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Thread: 2013 4CC's Ice Dance SD

  1. #151
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    I like V/M ' s SD at this competition! D/W's SD has been my favorite but now I like both.

  2. #152
    Spiral Lover tulosai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chloepoco View Post
    I think you're right--I really do miss Bates/Samuelson. And along those lines, I have a feeling I won't like the new pairs partnership of Narumi Takahashi with her new partner because I really loved her pairing with Mervin Tran.
    I miss Bates/Samuelson and can't get into C/B so I agree there is some truth to this idea. That said for me, he just really left a bad tast in my mouth with how he split up with Samuelson and I frankly think he is a bad person who doesn't deserve success. This prevents me from enjoying him like I should. I realize this is not fair (at least not entirely) but it is what it is.

  3. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by tulosai View Post
    I miss Bates/Samuelson and can't get into C/B so I agree there is some truth to this idea. That said for me, he just really left a bad tast in my mouth with how he split up with Samuelson and I frankly think he is a bad person who doesn't deserve success. This prevents me from enjoying him like I should. I realize this is not fair (at least not entirely) but it is what it is.
    For the sake of argument, what do we know about how teams get together/split, right? Just saying, maybe things are not the way they seem. But anyway, my main issue with this pairing is that I don't like having dance teams that look like pairs teams. Regardless of chemistry, etc. I love to watch two people "fit together" as they dance, and that's directly linked to proportion and lines. Of course, if the approach is lift focused as opposed to dance geared...

  4. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by golden411 View Post
    In any case, I'm relieved that we're on the same page this time. )
    Thanks! I really appreciate that! No hard feelings!

    Quote Originally Posted by tulosai View Post
    I miss Bates/Samuelson and can't get into C/B
    I like Chock but I don't think Bates is up to snuff with her. The skill and maturity level seems disproportionate between them. I liked C/B's free dance last year but I don't really like either of their programs this year. I think they're solid enough to be the #2 US team but it's a very large gap from them to D/W.

  5. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by tulosai View Post
    I miss Bates/Samuelson and can't get into C/B so I agree there is some truth to this idea. That said for me, he just really left a bad tast in my mouth with how he split up with Samuelson and I frankly think he is a bad person who doesn't deserve success. This prevents me from enjoying him like I should. I realize this is not fair (at least not entirely) but it is what it is.
    I don't blame you---I'm the same. If I feel someone is bad/mean off ice, it has a direct impact on my appreciation for his/her skating. I know I know it should not be that way, but we're all human

  6. #156
    Gambatte, Max Aaron/"No letting off the gas pedal" golden411's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uncchristine99 View Post
    Thanks! I really appreciate that! No hard feelings!
    Happy Valentine's Day to you, unchristine -- and to all!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ilvskating View Post
    I don't blame you---I'm the same. If I feel someone is bad/mean off ice, it has a direct impact on my appreciation for his/her skating. I know I know it should not be that way, but we're all human
    I have had this reaction too, and I agree that it is only human nature.

    A happier perspective on these feelings is that if someone seems to be a good person off the ice, then I am predisposed to become a supporter of his/her skating.

    I sometimes am completely unfamiliar with someone's skating, but start getting the sense from social media, interviews, etc., that he/she has a warm personality, a great sense of humor, and strong friendships with other skaters whom I "know" and like. Positive characteristics like those can motivate me to take an interest in the unfamiliar person's skating.

  7. #157
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Is Evan Bates better than Greg Zuerlein?

  8. #158
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Yes, but Greg choose to retire. There is no evidence whatsoever that he was in any way shuffled off to Buffalo.

    After Greg retired, I am told that Madison had her pick of several partners. She reported at the time that she picked Evan because he was kind.

  9. #159
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    IIRC Evan was one of the four musketeers that roomed together at th University if Michigan, along with Charlie White, Alex Shibutani, and pairs skater (with Andrea Best ) Trevor Young

  10. #160
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    He was. And they must still be good friends, because it was obvious that Charlie was thrilled when Evan and Madison made the podium at U.S. Nationals this year.

  11. #161
    Gambatte, Max Aaron/"No letting off the gas pedal" golden411's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by golden411 View Post
    I have had this reaction too, and I agree that it is only human nature.
    After reading back through the sequence of posts above, I feel the need to add that I was agreeing only with the general notion that off-ice impressions can influence appreciation of someone's skating.

    IMHO, the non-exhaustive body of public knowledge about the demise of the Samuelson/Bates partnership suggests that he did not exactly cover himself with glory. YMMV. OTOH, I have long recognized that the affection of men of honor such as White and Shibutani does speak well for Bates, making it harder for me to believe that he was motivated by "bad" or "mean" intentions. [Edited to clarify my meaning.]

    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    He was. And they must still be good friends, because it was obvious that Charlie was thrilled when Evan and Madison made the podium at U.S. Nationals this year.
    Yes, and other photos showed Davis/White sharing good times with Chock/Bates as they all traveled home from Four Continents.
    Last edited by golden411; 02-17-2013 at 09:49 AM.

  12. #162
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    The exact details are not known.

    But what is known is Madison is a lot smaller than Emily, both shorter, and lighter. I would suggest there is no nice way in public to say, since I have had an injury, I can't lift you well any more because you are too large, and I am not strong enough any more. There is also no nice way to say it in private.

    The whole situation with Emily was sad; such a nice girl, and a beautiful girl, and such nice toe point, too. But how could Evan know if couldn't lift her any more until he tried?

    I am just leaving the whole thing in the "things I probably don't need to know" locker, and just like both skaters, and am sad Emily hasn't found a good partner.

  13. #163
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Breaking up is hard to do.

    Samuelson and Bates had a lot of difficulties after they made the Olympic team in 2010 (and did pretty well, finishing 11th). They left the coaching team that had guided them since they were intermediates and moved to Canton. But they never got a chance to compete under Zoueva and Shpilband because of Evan's injury, which wiped out the entire next season for them. No further details were forthcoming, but they announced before the 2011-12 season that they were seeking new partners.

    If they were having a rough patch it's not hard to imagine that the sudden availability of potential star Madison Chock played a role, especially since Bates and Chock announced their new partnership less than a month later. But I think the break was a year or more in the making.

  14. #164
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    I'm sure that's true, that the break was a year in the making.

  15. #165
    Gambatte, Max Aaron/"No letting off the gas pedal" golden411's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Breaking up is hard to do.

    Samuelson and Bates had a lot of difficulties after they made the Olympic team in 2010 (and did pretty well, finishing 11th). They left the coaching team that had guided them since they were intermediates and moved to Canton. But they never got a chance to compete under Zoueva and Shpilband because of Evan's injury, which wiped out the entire next season for them. No further details were forthcoming, but they announced before the 2011-12 season that they were seeking new partners.

    If they were having a rough patch it's not hard to imagine that the sudden availability of potential star Madison Chock played a role, especially since Bates and Chock announced their new partnership less than a month later. But I think the break was a year or more in the making.
    Agree with Doris that none of us are privy to complete knowledge of what transpired.
    But the likelihood of "a year or more in the making" (my emphasis), as mentioned by Mathman, has been part of what makes me feel that Samuelson deserved better than what happened to her - after waiting basically a full season for Bates to recover from his terrible Achilles injury.
    Thank goodness that she seems like a great person who will have success in all areas of her life. I will leave it there -- with my best wishes to her.
    Last edited by golden411; 02-17-2013 at 03:51 PM.

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