Kaetlyn vs Adelina vs Liza vs Gracie | Page 2 | Golden Skate

Kaetlyn vs Adelina vs Liza vs Gracie

gmyers

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 6, 2010
Osmond did not fail under pressure there though. She simply wasnt that good a skater yet and wasnt a contender yet, not even amongst juniors. Keep in mind she skated well at NAtionals that year too and finished behind LaCoste and washed up Phaneuf so she just didnt have the PCS and quality needed yet, so her low finish at World Juniors is not a sign of crumbling to pressure. Sotnikova on the other hand was supposed to win that World Juniors and lost to both Liptniskaya and Gold, so she, not the not yet that competitive Osmond, is the one who crumbled under pressure.

I though everyone believed lipnitskaya was going to win. Sotnikova had been crumbling that season in the gp. Two bronzes but huge problems.
 

bekalc

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 1, 2006
Gold has pretty wide appeal it would seem. I think she has good body line, good basics, and is really trying to listen to the music and perform. She also does more with transitions in comparison to the Russian girls. It's not there yet but if she puts it all together I could see her being the best. Her 3Lutz in the SP is potentially a clear advantage over Adelina, who's only doing 3Toe in comparison.


Great body line, performing? I see a girl who moves her arms like an air plane (except for a few choregraphic movements) and uses her upper body in a quite heavy like manner.. I also see a few plastered smiles, but absolutely no geninune connection with the music, or geniune connection to the program...And if you compare said smiles to the smiles I saw from Tukt/Sotnikova at Euros-I wouldn't say much there either..
 
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sky_fly20

Match Penalty
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
are we just talking for 2013 Worlds ?

well if its for 2018 I wont count out Julia
also Elena, Karen and Serafima

Julia has the potential to be the best amongst all of them
 

chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
If you saw Gold's Nationals FS performance you wouldn't be so fast to dismiss her. 3f/3t, 2a/3t, 3lo, 2a, 3z, 3fe+3t+3t, 3s. She does all the triples except 3a, but she can be inconsistent.
Gold may lip, but Osmond and Sotnikova flutz.
Osmond has had one clean FS (Challenge, against much lesser skaters) out of 4 this season---no better than Gold's record. In her FS, she has no 3/3 or 3lo and only one 3z. Technically, she is the weakest of the four.
Sotnikova's 3/3 at Euros was scored 3z+3t< and she singled her flip. She does all the triples, but hasn't had a clean FS all season.
Tuktamysheva neither flutzes nor lips, she has a clean 3z+3t, and she does all the triples, but she can be somewhat inconsistent.
 

bekalc

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 1, 2006
If you saw Gold's Nationals FS performance you wouldn't be so fast to dismiss her. 3f/3t, 2a/3t, 3lo, 2a, 3z, 3fe+3t+3t, 3s. She does all the triples except 3a, but she can be inconsistent.
Gold may lip, but Osmond and Sotnikova flutz.
Osmond has had one clean FS (Challenge, against much lesser skaters) out of 4 this season---no better than Gold's record. In her FS, she has no 3/3 or 3lo and only one 3z. Technically, she is the weakest of the four.
Sotnikova's 3/3 at Euros was scored 3z+3t< and she singled her flip. She does all the triples, but hasn't had a clean FS all season.
Tuktamysheva neither flutzes nor lips, she has a clean 3z+3t, and she does all the triples, but she can be somewhat inconsistent.


I did see Gracie's free program at Nationals. I agree she has gorgeous jumps. Probably the biggest of them all. She seems to have good speed but the rest of her skating is meh. I'm dismissing the she has great body line, wonderful performance ability, schpeel. It could change but right now if all went clean, I'd absolutely give it to Sotnikova. Even Tukt has better presentation IMO. This doesn't mean Gold can't work on it but right now.....Wonderful performance/beautiful artistry Gold doesn't have.

(amazing jumps yes, I never argued Gold didn't have amazing jumps) This isn't pole vaulting.. Things like spins, positions, footwork should matter too, which is why I go with Sotnikova who has plenty of jump height and has the rest all over Gold.
 
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chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
True osmond Has only done nebelhorn and skate Canada and if she does 4cc it will be the biggest stage so far. But whoever she has faced she has beaten. If she beats Mao at 4cc if she goes that would be something.

She beat 9 skaters at SC, and at Nebelhorn she edged Sotnikova and a lot of European also-rans. Somehow I don't think that quite equates to beating Mao on Mao's home ice.
 

chuckm

Record Breaker
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Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
(amazing jumps yes, I never argued Gold didn't have amazing jumps) This isn't pole vaulting.. Things like spins, positions, footwork should matter too, which is why I go with Sotnikova who has plenty of jump height and has the rest all of Gold.

At Nationals, Gracie got L4 on two of three spins (the other was L3) and L4 on her footwork.
 

bekalc

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 1, 2006
At Nationals, Gracie got L4 on two of three spins (the other was L3) and L4 on her footwork.

:lol: This was nationals.....Lets see her get a level 4 by an international panel. Like Kostner, Sotnikova have managed. I did like her last spin though.
 
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koatcue

Medalist
Joined
Aug 31, 2011
Country
Russia
I think Gold is going to be something:jaw: Her jumps are amazing) So I don't think she is the worst of these girls..
To tell the truth,I think Liza is a little bit worse in terms of all-around, I hope she'll work on her ice coverage - now it hurts her pcs A LOT
And Osmond..I think she can compete with each of these skaters here, but her jumps should be harder+her spins.But what she has now is a nice attack when she skates - she dances through her programs
 

sky_fly20

Match Penalty
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
I think Gold is going to be something:jaw: Her jumps are amazing) So I don't think she is the worst of these girls..
To tell the truth,I think Liza is a little bit worse in terms of all-around, I hope she'll work on her ice coverage - now it hurts her pcs A LOT
And Osmond..I think she can compete with each of these skaters here, but her jumps should be harder+her spins.But what she has now is a nice attack when she skates - she dances through her programs

Gracie has almost has everything I agree, she just needs polishing and more expreince
yes this what I notice since from Liza , she needs to cover more distance on the ice like her teammates Adelina and Julia
 

wallylutz

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
If you saw Gold's Nationals FS performance you wouldn't be so fast to dismiss her. 3f/3t, 2a/3t, 3lo, 2a, 3z, 3fe+3t+3t, 3s. She does all the triples except 3a, but she can be inconsistent.
Gold may lip, but Osmond and Sotnikova flutz.
Osmond has had one clean FS (Challenge, against much lesser skaters) out of 4 this season---no better than Gold's record. In her FS, she has no 3/3 or 3lo and only one 3z. Technically, she is the weakest of the four.
Sotnikova's 3/3 at Euros was scored 3z+3t< and she singled her flip. She does all the triples, but hasn't had a clean FS all season.
Tuktamysheva neither flutzes nor lips, she has a clean 3z+3t, and she does all the triples, but she can be somewhat inconsistent.

Chuck, put things in perspective, Gold skated after finishing 9th in the SP. Even Scott and Sandra thought she was skating without pressure, aka. consolation prize. When Osmond skated without pressure at the Challenge because she already qualified - she merely took part for the experience - she skated clean SP and LP. Lots of girls can skate clean or almost clean when they are not under pressure. Finishing 9th after the SP tends to take a lot of pressure off skaters because generally speaking, chance of making the podium is quite slim. Gold's track record is quite mixed internationally and when she is under pressure, like in the SP. It remains to be seen how she handles pressure because she hasn't won any ISU Senior event yet or even the Nationals, which all other 3 girls in this thread have already done.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
All I can say, is I'm happy that each of them had key moments at their respective Nationals/Europeans and I'm excited to see all four at Worlds and how they will stack up against each other. And with that, I shall depart from this thread.
 

wallylutz

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
I think all 4 girls have their respective strengths and weaknesses. It remains to be seen how they develop from here. Fortunately, they will meet each other this year at Worlds, this is very exciting.
 

Lucky Star

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 27, 2009
Lots of girls can skate clean or almost clean when they are not under pressure.
This. That's why I think we should wait and see. When Gold skated under the pressure of expectations (Skate Canada) - she bombed, and later (Cup of Russia) she had nothing to loose because GPF was already out of reach and skated better. Same with Nationals. As for Osmond, we haven't seen her under pressure yet. She was a dark horse at Skate Canada and had absolutely nothing to loose (and her FS wasn't perfect by the way), and hardly had any rival at Canadian Nationals. At 4CC and especially Worlds in Canada the expectations will be higher, the rivals much stronger and the pressure is going to be big. Let's see how she does.
As for Adelina and Liza, I think they are going the right direction and handled the pressure well at Europeans, but Worlds will be a real test
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
I did see Gracie's free program at Nationals. I agree she has gorgeous jumps. Probably the biggest of them all. She seems to have good speed but the rest of her skating is meh. I'm dismissing the she has great body line, wonderful performance ability, schpeel. It could change but right now if all went clean, I'd absolutely give it to Sotnikova. Even Tukt has better presentation IMO. This doesn't mean Gold can't work on it but right now.....Wonderful performance/beautiful artistry Gold doesn't have.

(amazing jumps yes, I never argued Gold didn't have amazing jumps) This isn't pole vaulting.. Things like spins, positions, footwork should matter too, which is why I go with Sotnikova who has plenty of jump height and has the rest all over Gold.

I have no idea why you think Sotnikova would win so easily if all skated cleanly. She might win, but it wouldnt be a blowout, all these girls would only be in the 5-8 range at Worlds if it was a cleanly skated event anyway, so their scores wouldnt be that far apart. Sotnikova's SP at Nationals was clean and she lost the short program to Tukt who hard a harder triple-triple quite easily. I think Osmond would beat her in the SP if both were clean too. In the LP she had her best LP in years and still was easily beaten in it by Tukt (not to mention junior jumping Kostner) and even had she been totally clean would have been virtualy tied with Tukt at Europeans in the LP, and I already noted what happened in the SP when both skated cleanly. Her PCS were barely higher (while light years behind Kostner's) than Tukt in the Europeans SP, not to mention at the Russian Nationals. From seeing your posts relating to Sotnikova though you are an enormous fan of hers and have an impossible time being objective on her.
 
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Cherryy

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 27, 2012
I think what actually matters here is the number of triples they perform, since they all can't rely on PCS. So a better question instead of "who will win if all skate clean" is who is the most likely to skate clean. And it's hard to say at this point but it's definitely not Sotnikova. Even though she's a well-rounded skater and has nice spins, costistency is her problem. On the other hand I find Liza to cope well with the pressure and stress. As somebody has said before, Kaetlyn does not have a hard triple-triple and her jump content is generally the weakest.
Everything will be clearer after 4cc. Winning a medal at Euros is definitely an advantage for Adelina and Elizaveta.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
I think Gracie has the best chance. Money. American power. power, the right body type - graceful yet powerful. A good head on her shoulders. Musical and elegant. ET has problems with pcs. Osmond lacks content and big experience. Adelina is inconsistent (well so is ET).
 

koatcue

Medalist
Joined
Aug 31, 2011
Country
Russia
I think Gracie has the best chance. Money. American power. power, the right body type - graceful yet powerful. A good head on her shoulders. Musical and elegant. ET has problems with pcs. Osmond lacks content and big experience. Adelina is inconsistent (well so is ET).

I think Liza is one of the most consistent here, actually..She had a growth spurt - still deals with it - but it seems that everything is fine now)
 

Jammers

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
Country
United-States
Gracie still lacks refinement and some artistry. Going to another choreographer would do her a lot of good. Having said that if she does learn to become more mature on the ice she will be formidable.
 
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