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Thread: Plushenko to sue sports commentator

  1. #16
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    I get that Plushenko is a sport-guru in Russia, but I don't like his drama-queen agression towards assumptions

  2. #17
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    Actually the worst thing is that in one of the interview this Zhurandov gave after the whole thing exploded, he said he deliberately said those things as bait. This is totally wrong from his part. he is doing commenting 4CC, not some gossip channel talk show!!!

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    That was a really idiotic thing to say but I don't think that he should be able to get sued for it. I hope the court throws the lawsuit out.
    Do you not think it is malicious to accuse an athlete of faking an injury? Do you not think it is slanderous or libelous to then outright say there was no such operation and thus he was faking it?

  4. #19
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    Meh. Who is the public going to believe, Plushenko or some fool on TV?

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by seniorita View Post
    The journalist said: In my opinion, there was no such operation, and all this story, considering how it was presented in the mass media – it was an exclusive story by Channel One, only certain media sources got the tip-off to write about it – all this looks like a strategy that is used for various PR actions in showbiz. I especially have a suspicion, because next information appeared in the Israeli medias, 2 days ago, that they can not find a hospital where was Evgeni operated, and can not find him in any hospital right now. Also, I do not believe that a man who had operation on the spine, can walk one day later.
    I don't even know Russian law. But in my opinion, Eurosport2 can not defend this man. It'll be difficult.. This journalist must show clear evidence for himself. Otherwise he surely will be fired or demoted.

    Btw, I am wondering if Russian hospital usually gives to media a patient's personal information? If so, I can completely understand why Bolshoi ballet guy was attacked with acid last month. Maybe Russian has no privacy. That's horrible.
    Last edited by Evgenia; 02-11-2013 at 09:43 PM.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    There isn't anything illegal to doubt somebody's surgery.
    You have no idea how bored I got to read the stuff like that on some Russian forums. In fact it works quite simple. For example, I say: "I doubt you are a decent person, I think you are on drugs, in my opinion you run a meth lab and you steal money from your boss. I also doubt you are not a sex pervert. In my opinion you are just one chronic liar." Etc. You know what ALL people start yelling the same instant? Something like "How dare you INSULT me?" or somesuch. The point is: the statements like yours is just hypocritical demagogy. Because the moment it hits YOU, you all behave the same way. Yawn.
    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    it's Plushenko who has to show how did his comments damage his reputation.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    the point being that the celebrity must establish not just that his or her name and reputation was damaged, but that the defamation actually cost him/her X amount of dollars in future revenue.
    Quote Originally Posted by Buttercup View Post
    ETA: I think I was wrong earlier and should have referred to libel, not slander. Either way, it's a type of defamation.
    No, you should refer to slander. There is no "sue", no "plaintiff" and no "libel" in this case. Plu filed criminal charges against the commentator, not civil ones. The R-law has the civil legislation for Protection of the Honour, Dignity and Busness Reputation (art. 152 Civil Code), as well as criminal legisation for Slander (art. 128.1 Criminal Code). The civil legislation is mainly applied against legal entities like mass media for example, almost never against individuals. But exception happens, like that story that took place with another sport commnetator Guberniev sometime ago. He was commenting the football match on Rossiya-2 which was also broadcasted online on sportbox.ru. When it was a commercial break on Rossiya-2 but on on sportbox.ru, he said about the goalkeeper that he is a 'sh-word' in gates and told unpleasnt stuff about the guy's wife's death (was killed in a car accident). He was sued by the athlete under art. 152 of Civil Code and lost, had to pay 75k Rub to the footballer as moral damage. The article for Slander in the Criminal Code was always there, except a brief break between Dec 2011 and July 2012, can be applied only against individuals and sets the responsibility for the spreading deliberately falsified information that denigrates the honour and dignity of another person or undermines his reputation. The art. 128.1 2). refers to the situation when such information was contained in public speech or mass media. It's a public prosecution jurisdiction, punishable by a fine up to 1mil Rub (over $33k) or compulsory works up to 240 hours. There are other consequences too- like criminal records (it's a felony afterall), no possibility to get a passport for oveaseas travels until this criminal record got wiped out (after one year for this crime), etc. Naturally the criminal article is way stricter than the civil one, because the worse thing was committed- deliberate lie to damage someone and spoken in public. The article is in apply when the fact of spreading of deliberately falsified information takes place. Other consequences like lost of material profits from future venues are irrelevant. Non-material values (like dignity, honour, good name) are values by themselves and therefore protected by law, the person can demand the compensation of moral damage if he wishes. If the material damage also took place by the crime of slander, then it's a separate demand that is treated like any other material lost.

  7. #22
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    One problem with this is that if it goes to court, Plushenko may have to provide medical records he had rather keep private.


    Now Plush joins the company of Baiul and Harding (believe Harding just threatened)
    Last edited by Icey; 02-12-2013 at 08:44 AM.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Icey View Post
    Plushenko may have to provide medical records he had rather keep private.
    Yeah, that's why he showed his X-ray to the whole world- to keep it private.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buttercup View Post
    First of all, different countries have different laws regarding what sort of speech is protected. But even in a place with free speech enshrined in the Constitution, like the US, you can be liable for damages in a civil suit for making slanderous statements about someone. Suggesting that an athlete is faking an injury for publicity can certainly be a slanderous statement.
    In the Soviet Union, I believe defamatory insults could only constitute a criminal offense, not a civil wrong.

    In the Joubert suit mentioned above, Jobert sued for 40,000 Euros and ended up getting 17,000 Euros, and one of the magazines had to publish the court ruling in one of its issues.
    Last edited by Icey; 02-12-2013 at 09:01 AM.

  10. #25
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    Let's Talk, thanks for the information about Russian law. Interesting that this wouldn't be a civil infraction but a crime in Russia. I don't know exactly how libel laws work here in the U.S. (except that they're a matter for civil court rather than criminal court), but I do know that people such as Tom Cruise have sued and won over claims that some tabloids have made about his private life.

    An interesting Supreme Court case during the Civil Rights era (in 1964) was N.Y. Times Company v. Sullivan. In this case, the New York Times printed an ad (sort of like a petition, not a commercial ad) in defense of Martin Luther King, Jr., that made an inaccurate statement about how many times Alabama officials had arrested King. A high-ranking police official in Alabama considered the ad defamatory and sued a bunch of civil rights activists and the Times. Eventually the matter came before the U.S. Supreme Court, whose job is to decide whether any legal decision violates the Constitution. The Justices ruled in favor of the Times and established the idea that actual malice must be shown to exist before the press can be sued for printing information against a public official. So a paper (or I suppose a reporter) must knowingly use false information with the intent to harm. I don't know whether this standard applies just to public officials or to all public figures, such as athletes.

    So I don't know whether by U.S. standards this Russian announcer would be able to be sued. However,in the U.S. one control over this kind of thing happening on TV or in the press is the worry that a really irresponsible reporter could scare away advertisers or the audience. So a TV show or a news organization might demote or fire someone who offended public opinion. For example, a radio station I listened to had a longtime announcer who made some terribly insulting statement (I don't know exactly what it is because the actual wording of the insult, which was not made on the air, was not released to the public). He was gone from the broadcaster's booth by the end of the day. Various people argued in favor of and against the decision, but he was never reinstated.
    Last edited by Olympia; 02-12-2013 at 03:51 PM.

  11. #26
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    Interesting that this wouldn't be a civil infraction but a crime in Russia.
    Let's Talk didn't say that - he/she said it was a crime in the Soviet Union. It is not criminal matter but a civil one in Russia which is not, as I'm sure you know, the Soviet Union any longer.
    Last edited by Brandenburg; 02-12-2013 at 09:12 PM.

  12. #27
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    I have not read every post-just a few. But in order to prove his case Plu-a skater I enjoy and admire despite the global sized ego-will have to provide actual medical records to prove the surgery. If he can't he is lying. The sportscaster will not want to be outspent and will likely apologize soon. Then Plu should accept and drop it. This reminds me of when giant celeb Yuna was sue happy about-what-the comments of a teacher?

    Many sports stars are very thin skinned. I hope plu gives the money to charity and not a lawyer. No one will care in a week. But it does have me wondering what the truth is, and truth is expensive to find. In any situation like this. I certainly hope Plu is the truthful one. I am guessing he will not be back and this is the end to Sochi hopes? Why does Russia invest in a 30 yr old who really will be off the podium. Cant say Artur and Kovtun go? Plush cannot be the only Russian guy to ensure a spot for the men? I don't follow the plu saga as It is imposiible for him to train triples and quads with this surgery.

    I wish he and Mishin to tell the truth. Plu needs to retire if said surgery is fact. It's a bit crazy at this point. Lawsuits won't help his skating, and it is about skating in the Olys right Plu?

    Drama drama drama. So Russian. Well, welcome to Sochi. Expect scandals, bad sportsmanship and was robbed in FS and any other judged sport. I was always a Plu fan, even in his 2010 statements I could see his POV about jumps mattering a lot, or even most in the mens event, but when rich celebs do the sue thing to the little people, it bothers me-no matter if it is Cruise, Travolta, Yuna or Plu. Don't tell an unpleasant truth, unless you have the money to defend in this corrupt world.

    It does get interesting. Olympic scandals here we come. I'd like to see some under dogs get some medals this Olympics. Here's hoping for more Gabby Douglas type people and less Lance Armstrongs in sport. As one ages, one never looks for celebrities to idolize. So much dishonesty at the top. I am rooting for new, young folks to take the day. I like Artur and Russia needs to move on. It is a strange situation in mens skating for sure. With the talent and money there we still need Plu to make Sochi FS a great event? What is the problem? OT but with the legacy of male OGM and great skaters, great coaches, choreographers it is a bizarre situation. Maybe they need to let go of Evgeni and give some breaks to decent young guys. They gotta be there. Evgeni is great but Dai deserved silver in Vancouver. Just hate rep judging with points for superstars. Just mho.

  13. #28
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    So basically what I got out of your post, skateluvr, was that the journalist should be allowed to say whatever the hell he likes about Plushenko, accuse him of faking a major surgery, and Plushenko shouldn't take issue with it at all?

    Yeah...NO. Personally, as a journalist-in-training, I feel that Plushenko has every right to sue this particular journalist. It's slander. He is throwing mud on Plushenko's name as a sportsman, and all because of what? Some Israeli journalists called some hospitals and when the hospitals (correctly) refused to confirm if he was there they figured it meant he actually wasn't?

    No journalist should ever make such a claim unless they have proof to back it up. This guy has none. Why should Plushenko not sue him for accusing him of faking a surgery on national television?

  14. #29
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    Because it isn't worth the court time anywhere for this thing. Plushenko could make his doc write a small statement and prove it without the hulabaloo if he really had surgery. And that would be end of it. Plu is rich-he could give his legal fees to his pet charity. Society is too litigious-another huge issue. but i respect your pov. he can do as he pleases.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by skateluvr View Post
    I have not read every post-just a few. But in order to prove his case Plu-a skater I enjoy and admire despite the global sized ego-will have to provide actual medical records to prove the surgery. If he can't he is lying. The sportscaster will not want to be outspent and will likely apologize soon. Then Plu should accept and drop it. This reminds me of when giant celeb Yuna was sue happy about-what-the comments of a teacher?

    Many sports stars are very thin skinned. I hope plu gives the money to charity and not a lawyer. No one will care in a week. But it does have me wondering what the truth is, and truth is expensive to find. In any situation like this. I certainly hope Plu is the truthful one. I am guessing he will not be back and this is the end to Sochi hopes? Why does Russia invest in a 30 yr old who really will be off the podium. Cant say Artur and Kovtun go? Plush cannot be the only Russian guy to ensure a spot for the men? I don't follow the plu saga as It is imposiible for him to train triples and quads with this surgery.

    I wish he and Mishin to tell the truth. Plu needs to retire if said surgery is fact. It's a bit crazy at this point. Lawsuits won't help his skating, and it is about skating in the Olys right Plu?

    Drama drama drama. So Russian. Well, welcome to Sochi. Expect scandals, bad sportsmanship and was robbed in FS and any other judged sport. I was always a Plu fan, even in his 2010 statements I could see his POV about jumps mattering a lot, or even most in the mens event, but when rich celebs do the sue thing to the little people, it bothers me-no matter if it is Cruise, Travolta, Yuna or Plu. Don't tell an unpleasant truth, unless you have the money to defend in this corrupt world.
    Oh please . Because nobody has ever sued anyone for libel in any country outside Russia? How do you even know what Plushenko will or won't need to do? Are you an expert on Russian legal procedure in such cases? How do you know that Russian society is too litigious? Is that an area of expertise for you?

    The commentator didn't tell an unpleasant truth, he made a nasty allegation that he could not back up. He did so well after Plushenko and his wife had published photos showing Plushenko post-surgery, provided details about the procedure and even ststaed the name of the clinic where he was hospitalized - all things that they are under no obligation to share with anyone. Even in the US, the comments that were made can be ground for a libel suit (actually winning such a suit in the US requires a standard of proof already discussed in this thread).

    Why should Kovtun and Gachinski be sent to the Olympics? The best skaters should be sent to the Olympics, regardless of who they are. Or skater, if Russia cannot regain a second spot at Worlds (where I believe Kovtun will compete, on the strength of being the top Russian at the Europeans).

    I'm at a loss as to why you've decided that Plushenko's medical condition and this specific lawsuit show that we should "Expect scandals, bad sportsmanship and was robbed in FS and any other judged sport." Do you think such behaviors are unique to Russian people in general and Russian athletes in particular? Do you think other skating federations don't politik? Are we still in the midst of the cold war? Do you know that there was a huge scandal attached to the SLC Olympic bid? Does that mean that all US sporting events are corrupt? There were also issues with the Nagano and Sydney bids, are these indications of corruption in Japan and Australia? See how silly things sound when you go to generalizations?

    In short: one can argue that Plushenko's lawsuit is frivolous or inappropriate without being ridiculous and offensive about it. You, however, have failed to do so.

    Quote Originally Posted by karne View Post
    He is throwing mud on Plushenko's name as a sportsman, and all because of what? Some Israeli journalists called some hospitals and when the hospitals (correctly) refused to confirm if he was there they figured it meant he actually wasn't?
    I'm not sure Israeli journalists actually called the hospitals to look into it. The FSU thread about Plushenko's lawsuit had some discussion about the likelihood of this, and of journalists being able to access such information even if they did call, considering the medical confidentiality laws that are in place - which local journalists would certainly know about.
    Last edited by Buttercup; 02-13-2013 at 01:40 AM.

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