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Thread: Will Asada have the 3A for Worlds?

  1. #46
    Custom Title Cherryy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hikki View Post
    Latest practice at 4CC
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeUTb...ature=youtu.be

    I know it's only practice, and that she needs to focus first on fully rotating the other triples, but there's something so special about seeing her 3A
    Thanks for the link . It looks pretty nice but can some experts tell us whether it was fully rotated?

  2. #47
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    wow,seems very good. I think she got it.

    If she would get 3a, (even if that is not fully rotation)
    She will be strongest in ladies, even though the another jumps are all downgrade
    i think she get good benefits of the changed rule
    I don't agree with the rule of the 70% reward of jumps that are not fully rotated .if they can't rotate the jumps, don't get credit. If they want to make a change, then make a change in the value of the jumps.
    They already tried this though and it has already improved a lot, but this 70% rule I don't like at all.
    If they cannot do clean jumps, then don't even try them.
    this season, her jumps were almost the not fully rotation

    If you do not agree, then refute, or can ignore
    Last edited by venlac; 02-07-2013 at 07:32 AM.

  3. #48
    Custom Title hurrah's Avatar
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    What a fighter. Gooooooo Mao!!

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherryy View Post
    Thanks for the link . It looks pretty nice but can some experts tell us whether it was fully rotated?
    The first one was, surely! I can't judge the second one, because I can't clearly see her foot because of the white writing, the third one was UR, I think.

  5. #50
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    I saw one of her 3As(for 4CC practice) and all I know is that it would get either < or even << mark. I don't think she should jump 3A if she can't get it fully rotated and consistent at practice. It's still nice that she's going for difficult jumps, but still...

    Quote Originally Posted by venlac View Post
    wow,seems very good. I think she got it.

    If she would get 3a, (even if that is not fully rotation)
    She will be strongest in ladies, even though the another jumps are all downgrade
    i think she get good benefits of the changed rule
    I don't agree with the rule of the 70% reward of jumps that are not fully rotated .if they can't rotate the jumps, don't get credit. If they want to make a change, then make a change in the value of the jumps.
    They already tried this though and it has already improved a lot, but this 70% rule I don't like at all.
    If they cannot do clean jumps, then don't even try them.
    this season, her jumps were almost the not fully rotation

    If you do not agree, then refute, or can ignore
    I agree 70% rule IMO is unfair to skaters who actually have fully rotated jumps.

  6. #51
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    Wow the first one looked clean, might get < but either way Go Mao!
    And BTW the 70% rotation rule is one of the best passed by the isu in recent years, It has had a great effect for skaters, before people were afraid to to attempt a difficult element as if they were even slightly over a quarter turn short it was downgraded and there was too much of a risk whether it was a senior man trying his first quad or an intermediate lady trying her first double axel in competition, now a good attempt at least gets more credit than a jump with one less rotation, a sport in which people are afraid to try more difficult elements will never advance...just look at the amount of quads we are now seeing from men and the 3/3s from ladies, there is a big improvement from 2010 (last season without 70%)
    sorry for rambling...bck on topic I think mao should go for it in 4cc and shut her critics up

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by skatel80 View Post
    Wow the first one looked clean, might get < but either way Go Mao!
    And BTW the 70% rotation rule is one of the best passed by the isu in recent years, It has had a great effect for skaters, before people were afraid to to attempt a difficult element as if they were even slightly over a quarter turn short it was downgraded and there was too much of a risk whether it was a senior man trying his first quad or an intermediate lady trying her first double axel in competition, now a good attempt at least gets more credit than a jump with one less rotation, a sport in which people are afraid to try more difficult elements will never advance...just look at the amount of quads we are now seeing from men and the 3/3s from ladies, there is a big improvement from 2010 (last season without 70%)
    sorry for rambling...bck on topic I think mao should go for it in 4cc and shut her critics up
    And, increasing the BV of the 2Lo encourages the skaters to try combos with it, since they are remarkably more difficult than the 2T combos, and we're seeing more 3x+2T+2Lo instead of 3x+2T+2T...

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by FSGMT View Post
    And, increasing the BV of the 2Lo encourages the skaters to try combos with it, since they are remarkably more difficult than the 2T combos, and we're seeing more 3x+2T+2Lo instead of 3x+2T+2T...
    well, after rule changed, 3lz has been reduced a lot in skater's program. (in gpf, even there were not 3lz in women's short program)
    All the skaters so many jump 3lo and 2lo.
    3lo became even similar points with 3f and 2lo points same with 2f
    flip and loop, a similar difficulty jumping is that?
    sorry, I do not know that.

  9. #54
    Custom Title FSGMT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by venlac View Post
    well, after rule changed, 3lz has been reduced a lot in skater's program. (in gpf, even there were not 3lz in women's short program)
    All the skaters so many jump 3lo and 2lo. 3lo became even similar points with 3f
    and 2lo points same with 2f
    flip and loop, a similar difficulty jumping is that?
    sorry, I do not know that.
    It depends, obviously: for Yu-Na, a loop is more difficult than a flip; for Mao, a loop is far easier than a flip!

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by FSGMT View Post
    It depends, obviously: for Yu-Na, a loop is more difficult than a flip; for Mao, a loop is far easier than a flip!
    a joke?
    It does not about Mao and Yuna,
    In point of fact, Basis points should be depending on the difficulty of the jump,
    and 3f is much more difficult jump than 3lo!

    and tomas verner said
    "I love the change about the last step sequence in the free skate. You can do whatever you want. You still need to do steps to showcase your edges and show that you have the ability to do rockers, counters, twizzles etc. and then the judges have a chance to give you GOE credit. I like this very much.

    I don't agree with the rule of the 70% reward of jumps that are not fully rotated . You don't rotate the jumps, you don't get credit. It's done, that's it. If you want to make a change, then make a change in the value of the jumps. They already tried this though and it has already improved a lot, but this 70% rule I don't like at all.
    If you cannot do clean jumps, then don't even try them.Then there is the change that you have to do only one footwork sequence in the short. I love this change."

    I completely agree with him.
    Last edited by venlac; 02-07-2013 at 11:16 AM.

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by FSGMT View Post
    And, increasing the BV of the 2Lo encourages the skaters to try combos with it, since they are remarkably more difficult than the 2T combos, and we're seeing more 3x+2T+2Lo instead of 3x+2T+2T...
    And, before the rule change, 2toe and 2loop difference was 0.2 points, and it was appropriate
    and now, 0.5 point difference and even 2lo the same score with 2f.
    I will say again, lo and f is not a similar level of jump.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by venlac View Post
    I will say again, lo and f is not a similar level of jump.
    What is this assessment based on? I would probably agree with you based on what I know as a fan, but the people who determine the difficulty of these elements know far more than I do.

  13. #58
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    Loop combos... sigh, those just really have a hard time to be called rotated.

    But 4CC is a really good occasion to test the water. I hope Mao hits the 3A and 3-3 well!!

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by drivingmissdaisy View Post
    What is this assessment based on? I would probably agree with you based on what I know as a fan, but the people who determine the difficulty of these elements know far more than I do.
    it means that you admit to all of the judgment in figure skating. because they are experts

    jump's value point is continue to change.
    2002 ~ 2004 ~ 2008 ~ 2010 ~
    3A 7.5 → 7.5 → 8.2 → 8.5 (<6.0)  
    3Lz 6.1 → 6.0 → 6.0 → 6.0 (<4.2)  
    3S 4.8 → 4.5 → 4.5 → 4.2 (<2.9)  
    3Lo 5.3 → 5.0 → 5.0 → 5.1 (<3.6)  
    3F 5.6 → 5.5 → 5.5 → 5.3 (<3.7)  
    3T 4.5 → 4.0 → 4.0 → 4.1 (<2.9)



    example, ~09'10 value point of 3a2t was lower than 3lz3t
    and after olympics, japanese federation had protested, and it has changed.
    i think you hope follow the rule that experts made,
    in 09/10, if i claim "'3a2t' is easier jump than '3lz3t' because of the rule that made by experts know far more than i do" you can admit it?

    and i doubt, you really think it is similar difficulty, loop and flip?
    I'm confused.
    Last edited by venlac; 02-09-2013 at 01:15 PM.

  15. #60
    Custom Title Cherryy's Avatar
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    Here's a link that was posted in the 4cc practice reports thread by hurrah.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-uaZrhXFkM
    At 0:28 you can see the same two 3axels by Mao but without this white thing at the bottom so they're more visible. After 3As the video also shows Mao's 3F-3L.
    From what I can see: the first 3A WAS fully rotated, the second one might have been either rotated or URed but definitely wouldn't have been downgraded. However, her 3F-3L is not looking good. In her first combination the flip is not shown well so I don't know about this jump but the 3L is underrotated. In the second combination the 3F would probably be underrotated and the loop definitely downgraded. I thought Mao would go for the 3F-3T. Her 3T after 2A was looking huuuge at some practises and I believe at one of her competitions. Plus, 3L now will almost always get an underrotation call. And the most important - she's already doing two 3L in her free program and her solo jump in SP is 3L, so there's no sense in practising this combination. Ah, I got confused

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