Any Ladies training Quads?

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Sotnikova the headcase ? , she cant even land a clean Lutz
Liza has huge height on her 2A and has done 3A in trainings a few seasons ago

Sotnikova has landed her lutz many times this season. Why would you even say that? Liza screwed up her lutz in her Euros SP (and faltered in many short programs this season), and you don't see any of us calling her a headcase.

That being said, I don't think Sotnikova will be capable of a quad, but who knows.

[sky_fly20]

I'm talking about Sotnikova's obvious flutz

[sarahspins]

I believe there was another girl who tried a quad at some summer comp (Liberty, I think) within the last couple of years, but her name escapes me.

Maybe Chelsea Christopher? She has some 3A and 4T attempts on youtube.

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

So obvious that it was ratified as a clean lutz in every competition she's been in other than Rostelcom?

[FSGMT]

3A might be doable when a girl is prepubescent and weighs less than 90 pounds. It gets harder and more elusive when the girl develops hips and her center of gravity gets lower. Miki Ando got her 3A and 4S ratified at 14, but once she grew, those jumps were never fully rotated. Asada is a smaller-boned woman than Miki, but once she became more curvy, she, too, couldn't rotate the 3A all the way any more.

Men can do 3A and quad because they have a higher center of gravity and they literally lift their bodies with shoulder power. And of course they don't have rounded hips to slow the rotation down.

Ehm... Miki Ando a 3A?!

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Yeah I saw some of Chelsea Christopher's attempts... she is obviously under-rotated but gets great spring and clearly isn't afraid to go for it!

A shame she didn't make it to nationals... her regionals was a pretty great skate.

[chuckm]

Ehm... Miki Ando a 3A?!

Yes, way back in the JGP. Once.

[Serious Business]

If you really want to see females doing quads in competition, a likelier place would be in the pairs competition. With the modern twist lift and throw jump technique, quads must seem tantalizingly doable to elite pairs teams. A few have already landed quads in competition. I'd expect that number to go up.

[FSGMT]

Yes, way back in the JGP. Once.

Really? I didn't know it, great!

[LRK]

I'm curious, it seems to me that the majority opinion is that it wouldn't pay off (at least not currently) for a lady to attempt a quad to try to win a competition - the question then presents itself, woould someone be willing to try, for instance, a 4t for the Glory of going into the record books? And would the risk of injury while training the thing be worth it?

[dorispulaski]

If you really want to see females doing quads in competition, a likelier place would be in the pairs competition. With the modern twist lift and throw jump technique, quads must seem tantalizingly doable to elite pairs teams. A few have already landed quads in competition. I'd expect that number to go up.

And not so elite pair teams. Vise & Trent USA landed the first quad Salchow throw.

This year, Castelli & Shnapir say they are planning to put in the quad Salchow throw, either at 4CC's or Worlds

Certainly their triple Salchow throw is Huge.

[ForeverFish]

Sotnikova the headcase ? , she cant even land a clean Lutz
Liza has huge height on her 2A and has done 3A in trainings a few seasons ago

Based on Sotnikova's height and power, I wouldn't be surprised to see her land a 3A. She was clean enough to win silver at Euros, so she's clearly improved her consistency.

[Blades of Passion]

As for loop and flip, again, it tends to be a matter of preference whether the skater is an edge jumper or a toe jumper. There are probably almost as many skaters who can do triple flip but not loop as the other way around. It may be that (on average -- everyone is different) men tend to prefer the flip and women the loop. But unless there are going to be completely separate scales of values for each sex, there's no good argument for valuing the flip much higher than the loop.

At one point I felt the same way, based upon my own inclination as a skater towards jumps (I could do 3Flip before 3Loop) and the fact that so many women were completely omitting the Loop jump when CoP started, but further examination has made me feel otherwise.

Let's first start by looking at distant history. Many women in the 1980's were able to do 3Loop, but hardly any could do 3Flip. 3Loop was also performed by Men earlier in history than 3Flip (Dick Button did 3Loop, John Curry's hardest Triple in competition was 3Loop).

Now let's look at recent history, after edge deductions came into play and after < calls became more strict...the Loop is being performed more frequently than the Flip and it tends to score better than the Flip, because of less < calls on it and because of people getting edge deductions on the Flip.

Scientifically the Flip is also harder if looking at how the jumps should ideally be executed. A Flip should pre-rotate less than a Loop, which means a Flip demands more rotation in the air from a skater to complete it properly.

[prettykeys]

Scientifically the Flip is also harder if looking at how the jumps should ideally be executed. A Flip should pre-rotate less than a Loop, which means a Flip demands more rotation in the air from a skater to complete it properly.

Completely neutrally curious...but using the rotational theory, shouldn't a 3T then match the 3Lo? And if not...could it also be said that the mechanics of jump takeoff make rotational force more difficult to achieve on a 3Lo vs. 3T or 3F?

[Blades of Passion]

Completely neutrally curious...but using the rotational theory, shouldn't a 3T then match the 3Lo? And if not...could it also be said that the mechanics of jump takeoff make rotational force more difficult to achieve on a 3Lo vs. 3T or 3F?

Well the amount of rotation needed is just one component. I'd say rotational force is also objectively "harder" to achieve on Flip than Loop, but that a Flip can be "muscled through" more than a Loop...there's a lower upper limit for how much force you can put into a Loop as there is a Flip.