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Thread: Gold is skating's bright new star

  1. #106
    Miserere Nobis
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldseal11 View Post
    Gracie is an amazing jumper with a world class jumping coach. When is she going to get the "GRACE"?
    She's worked with Marina Zoueva and there's definitely been artistic improvement throughout the season. However, she needs to work on projecting her emotions and controlling her airplane arms, but she'll need to be calm.

  2. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    The would ^^^^^ make more sense if you used the emoticon or even

    ...which is what I suspect you meant.

    Of course, but emoticons are so... in your face, I prefer the subtle way.
    Last edited by Puchi; 01-31-2013 at 12:17 PM.

  3. #108
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    On a forum where English is often someone's third or second language, it's better to be clear than to be subtle. I can assure you that a large part of the complaints moderators receive are for posts that the people who posted them thought were funny, ironic, or sarcastic, or all three.

    Of course, emoticons have their own pitfalls. You'd be surprised how often "laugh" which is this little guy is interpreted in a negative way, as though the poster were laughing at another poster in a sarcastic way.

    It's too bad really, because nuance & humor enrich written communication, for sure.

  4. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by rvi5 View Post
    [Osmond] Doesn't have a Flip? According to the results at Nebelhorn, SCI, Challenge, and Nationals, she performed the flip alone or in combination a total of 12 times with only one edge call. Admittedly her Lutz is not yet ready.
    At Skate Canada, Kaetlyn got "e" on both flip and lutz, so therefore she was 'futzing'.

  5. #110
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    I believe that's the 1/12 times on the flip rvi5 was referring to. In that same FS where Osmond had an edge call on her flip, she did a clean one too with no edge call. Clearly it was a bit of a fluke, as it was such a close edge call at that by the looks of it (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSBSXEn_Lvs). It's so weird though because she always edge calls on her lutz so the flip should have been on an inside edge. It's rare to have a skater that has edge calls on both flips and lutzes.

  6. #111
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    As per above. Sasha Cohen. It does happen.

  7. #112
    Custom Title FSGMT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    As per above. Sasha Cohen. It does happen.
    Mirai Nagasu, too

  8. #113
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Too true.

  9. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dorispilaski
    The would ^^^^^ make more sense if you used the emoticon or even
    ...which is what I suspect you meant.
    Quote Originally Posted by Puchi View Post
    Of course, but emoticons are so... in your face, I prefer the subtle way.
    This guy is the best one: It means, I like Yuna Kim AND Mao Asada, Gracie Gold AND Elizaveta Tuktamyshiva, Evan Lysacek AND Evgeni Plushenko, Tonya AND Nancy.

  10. #115
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    OMG! I was in the middle of a big post when my laptop crashed, noooo. OK, here's another try.

    Puchi: I, too, prefer the subtlety of written sarcasm without the emoticon.

    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    In ladies skating, most of the legendary women who dominated this sport for a significant period of time tend to be the one who is (was) known for their presence, presentation and aka. artistry. Looking at Kwan and Kim, you'll notice what they have in common is their presence while their style and technical strengths may differ. Neither of them are or were known as the best jumpers of their respective time.

    [...]

    By contrast, ladies who were known as great jumpers seldom dominate this sport. Thinking about the like of Midori Ito, Surya Bonaly, even Mao Asada - jumpers tend to not do as well in the long-term vs. their more artistic oriented counterparts. It's only recently that Asada has started to reinvent herself but certainly prior to the 2010 Olympics, she has been always about her big arsenals more than her presence and the results were disappointing for her (off the podium at 2009 Worlds, failed to win the Olympics in 2010).

    The difference between Osmond and Gold seem to be setting up like this traditional artistry vs. jumps. Osmond is a good jumper, like Kim and Kwan but it's not her biggest selling point. Gold has monstrous jumps when clean, more like Midori Ito, but still lacking passion and presence in her skating. So it begs to ask, how will this play out? Let's just say ice is slippery, a lady who is reliant on big jumps to succeed will bear a higher risk because it is harder to be consistent on jumps than it is on performance. Plus, a lady's ability to jump does fluctuate more over time as we have seen with Mao Asada, not just a puberty problem. Simply put, an artistic skater will have an easier road towards dominating her sport than a jumper, this much is true in the history of figure skating.
    I must say that I disagree with this analysis. The skaters who tend to "dominate" in this sport tend to be those who are technical, artistic, AND consistent. Kwan is memorable because of her astonishing performance abilities, but let's not forget that she started off as a wee little jumping bean...and her career was so successful because she continued to land jumps.

    Also, if YuNa is not considered to be the best jumper of "her time", then who is? For at least the last quad there are a number of posters/fans arguing the point of view that she actually was (in the appropriate thread just over there) - and I happen to agree.

    Midori Ito's spectacular jumping talent was matched by a quaint, joyful presentation style on the ice when she was not distressed with the heavy pressure to win. She was unlucky to have competed for part of her career when her relatively weaker skills in figures were still a major part of competitions. Later on, her rival Kristi Yamaguchi was also no slouch in the technical department.

    Young Mao Asada was a jumping prodigy with her many 3-3's (especially 3-3Loop combos) plus 3A's. However, on closer inspection some of her jumps were marred by flawed edges and/or underrotations and the ISU started cracking down on those. Compare with young YuNa Kim, who by the time she was 13 (or was it 12?) had the full complement of the 5 standard triples with pristine technique. And, like Kwan, although she showed a musical sensitivity early on, it was the strong technical foundation which allowed her to continue to develop and refine her artistic abilities. YuNa Kim was very much a strong jumper, and many would argue that it was her stronger jumping abilities (consistency, speed, clean technique, etc.) that allowed her to achieve greater success in the long run (for now.)

    To me, both Osmond and Gold are well-rounded skaters without any major weakness, and this bodes well for both of them. Gold has the edge in jumps for their power, technique and difficulty; Osmond is a firecracker of a performer. I am very excited for both of them! But, I have to admit, I really love it when a skater has clean, powerful jumps, because they have a beauty all on their own. And, as I described above, I believe that it is generally easier to become a top competitor when you start out with a strong(er) technical foundation; for Gold, it seems like the sky's the limit, whether she wants to work on 3A's next or focus on developing/refining her artistry and presentation abilities (or both.) I think the same with little miss Liza.

    BTW I like this particular segment of Gold's FS: (2:01-2:13) - really love how the jump hits the highlight of that phrase and then when the music comes to a hush she makes a flourish with her arms.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HU6osJzg368&t=2m01s

    ...so yeah. TL;DR = I seem to prefer good jumpers who develop their artistry later.
    Last edited by prettykeys; 01-31-2013 at 11:05 PM.

  11. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by prettykeys View Post
    OMG! I was in the middle of a big post when my laptop crashed, noooo. OK, here's another try.
    You know about the "autosave" feature for recovering lost posts, right?

    http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/sho...have-Auto-Save!!!

  12. #117
    Custom Title prettykeys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    You know about the "autosave" feature for recovering lost posts, right?

    http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/sho...have-Auto-Save!!!
    No, I didn't! Thanks, I will turn that on from now on.

  13. #118
    Rejoicing in the land of Kwan kwanatic's Avatar
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    Gracie's jumps are really big in height and cover good distance, but is it just me or do her landings look a little stiff? I think it may be that unlike most skaters who land with softer knees, she doesn't really bend her knee that much on the landing. Also she checks her landings pretty quickly. A nice two-count hold on her landings would be great and improve her presentation. I may just be that she's rushing a little.

    Just an observation...

  14. #119
    Spiral Lover tulosai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwanatic View Post
    Gracie's jumps are really big in height and cover good distance, but is it just me or do her landings look a little stiff? I think it may be that unlike most skaters who land with softer knees, she doesn't really bend her knee that much on the landing. Also she checks her landings pretty quickly. A nice two-count hold on her landings would be great and improve her presentation. I may just be that she's rushing a little.

    Just an observation...
    I agree 100% especially with the second point. Her air positions are really great and her height is also good, but the exits could be improved on slightly. That said, not sure she has much incentive to improve with the GOEs she's currently getting...

  15. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by tulosai View Post
    I agree 100% especially with the second point. Her air positions are really great and her height is also good, but the exits could be improved on slightly. That said, not sure she has much incentive to improve with the GOEs she's currently getting...
    Maybe not on the jumps as much, but for the sake of presentation and presence, she definitely could work on finishing out her movements, holding positions longer, relaxing her shoulders and arms, and getting deeper into her knees. Right now there is a little bit of the sense that she's rushing her movements, and she just needs to slow down (not literally) and take time to create those "moments" in a program.

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