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Thread: Falling on split jumps

  1. #1
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Falling on split jumps

    I don't think I have ever seen a skater fall on a split jump.

    I do not skate myself, but to me it looks like non-rotational jumps like falling leafs (leaves?), Russian split jumps, and stag jumps are non-trivial to say the least. You have to leap as high as for a rotational jump, achieve a full split or some other position, then land on a continuous edge. It looks pretty hard to me, and it certainly can be a choreographic highlight in a program.

    Are these elements easy or hard for skaters at various levels?

    http://www.jbmittan.com/webpix/cohen20616865.jpg

    http://www.jbmittan.com/webpix/rochette20545948.jpg
    Last edited by Mathman; 01-31-2013 at 02:46 PM.

  2. #2
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    I seem to remember Toller Cranston criticizing split jumps as "filler," fit for exhibition programs, when he was doing commentary on some World event. But Toller was amazing, and what he found easy, perhaps others find difficult. OTOH, I don't remember anyone of top level falling on a split jump.

    I still think they are amazing though!

    Michelle's split falling leaf!

    Sasha's Russian splits!

    :swoon:

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    I think they're relatively easy if you can jump high enough and have good flexibility. Skaters at lower levels, or who just don't jump as high because of poorer strength/weight ratio, would get maybe a 90-degree split instead of 180. Less than 90 and they wouldn't put it in a program, or it would just be a basic half-flip jump with the legs a little further apart.

    I can't image falling out of one in the split position because the action in the air is to split the legs apart on the way up and then bring them back together on the way down. If the skater can jump high enough to split 180 degrees to begin with, s/he would also have plenty of time to get the feet more or less under the body before reaching the ice.

    That "more or less" might be less than ideal, might be off balance, in which case the skater might fall on the landing, but it wouldn't be any more dangerous than falling on any other landing. More possibility of falling forward because you land facing forward, but we've seen some bad belly flops on underrotated rotational jumps.

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    These jumps are quite difficult to do well, since they require perfect timing and technique, not to mention strength and flexibility. But they are not something I can recall ever falling on. That's because all you have to do is bring your leg(s) back down in order to save yourself. If there were rotation involved, then you could get tilted in the air or not be able to control rotation, but that isn't the case. I've tried a split flip (1 full revolution with a split in the middle) on the harness and it was about 1000% harder than a regular half rotation split jump. I decided not to try it off the harness.

  5. #5
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gkelly View Post
    half-flip jump
    Is the take-off the same as for a flip?

    Quote Originally Posted by vlaurend View Post
    've tried a split flip (1 full revolution with a split in the middle)...
    That sounds so cool! I suppose no one would do it in competition because it only counts the same a a 1F?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Is the take-off the same as for a flip?
    Yes. Most split jumps are done from a flip takeoff. It can also be done from a lutz or loop (=falling leaf) takeoff.


    That sounds so cool! I suppose no one would do it in competition because it only counts the same a a 1F?
    Under today's rules, yes. It (split flip) would count as a single flip, so even with +3 GOE, which is likely, the base mark is so low that the total value would be not worth the effort.

    Of course, if someone wanted to put it at the end of a program after all the jump boxes were filled anyway, then it would get no points but wouldn't prevent higher-revolution jumps from earning their respective points, and judges could reward it under Transitions, Choreography, etc. But I guess it's still too hard, at least for most skaters who can even do it at all, to be worth the effort.

    In 6.0 days, it was done sometimes in competition. Example

  7. #7
    At the rink. Again. mskater93's Avatar
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    Keegan Messing fell on his at one of the international B's in his choreographic (well, technically he fell coming out of it, but still)

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    You have to land forward on your toe which feels very "trippy." If I'm not directly centered I might trip forward on the landing which is scary.

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