Where do Zawadzki and Gao go from here? | Page 2 | Golden Skate

Where do Zawadzki and Gao go from here?

mskater93

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 22, 2005
Another thing that struck me beyond the FSSp (and the fact that she could use some time with an ice dance coach) with Christina is that if you look at the protocols, she had very few negatives but very few (none?) 2's and 3's for GOEs which I think translated to a lower PCS than Agnes and Gracie because while it was nice, nothing was really "wow" in the judges estimation. Gracie got a lot of big GOEs on her jumps and Agnes get 2's and 3's on the 3T+3T and the 3Lz. If Christina could get a couple things that were WOW, it might break that plateau for her...just a thought
 

silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Gao's jumps are very nice and the air position is great, but the jumps aren't all that big, and sometimes her ride outs aren't the best. She has very good toe jumps, but the edge jumps aren't as strong, or as big or flowy on the landings. I think her jumps used to seem bigger when she was so tiny and skinny, but now that she's grown up, the jumps don't seem so big. They aren't small by any means, but more moderate size and just very pretty, neat and tidy. I also think Christina probably needs a 3-3 in her FS to be competitive on the big stage too, just because she doesn't rack up much GOE on her spins and while her jumps usually get decent marks, like +1s, +2s and +3s don't really happen for her, on any elements. And then there's the flutz. She has to make up the ground somewhere, and while she's lovely to watch, her skating is subtle so the PCS tend to be modest. I think she can still do 3f-3t, if she did that in her FS and then changed her SP to 3t-3t and a solo 3f, I think she could maybe increasing her scoring potential a bit, plus hitting the 3-3s should help with her PCS.
 

ForeverFish

Medalist
Joined
Aug 21, 2012
Gao's jumps are very nice and the air position is great, but the jumps aren't all that big, and sometimes her ride outs aren't the best. She has very good toe jumps, but the edge jumps aren't as strong, or as big or flowy on the landings. I think her jumps used to seem bigger when she was so tiny and skinny, but now that she's grown up, the jumps don't seem so big. They aren't small by any means, but more moderate size and just very pretty, neat and tidy. I also think Christina probably needs a 3-3 in her FS to be competitive on the big stage too, just because she doesn't rack up much GOE on her spins and while her jumps usually get decent marks, like +1s, +2s and +3s don't really happen for her, on any elements. And then there's the flutz. She has to make up the ground somewhere, and while she's lovely to watch, her skating is subtle so the PCS tend to be modest. I think she can still do 3f-3t, if she did that in her FS and then changed her SP to 3t-3t and a solo 3f, I think she could maybe increasing her scoring potential a bit, plus hitting the 3-3s should help with her PCS.

Agree that she's cutting it close on the triple loop, but that's pretty much it. Her axel and salchow are more than fine, and did you see the amount of ice she covered on her 3-3?
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Gao needs to decide does she go for Oly glory maybe just to skate and give up a year of school or even the first semester - within two weeks of the second semester she should know if she is going to the Olympics and or worlds so she can drop out of school if necessary. She needs to focus. All these girls want to go to the Olympics and there are lesser ones too. But of the known quantities you have Ashley, Gracie, Rachel, Mirai, Carolyn, Agnes, Christine, Alyssa and that doesn't include many other potential great skaters vying for two maybe three spots. Ashley is all but assured of one so you do the math. they need to do something special and fast.
 

Serious Business

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 7, 2011
US ladies always has a need for also-rans to keep the top competitors honest. If being the winner was common, no one would care. And having just a few winners among the absolutely hopeless (think Canadian men's figure skating, where there's Chan and then the riff raff) would be boring, and not particularly conducive to the discipline's long term health. We need ladies like Zawadzki and Gao, and their predecessors like Jenny Kirk, Tonia Kwiatkowski and Holly Cook. The close-but-no-cigars. We know, especially in retrospect, that they would never overshadow the stars of the day. But by golly, they have to try! They have to keep knocking on that door, and make a good show of it, so the audience will actually hold its breath for the real stars coming through. They're there to provide the drama, the substance, the impetus for competition. Without them, US nationals would be a coronation. We'd have an actual ice princess. Our founding fathers bled red, white and blue (it's a disease Thomas Jefferson caught in an unsavory area of Paris) so we can get away from clowns wearing crowns. So you see, it's the patriotic duty of skaters like Zawadzki and Gao to continue competing as long as they're able!
 

mskater93

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 22, 2005
Gao's jumps are very nice and the air position is great, but the jumps aren't all that big, and sometimes her ride outs aren't the best.
This is my point - there's nothing WOW there which keeps her total GOE down and reduces her PCS potential. It's almost like if you do something WOW you get a boost in PCS as well (most likely unconciously)
 

KKonas

Medalist
Joined
Oct 31, 2009
US ladies always has a need for also-rans to keep the top competitors honest. If being the winner was common, no one would care. And having just a few winners among the absolutely hopeless (think Canadian men's figure skating, where there's Chan and then the riff raff) would be boring, and not particularly conducive to the discipline's long term health. We need ladies like Zawadzki and Gao, and their predecessors like Jenny Kirk, Tonia Kwiatkowski and Holly Cook. The close-but-no-cigars. We know, especially in retrospect, that they would never overshadow the stars of the day. But by golly, they have to try! They have to keep knocking on that door, and make a good show of it, so the audience will actually hold its breath for the real stars coming through. They're there to provide the drama, the substance, the impetus for competition. Without them, US nationals would be a coronation. We'd have an actual ice princess. Our founding fathers bled red, white and blue (it's a disease Thomas Jefferson caught in an unsavory area of Paris) so we can get away from clowns wearing crowns. So you see, it's the patriotic duty of skaters like Zawadzki and Gao to continue competing as long as they're able!

Both Gao and Zawadzki are going to 4CC, so despite some technical/artistic issues, both are doing well and hopefully will continue to improve with a few more competitions under their belt.
 

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
And is it actually true that Zawadski would never overshadow the top contenders? Her scores at Nationals were quite strong for what she did, and when she's on, she can earn huge scores. If she hasn't impacted much on the international scene, she hasn't skated that well on the international scene, but the judges have given her her due (she came third at the SC 2010 in the short, for example). I think she'll be kicking around for the next quad. Whether or not she gives herself the opportunities for major glory will be entirely on her, but I wouldn't be surprised to see her sneak on a podium here and there.

Gao.... I don't know. I think she should continue. But I don't know if she'll have the success she had this year.
 

blue_idealist

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 25, 2006
I don't think Zawadzki's in a bad position at all. If Ashley and Alissa retire after Sochi (and possibly even if Alissa doesn't), and Mirai doesn't improve again, she'll automatically be US #2. If Ashley doesn't retire, she'll just have to wait a little longer.. I know there is "risk" of other people overthrowing Agnes from that position but I don't see that happening in the NEAR future. I think Gao will probably retire after Sochi and focus on school no matter if she makes the team or not.
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
Gao's quite young, and it looks like she likes combining skating & training with Mark Mitchell & the SC of Boston krew with Harvard, as she did this year. If that works for her, why should she stop until she after she graduates from college, which probably will not be sooner than 3 years from now?
 
Joined
Aug 16, 2009
Because next year is the Olympics. If she sticks to her formidable schedule, she will be an impressive all-round accomplished young woman who is an ivy-league student and a top-five skater in her country. A place for everything, and everything in its place. This may not be enough to vault her over the other skaters in her own country (none of whom currently have top-three world rankings), let alone the top three world skaters. To do that, she may have to give a little more to the athlete side of her currently balanced scholar-athlete equation.
 

momskate

Rinkside
Joined
May 4, 2012
"there is something lacking in Gao's skating"
TIME, tha's what is lacking in my opinion. She is full time student, too busy for full time figure skating
 

silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Christina has actually improved since going to Harvard though. Her consistency especially, but her 2a is also better, as is her stamina, and her speed and posture are much improved. In some ways I think being a full-time student helps Christina with the mental/competitive aspect just because she doesn't have time to worry or obsess much over her skating and other competitors, so that likely leads her to be less nervous and just go out and skate. So far this season, that seems to have paid off for her. I think if Christina can bring back the 3f-3t and work on improving her flexibility and spins, then she can be a real contender. No, her jumps aren't going to get +2s and +3s for GOE, but they are still beautiful and usually get +1s which combined with her consistency and ability to almost always get full rotation on them, is going to work in her favor. I think people would see her as more "WOW" if she could bring back the 3f-3t and then have better spins and flexibility/lines, it would just make her stand out more, and I think part of the reason her PCS tend to be modest is because she's a subtle and quiet skater, but with these changes, she can turn into a, I don't want to say flashy, but more striking or powerful skater. Just my two cents, but honestly she has every quality she needs to be at the top, it's just a matter of finding a way to effectively channel and deliver it.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
I think Gao is too much like a Yu Na Kim lite. It is never good to mimick a skater you are never going to be as great as. I think if she can find her own niche and look, and not look like she is trying to be Yu Na Kim, she can do better and possibly make a World team down the road. It is similar to how Leonova used to be a poor womens version of a young Slutskaya, and she never would have come close to a World podium if she didnt transform herself into her own skater, knowing she was never going to be anywhere near as good as Slutskaya, especialy at a similar style of skating, look, and having the same strengths, so she needed something else.
 

clairecloutier

Final Flight
Joined
Aug 27, 2003
You know, I used to feel the same, that Christina was like a mini-Yuna. It makes sense. She trained with Yuna for a year or two, and there are similarities between them: both Asian, both somewhat tall and long-legged (for skaters), both somewhat reserved in their expression on the ice. It's only natural she would look up to Yuna and emulate her. But I think Christina's starting to find her own way and develop her own persona. This year's tango long program was different; it wasn't like something Yuna would do. Yuna is more about fast, sweeping movement on the ice, Christina is more about delicate expression and detail. Just my opinion. I do agree Christina needs to keep on developing her own style on the ice and bringing out her own personality. That's going to be very important going forward. She needs that same kind of "breakout" program/performance that Ashley had last year at Nationals with Black Swan.
 
Joined
Jan 22, 2004
Another Nationals and nothing has changed status quo with these two. Gao continues (and this year more than ever) to be overlooked and even blatantly held down at times by National judges, and Zawadzki continues to slam herself down, especialy in the long program. Will either of these two wonderfully talented skaters who should be part of the U.S future along with people like Gold and Hicks, ever fulfill their immense promise. Will the judges, especialy in the U.S, ever allow Gao to; and will Zawadzki ever allow herself to.

I don't understand this thread. They are both on the right track, slowly improving and moving in the right direction.

Gao lacks basics but she's slowly getting there. Zawadzki has been a little more consistent this season and I feel she's learning to control her jumps better.
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
I hope Gold & Wagner secure 3 places for the Olympics so that there will be a little more opportunity for all.

I hope Christina continues to train in Boston, though. I thought she improved a lot this year.
 

clairecloutier

Final Flight
Joined
Aug 27, 2003
I hope Gold & Wagner secure 3 places for the Olympics so that there will be a little more opportunity for all.

I hope Christina continues to train in Boston, though. I thought she improved a lot this year.

I hope so too. I can't really imagine her leaving. This has been clearly her most successful year, so it makes sense for her to stay. Plus she seems to enjoy the whole group of skaters & coaches at SC of Boston. The only disadvantage is she'll now have to get an apartment in the (expensive) Boston area as I assume she wouldn't be able to stay in student housing at Harvard.
 
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