. (Did you see that 3Lz+3T+2T though? Wow! -- Shizuka Arakawa ... come baaaack!)
    10. Hannah Miller - No video yet.
    11. Caroline Zhang - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zl9oqmW7NE4 ()
    12. Ashley Cain - No video yet.
    Thanks SO much! I am thrilled to see Caroline and Samantha Cesario skate again, and as soon as I watch a few more of the guys on TV, I'll head over to Gao and Gold.

  10. #490
    Custom Title bekalc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sillylionlove View Post
    Here is my take on last night....the judges did what they thought they needed to do in order to get 3 spots at the Olympics. Ill leave the rest of the thoughts to myself.
    If the USFSA wants to take other things into consideration, that's fine. I frankly think other things SHOULD be taken into consideration. But at least be honest about your process. Take the Russians for example they judged Russian Nationals fairly and put Menshov above Kovtun. And then said look we think Kovtun is a better shot at Europeans... He's our future, and really (other than Plush maybe is their best shot at a top 10 finish) (I'm sure names are being spelled wrong)They took criticism for it, but given Kovtun placed the highest of the Russian men at Europeans, with a top 5 finish, I think they are right. (Short and Long term)

    My concern with Wagner too, is this is the second disasterous free she's had (straight). And Gold has been hit or miss all season, so giving her such PCS over a Gao... Although I do think Gold has the most potential of the US girls, so I get that they are also thinking long term.

    The US system is ridiculous right now because its not even really very honest.
    Last edited by bekalc; 01-27-2013 at 04:20 PM.

  11. #491
    Rinkside
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    Caroline just doesn't have the skating skills or technique to compete at the high level. Her PCS have not matured, and she is still skating extremely slowly, even if not quite as slow as a couple of years ago. Add to that the fact that she's lost some of her flexibility, which was her strength, and she's lost grace as she's grown. And add to that the fact that jumps aren't her strong point either, so is it any surprise she comes so low down?

    As for the rest, I prefer Mirai to Ashley, but Mirai's performance deserved those scores. It's annoying to read people say "Skater X fell once and came 99743th whereas Skater Y fell three times and won." It doesn't work like that. Perhaps it's time for a skating version of the tennis "Hawkeye", so audiences can be shown underrotations. Or better commentators pointing them out.

  12. #492
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Ashley was touted as brave and pretty darn good at GPF now that same event for her is considered a disaster? Come on people if we want to see the judges show consistency shouldnt we also?

  13. #493
    :) aftertherain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    Ashley was touted as brave and pretty darn good at GPF now that same event for her is considered a disaster? Come on people if we want to see the judges show consistency shouldnt we also?
    Probably because the fall on her hip (hip pointer?) looked really, really painful.

  14. #494
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    But my point is that she was praised all the way up to last night about that LP. Now it's being used against her by some to say the last two showings were subpar. IMO only nationals was subpar for her.

  15. #495
    :) aftertherain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    But my point is that she was praised all the way up to last night about that LP. Now it's being used against her by some to say the last two showings were subpar. IMO only nationals was subpar for her.
    Were those the same people who were praising her about being brave though? I've observed that a lot of the posters who praise skaters and the turn around and criticize them aren't the same ones as those who post try to positive comments amidst their shortcomings. It often seems that way because the slather on the negativity. I'm not saying this happens all the time, but I do feel like it happens enough to make others frustrated.

    I honestly don't know how I feel about the ladies' event here. Everything seems all over the place to me.
    Last edited by aftertherain; 01-27-2013 at 05:16 PM.

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