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Thread: 4CC Ladies Free Skate

  1. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlattFan View Post
    You clearly don't understand basic Zayak rule and you tried to school others? The British guys said rotation was fine. Most of us who saw the slow mo think it's fine.
    I understand Zayak rule. They changed the rule, which makes it not a "Basic Zayak Rule" since that one existed since 6.0, almost 30 years ago.

    Which foot touched down first. If the free foot touches down first the jump is almost always called UR. If her free foot touched first, it's almost assuredly why they UR'd her 3A. When you land in a backspin position like that, the chances of the free foot touching down first (since most skater are taught to rotate with the landing foot flexed and the free foot pointed) is like 98%.
    Last edited by SkateNater; 02-10-2013 at 05:48 AM.

  2. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateNater View Post
    I'm going to go through the rule book and see what it says, but I'll take your word for it.

    If Asada doesn't do the 3A in the SP, Kim may not need the extra triple as her TES in the SP will be higher than Asada's and she's pretty much going to Out-GOE Asada on all jumps and rake in pretty big PCS.
    The Zayak Rule has been in place since 1982. It's the reason why Yuna did three 2As in her long program (after she lost her loop) in 2009 and 2010 before that rule was changed as well. That is why she has the layout that she has now/in 2011--because she doesn't have five different triples.

  3. #228
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    Quote Originally Posted by hurrah View Post
    Oh, yeah. And so relieved to see Mao's sorted out her flip!! It's got height and flow now, so no more worries at least about under-rotating her flip any more, thankfully.
    I respectfully disagree. I think her edge going into the flip could still be better; it's still a bit wobbly in my humble opinion.

  4. #229
    Custom Title Minze2001's Avatar
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    Congratulation Mao Asada. She is such a fighter. Slowly but surely her hard work is paying off. Question if that program was skated clean what would have been her score. By the way I dont expect it to be perfect at worlds.

  5. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateNater View Post
    I love Akiko Suzuki. She really draws you into her performance. She reminds me of Bebe Liang with the bits of dance she does towards the end of her program.
    Reminds me of the great Michelle Kwan! The magic to draw you in to her journey of emotions.

  6. #231
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    The Zayak Rule has been in place since 1982. It's the reason why Yuna did three 2As in her long program in 2009 and 2010 before that rule was changed as well. That is why she has the layout that she has now/in 2011.
    Yuna used 3 double axel, connecte jumps. example, inabauer-2a-3t
    Regardless of yuna, reduced the number of 2a in fs
    isn't it to be harsh in front of the groups(1,2group) skaters?

  7. #232
    Custom Title Minze2001's Avatar
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    I am so happy for Akiko after her disapoiment at Nationals. Her performace was lovely. I am in love with her short program.

  8. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    The Zayak Rule has been in place since 1982. It's the reason why Yuna did three 2As in her long program (after she lost her loop) in 2009 and 2010 before that rule was changed as well. That is why she has the layout that she has now/in 2011--because she doesn't have five different triples.
    The Zayak Rule only stated that if you do a triple jump once, the second time had to be in combination and you could only do any triple twice in the same program.

    It did not limit the amount of triples you can repeat - only the amount of times you can do a single triple jump. The rule change you are referring to (which disallows her from repeating 3 different triples in and out of combination) has nothing to do with the Zayak rule. The jump layout I gave you doesn't violate Zayak Rule as every repeated jump is done in and out of combination. Get it.

    So, I said I would get to the Rule book and check the other rule change you mentioned, which has absolutely nothing to do with the Zayak rule.

    Additionally, the Zayak Rule only applied to Triples, which is why even after 82 skaters were doing more than 2 double Axels in their program.

    Like I said, I'll look it up in the rule book and take your word for it in the interim.

    This isn't basic Zayak Rule. It's completely independent of it, and that's what I was interested in. When did they change it so that she couldn't do 3 DA (cause that was common even after Zayak, since a DA isn't a triple jump and was thus exempt from the Zayak Rule), and when did they limit the amount of jumps that can be repeated even if the second pass was in combination (again, not addressed in 1982 as most ladies had at most 3 Triple jumps and that rule was not forward-thinking in that way).
    Last edited by SkateNater; 02-10-2013 at 05:58 AM.

  9. #234
    Custom Title bekalc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateNater View Post
    Gracie deserves her PCS lead. Even Gao's crossovers even leave much to be desired. She has no extension. She could be so much better, but her basics need work. It looked as if she was skating from edge to edge doing jumps, with mediocre landings at that. PCS has more to do with how pretty you think one looks compared to the other. Gold is faster. She has better basics. She does have better transitions than Gao. Her skating looks much more balance. And she ever interpreted her program better, IMO.

    Why would you put a Spiral in your FS if your spirals are that terrible. Why do that to the judges? Why not do a spread eagle, instead?

    The look on Gao's face at the end of her program was priceless though. She didn't even hold her ending position. It was like she didn't care. But... She did skate well for her capabilities, so Kudos to her for that.

    I understand why she was 5th at Nationals.
    Gold interperted her program better? You have to be joking. Gold may be a better basic skater and I'm fine with her getting higher skating skills score.. However in terms of musical interperation, Gracie could be frankly skating to anything. Same plastered smile, very little commitment to the choreography. And her choreography is absolutely worse than Gao's.

    I frankly find Gao a bit boring but Gold needs a lot of work when it comes to musical interpertation.. And I'm not just talking about those who are older but also those who are her age. Compare Sotnikova of Kaitlyn when they skate to their short programs.. They way they hold their bodies in expressing the Spanish style music. Sotnikova holds her body differently for this type of music than she does when she's skating to her Jazzy piece.

    Gold in contrast skates the same no matter what type of music-she skates too...
    Last edited by bekalc; 02-10-2013 at 05:56 AM.

  10. #235
    can't come down to Earth prettykeys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bekalc View Post
    There is a short program you know. And Gold's was terrible. As for the long program, I think Gold has terrific jumps and could eventually be a beautiful skater. However I STRONGLY disagree with the concept that Gold right now deserves the kind of lead over Gao that she got on PCS at US Nationals... Gold has a lot of work to do when it comes to interperting music.

    Did Gold deserve to place ahead of Gao in the long, sure. But overall- highly questionable. I'm not completely against it, but once again, to say there was no favoritism going on there....
    I'm not saying you're wrong. But boring SP+boring LP vs. terrible SP+awesome LP, I'll take the latter (from a preference point of view.)

    And yes, the USFSA has massive favoritism going on. With Wagner. Her PCS at Nats beat-out what Worlds Champions have gotten...and then Nagasu was KILLED by the judges and tech panel afterwards which pissed me off greatly.

    I didn't pay attention to Gold in her junior circuit, but if what people say are true, that she can be a spitfire, then...I understand why they went with Wagner+Gold.

    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    The Zayak Rule has been in place since 1982. It's the reason why Yuna did three 2As in her long program (after she lost her loop) in 2009 and 2010 before that rule was changed as well. That is why she has the layout that she has now/in 2011--because she doesn't have five different triples.
    Addition: YuNa has the layout she has right now because of the above, plus she doesn't want to break-up her 3-3.

    BTW the tech panel here was hard. There are a few UR's on the protocol sheet that I wasn't expecting.

  11. #236
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    LADIES FREE SKATE - RESULT & VIDEOS

    1. Mao ASADA (JPN) - 205.45 Free Skate
    2. Akiko SUZUKI (JPN) - 190.08
    3. Kanako MURAKAMI (JPN) - 181.03
    4. Christina GAO (USA) - 176.28
    5. Zijun LI (CHN) - 170.42
    6. Gracie GOLD (USA) - 166.66
    7. Kaetlyn OSMOND (CAN) - 159.38
    8. Agnes ZAWADZKI (USA) - 158.99
    9. Amelie LACOSTE (CAN) - 155.08
    10. Kexin ZHANG (CHN) - 148.34
    11. Julianne SEGUIN (CAN) - 146.58
    12. Brooklee HAN (AUS) - 134.90
    13. Reyna HAMUI (MEX) - 123.69
    14. Chantelle KERRY (AUS) - 118.11
    15. Crystal KIANG (TPE) - 109.15
    16. Yeon Jun PARK (KOR) - 106.79
    17. Melissa BULANHAGUI (PHI) - 106.36
    18. Lejeanne MARAIS (RSA) - 105.06
    19. Melinda WANG (TPE) - 96.95
    20. Ami PAREKH (IND) - 88.39

  12. #237
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateNater View Post
    I'm not talking about what the protocols say. I'm talking about what I seen. .
    Well, I saw a rotated 3F and so did the judges. So, I'm not going to discuss whether her 3F had a 0.09678143 degree of under rotation (in your eyes) or not.

  13. #238
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonardo View Post
    Well, I saw a rotated 3F and so did the judges. So, I'm not going to discuss whether her 3F had a 0.09678143 degree of under rotation (in your eyes) or not.
    Don't.

  14. #239
    Custom Title bekalc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by prettykeys View Post

    I didn't pay attention to Gold in her junior circuit, but if what people say are true, that she can be a spitfire, then...I understand why they went with Wagner+Gold.
    .
    The thing is Gold really doesn't have a lot of international experience. She only had one JGP last season-which she did win. And she had Junior Worlds where she got a silver medal (and world team trophy where she did not so well)

    On the Grand Prix, she was a mess at Skate Canada and had problems at Cup of Russia. Gold right now is hit or mess. Yes she skated well in the long program at Nationals but even she admitted that she had nothing to lose at this point.

    If your asking me long term who I think has more potential-I actually will agree its Gold. But what I'm not convinced of right now is that Gold is ready for the type of pressure this Worlds would bring...

    Gao was more consistent overall at Nationals, and was frankly more consistent throughout the Grand Prix...There's a reason you have two programs in a competition....

    And right now I find minus the jumps-Gold pretty boring too.

  15. #240
    Custom Title mary01's Avatar
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    what a performance by Mao Asada , soooo amazing, the content she displayed was unbelievable, I loved everything in her performance, her jumps looked huge and gourges, just WOW

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