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Thread: Davis & White to regain World title?

  1. #136
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    Will do, Buttercup.

    I have never seen Fledermaus, though I've heard it on the radio. The overture always makes my heart beat faster. I think it's Johann Strauss's first operetta, and it just radiates the energy of a new beginning. There are four pieces that give me this feeling: the Fledermaus overture, the overture to Smetana's The Bartered Bride (pretty much the start of Czech national music), the overture to Glinka's Ruslan and Ludmila (Not his very first opera, but close, and Glinka is the father of Russian national music), and the first notes of Schuman's first symphony, the "Spring."

  2. #137
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    I think that Davis/White will always be more easy to understand and follow by the judges, who are not necessarily very complex one's in their personality.
    They have the flow, virtuos technique , speed and passion which is very transparent and easy to recognize.

    All in all I find Virtue/Moir a much better couple. They are NOT doing comfortable things. They behave like their decisions to create a programme is always has a mission to show some possible new direction of this sport. They offer an improvement to this sport year by year. They are innovative, and in this way THEY act like true Champions.
    I know sometimes is more difficult to understand, they usually have a complex scenario behind their programme.


    About their Carmen:
    I think it shows how Carmen won over Don Jose, even if she was killed by him.
    The whole programme is like a dream and memory of Don Jose, waiting possibly his execution in the jail remembering the sexually-droven connection with Carmen.The ups and lows. It was NOT at all a romantic relationship between this 2, they have been addicted to each other.

    Even the missing red colour shows that it is a memory from the past. It is very common to use black (dress) and white (the ice) in coloured movie citing the acts happened in the past time.

    I find it incredibly talented and meaningful.

    I love both teams, D/W always should be my VERY proud silver medalist and lots of GOLD after Sochi.

  3. #138
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigdeal View Post
    All in all I find Virtue/Moir a much better couple. They are NOT doing comfortable things. They behave like their decisions to create a programme is always has a mission to show some possible new direction of this sport. They offer an improvement to this sport year by year. They are innovative, and in this way THEY act like true Champions.
    I know sometimes is more difficult to understand, they usually have a complex scenario behind their programme.
    Umbrellas, Mahler and Funny Face were innovative and uncomfortable?

    Look, I prefer V/M to D/W, too, and find their skating technically strong but with greater refinement and polish than D/W's. But I don't consider either team great artistic visionaries (not a surprise, with Zoueva now responsible for their training), despite the attempt to sell as Carmen as though it's the most original thing ever. And I feel that D/W have also challenged themselves artistically at times, such as the Bollywood program or the tango FD they had in 2011.

  4. #139
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    [I feel that D/W have also challenged themselves artistically at times, such as the Bollywood program or the tango FD they had in 2011.[/QUOTE]

    Yes, they did, I agree with that. They especially challanged themselves with the Tango programme, which was their weakest programme but still. They won the World with that challange. In that year the real challange was V/M latin dance programme.

    I agree with you conserning to D/W, I like them as I said that!

  5. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigdeal View Post
    I know sometimes is more difficult to understand, they usually have a complex scenario behind their programme.

    About their Carmen:
    I think it shows how Carmen won over Don Jose, even if she was killed by him.
    The whole programme is like a dream and memory of Don Jose, waiting possibly his execution in the jail remembering the sexually-droven connection with Carmen.The ups and lows. It was NOT at all a romantic relationship between this 2, they have been addicted to each other.

    Even the missing red colour shows that it is a memory from the past. It is very common to use black (dress) and white (the ice) in coloured movie citing the acts happened in the past time.

    I find it incredibly talented and meaningful.
    My opinion:

    I suppose it's natural for certain standard musical pieces to evoke a sense of storytelling. That said, if a skating routine must have this sort of verbal explanation to follow what is happening, then it means the skaters aren't doing a good enough job on the ice in terms of interpreting the piece.

    I'd rather the skating speak for itself. Carmen is a difficult, innovative, and interesting ice dance. It can stand on its own merit. It doesn't need an appendix.

    I always hit the mute button when the commentator begins, "They're skating to blahblahblah. This dance represents the soul of a dead raven, clawing its way through the arctic ice shelf in search of the single butterfly whose fluttering wings can change the course of history and save the endangered buffalo. She is portraying the buffalo, he the butterfly. The ice is the Arctic. The blades of their skates represent the piercing and plaintive squeak of the raven."

  6. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by TontoK View Post
    My opinion:

    I suppose it's natural for certain standard musical pieces to evoke a sense of storytelling. That said, if a skating routine must have this sort of verbal explanation to follow what is happening, then it means the skaters aren't doing a good enough job on the ice in terms of interpreting the piece.

    I'd rather the skating speak for itself. Carmen is a difficult, innovative, and interesting ice dance. It can stand on its own merit. It doesn't need an appendix.

    I always hit the mute button when the commentator begins, "They're skating to blahblahblah. This dance represents the soul of a dead raven, clawing its way through the arctic ice shelf in search of the single butterfly whose fluttering wings can change the course of history and save the endangered buffalo. She is portraying the buffalo, he the butterfly. The ice is the Arctic. The blades of their skates represent the piercing and plaintive squeak of the raven."
    Whew! LOL - thanks, TontoK. I needed that after all the previous glorification of what V/M are radiating on ice.

  7. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by TontoK View Post
    I always hit the mute button when the commentator begins, "They're skating to blahblahblah. This dance represents the soul of a dead raven, clawing its way through the arctic ice shelf in search of the single butterfly whose fluttering wings can change the course of history and save the endangered buffalo. She is portraying the buffalo, he the butterfly. The ice is the Arctic. The blades of their skates represent the piercing and plaintive squeak of the raven."


    But sometimes, like for stories from different cultures, it is cool to look up what the music is about. Like Lu Chen's Butterfly Lovers, for instance. Or when they announce that the skater is supposed to be Prince Igor, when I think he is just someone in a fur hat skating to Strangers in Paradise.

  8. #143
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    bigdeal -- i LOVED your description of carmen. it's not that carmen is unintelligible, but it's always great to hear how people understand it . . . to get a glimpse into what people feel when they watch. it's great to share that with other fans.

  9. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buttercup View Post
    Umbrellas, Mahler and Funny Face were innovative and uncomfortable?

    Look, I prefer V/M to D/W, too, and find their skating technically strong but with greater refinement and polish than D/W's. But I don't consider either team great artistic visionaries (not a surprise, with Zoueva now responsible for their training), despite the attempt to sell as Carmen as though it's the most original thing ever. And I feel that D/W have also challenged themselves artistically at times, such as the Bollywood program or the tango FD they had in 2011.
    I totally agree with about 96% of this (except I honestly like both teams equally, but for different reasons). But neither team is really a true innovator. I think they're both brilliant consolidators: bringing together all that is good and positive about COP skating. But YMMV of course.

    TontoK: Oh absolutely spot on. I often think of the "nasty" choreographer in the movie The Turning Point, who tells the young up-and-coming ballerina dancing his new Avant Garde choreography, "All that emoting is fine...for the mad scene in Giselle. You're not playing some uptight village virgin. You're just a body moving to music. You just dance." And of course our young ballerina gets her Superior Artistic Sensibilities in an uproar and flouncess off,, because that is what someone with Superior Artistic Sensibilities does. But frankly I think there are times when I just want to see someone, you know, move to music. I don't need some inane "storyline" like your hilarious construct. Just dance. LOL.
    Last edited by WeakAnkles; 02-23-2013 at 06:27 AM.

  10. #145
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TontoK View Post
    I always hit the mute button when the commentator begins, "They're skating to blahblahblah. This dance represents the soul of a dead raven, clawing its way through the arctic ice shelf in search of the single butterfly whose fluttering wings can change the course of history and save the endangered buffalo. She is portraying the buffalo, he the butterfly. The ice is the Arctic. The blades of their skates represent the piercing and plaintive squeak of the raven."
    Doesn't this make it difficult to hear what music the skaters are skating to, though?

    I agree that sometimes skaters and their choreographers overthink the conceptual side. OTOH, there are good ideas that may not be obvious to all audiences, for cultural or other reasons, and then it's nice to be provided an explanation.

  11. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by TontoK View Post
    My opinion:

    I always hit the mute button when the commentator begins, "They're skating to blahblahblah. This dance represents the soul of a dead raven, clawing its way through the arctic ice shelf in search of the single butterfly whose fluttering wings can change the course of history and save the endangered buffalo. She is portraying the buffalo, he the butterfly. The ice is the Arctic. The blades of their skates represent the piercing and plaintive squeak of the raven."
    Gotta love it!

    Clearly this can't be a program skated by someone like Yuka Sato, because you can't hear her blades.

    What music do you envision for this program, exactly?

  12. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post

    What music do you envision for this program, exactly?
    Well, I've given that some thought. I was going to choose selections from Carmen, but I think that music may already have been used once or twice in figure skating. Ditto for the American Airlines music that Gershwin wrote.

    Perhaps you all can help me. I'm certain it must have a strong strain of oboe to represent the grunting of the buffalo. Everyone knows that the French horn is the traditional instrument of the raven (so a commentator wouldn't have to explain that, you see), and my avant-garde "Fluttering Wings" dance spin simply must have a flute solo. I've already begun to choreograph this in my head, you know.

    It will be a masterpiece. You'll all be able to watch me in the Kiss and Cry. I'll be the older man in the fur coat and Prince Igor hat, sniffing dismissively at the judges.

  13. #148
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    Tchaikovsky is great with woodwinds, and he sure can get impassioned. Something within the deeper reaches of the Pathetique Symphony might work. (Mind you, I love Tchaikovsky.) The great thing about Tchaikovsky is that he can both shout and whisper. I'm afraid to recommend Liszt, because I'm not sure he ever whispers.
    Last edited by Olympia; 02-23-2013 at 09:12 AM.

  14. #149
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    Here is Zoueva's concept for the SD to the Waltz Goes On. (The composer's idea is to depict the resilience of the people of New Zealand in rebounding from natural disasters.)

    At Skate Canada, Zoueva described the program, set to actor Sir Anthony Hopkins' "The Waltz Goes On," as a kind of paen to how one person can change another's life for the good.

    "The idea is, she is a little bit lost, she feels alone, and he comes into her life and makes it better," Zoueva said. "In the polka, he shows her, 'Look, let's dance, life is great.' So, she starts thinking, 'Life is good, it's happy.' Then come the twizzles, and the feeling builds."
    This idea wasn't working, so they changed it.

    "We felt the translation got lost somewhere at one point," Moir, 25, said. "So, we worked with [Ontario dance instructor] Jennifer [Swan] to try to bring some special element to short dance, which we think we have in the free ... You will be able to notice, for sure."

    What they ended up with was less storyline, more slice-of-life. The midline steps have been modified, but the biggest change is the overall feel.

    "It ended up kind of being our story -- two kids having fun," Moir said. "We're together. There's nothing about meeting each other; we've known each other a while."

  15. #150
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    Two kids having fun dancing works for me as a story line.

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