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Thread: GP Speculation 2013-2014. The men

  1. #16
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    It's just so interesting if Russia did not have a gp maybe only one Russian skater would get two gp events in the season they host the olympics!

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaana View Post
    I´d expect Kovtun, Song and Aaron to rise up on the list a lot. Perhaps even Verner will give us a positive surprise at Worlds?
    What would Song need to place at Worlds to get more points than he got for finishing 6th at 4CC? I thought it needed to be pretty high, so unless he skates really well, I don't think Worlds is likely to help his WS, because only one ISU championship per season counts toward WS right?

  3. #18
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    Song earned 496 points at 4CC. To place higher than Jason Brown on the WS list, he'd have to finish 6th at Worlds (709 points).

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Song earned 496 points at 4CC. To place higher than Jason Brown on the WS list, he'd have to finish 6th at Worlds (709 points).
    Totally not impossible. On a really great day Song can impress. But I feel momentum is working against him right now.

  5. #20
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    Just to throw it out, if the new Development Trophy is calculated to the standing then Martinez (who will pretty much win) will have a chance at the top 24 wouldn't he?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mylastduchess View Post
    Just to throw it out, if the new Development Trophy is calculated to the standing then Martinez (who will pretty much win) will have a chance at the top 24 wouldn't he?
    I"m not sure if the event would even count since it's a Free Skating only competition. I doubt it would count for any ranking points.

  7. #22
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    The WDT events are for Juniors and Novices. The WDT announcements for upcoming WDT events make no mention of awarding points, so it seems ISU awards ranking points for JGP and Junior Worlds only.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by gmyers View Post
    It's just so interesting if Russia did not have a gp maybe only one Russian skater would get two gp events in the season they host the olympics!
    Uh? Menshov and Kovtun appear in both Top 24 SB and WS plus the later has good chances of making top 12 at worlds. Then Voronov is safe among the SB and will finish around 25-26th in the WS so I think those three will get 2 events regardles of where they are from a Host fed or not.

    Unless of course Russian fed screws Menshov again and "retire" him by not submitting his name like they did with Sokolova a few years ago.

  9. #24
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    Sorry to ask what may seem like silly questions about the Grand Prix assignments, but I don't know much about it. Are the assignments decided based on the season's best lists or the world rankings lists? What happens when skaters have taken seasons off or are returning from injury and aren't on said lists. This applies less to the men, but I was wondering how things might work if Lysacek, Weir, Ando, Kim, and Czisny come back next year and want to skate on the circuit. Are there wild card/discretionary entries for each federation that hosts an event?

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by amc987 View Post
    Sorry to ask what may seem like silly questions about the Grand Prix assignments, but I don't know much about it. Are the assignments decided based on the season's best lists or the world rankings lists? What happens when skaters have taken seasons off or are returning from injury and aren't on said lists. This applies less to the men, but I was wondering how things might work if Lysacek, Weir, Ando, Kim, and Czisny come back next year and want to skate on the circuit. Are there wild card/discretionary entries for each federation that hosts an event?
    Grand Prix assignments are mainly based on 3 lists:

    *Top 12 at Worlds (They get 2 events automatically)
    *Top 24 Season Best (1 Event guaranteed)
    *Top 24 World Standings(1 event guaranteed)

    Usually most of the names overlap in all three of these lists so 90% of the time a skater who makes the cut gets 2 events at the first announcement of assignments.

    Then there are the host picks where the host Federation can pick any skater they want regardless of previous results/rankings. Most of the time these picks are used to select their local up and coming skaters who otherwise wouldn't get an opportunity on the elite level.

    As for the coming back rule, a skater who has been previously a top 6 at Worlds and has missed last or previous seasons due to injury or temporal retirement can apply for consideration for 2 events which they always get since they are usually big names. However this is a "one time only" exception. Weir and Ando have already used them (and wasted them ).

    If there are still spots left to fill the feds can invite any skater from the rest of the Top 75 Season Best list who is submited for consideration.


    Hope that helps to solve your doubts

  11. #26
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    Czisny placed 5th at Worlds 2011, then was injured in 2012 and skated badly. She had surgery in the summer of 2012 and did opt for one 2012 GP event but withdrew because she wasn't ready. Then she was injured again. I'm not sure if she qualifies under the 'returning from injury' clause.

    As already mentioned, Weir and Ando used up their one-time-only card. Lysacek blew his chance in the 2011-2012 GP, when he was scheduled for 2 events but withdrew.

    There was once a rule that JGPF and JW medalists were guaranteed one event, but since the reduction in the number of singles and ice dance entries, that guarantee was phased out.

    When there are withdrawals from the original invitations, there is a substitute list based on the Seasons Best list of the previous year. Substitutes are drawn from the top 5 on the list who have only one GP invitation or none as yet, but the selection is not necessarily done in list order. Some host federations will choose the skater who offers the least competition to their own skaters.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by SamuraiKike View Post
    Grand Prix assignments are mainly based on 3 lists:

    *Top 12 at Worlds (They get 2 events automatically)
    *Top 24 Season Best (1 Event guaranteed)
    *Top 24 World Standings(1 event guaranteed)

    Usually most of the names overlap in all three of these lists so 90% of the time a skater who makes the cut gets 2 events at the first announcement of assignments.

    Then there are the host picks where the host Federation can pick any skater they want regardless of previous results/rankings. Most of the time these picks are used to select their local up and coming skaters who otherwise wouldn't get an opportunity on the elite level.

    As for the coming back rule, a skater who has been previously a top 6 at Worlds and has missed last or previous seasons due to injury or temporal retirement can apply for consideration for 2 events which they always get since they are usually big names. However this is a "one time only" exception. Weir and Ando have already used them (and wasted them ).

    If there are still spots left to fill the feds can invite any skater from the rest of the Top 75 Season Best list who is submited for consideration.


    Hope that helps to solve your doubts
    Thanks for all that info!

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Czisny placed 5th at Worlds 2011, then was injured in 2012 and skated badly. She had surgery in the summer of 2012 and did opt for one 2012 GP event but withdrew because she wasn't ready. Then she was injured again. I'm not sure if she qualifies under the 'returning from injury' clause.

    As already mentioned, Weir and Ando used up their one-time-only card. Lysacek blew his chance in the 2011-2012 GP, when he was scheduled for 2 events but withdrew.

    There was once a rule that JGPF and JW medalists were guaranteed one event, but since the reduction in the number of singles and ice dance entries, that guarantee was phased out.

    When there are withdrawals from the original invitations, there is a substitute list based on the Seasons Best list of the previous year. Substitutes are drawn from the top 5 on the list who have only one GP invitation or none as yet, but the selection is not necessarily done in list order. Some host federations will choose the skater who offers the least competition to their own skaters.
    To be honest i'm glad Johnny can't apply for two GP events next season. He wasn't very competitive when he did skate. Give Josh or Jason two GP events instead they deserve them and are the future of US men's skating. Why waste GP spots on skaters who might or might now even compete next season?

  14. #29
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    Bumping this thread up so people can discuss the U.S. Men + GP selection. (and other countries as well)

    Top 30 SB

    1 274.87 Javier FERNANDEZ ESP European Championships 2013 26.01.2013
    2 269.40 Daisuke TAKAHASHI JPN ISU Grand Prix Final 2012/13 08.12.2012
    3 267.78 Patrick CHAN CAN World Championships 2013 15.03.2013
    4 266.48 Denis TEN KAZ World Championships 2013 15.03.2013
    5 264.29 Yuzuru HANYU JPN ISU Grand Prix Final 2012/13 08.12.2012
    6 253.27 Takahiko KOZUKA JPN ISU Grand Prix Final 2012/13 08.12.2012
    7 250.55 Kevin REYNOLDS CAN ISU Four Continents Championships 2013 09.02.2013
    8 250.53 Florent AMODIO FRA European Championships 2013 26.01.2013
    9 243.52 Michal BREZINA CZE European Championships 2013 26.01.2013
    10 238.36 Max AARON USA World Championships 2013 15.03.2013
    11 238.34 Nobunari ODA JPN ISU GP Skate Canada International 2012 27.10.2012
    12 236.92 Tatsuki MACHIDA JPN ISU GP Cup of China 2012 03.11.2012
    13 235.37 Ross MINER USA ISU GP NHK Trophy 2012 24.11.2012
    14 235.22 Han YAN CHN ISU Four Continents Championships 2013 09.02.2013
    15 234.18 Takahito MURA JPN World Championships 2013 15.03.2013
    16 234.04 Richard DORNBUSH USA ISU Four Continents Championships 2013 09.02.2013
    17 232.47 Brian JOUBERT FRA European Championships 2013 26.01.2013
    18 228.46 Nan SONG CHN ISU Four Continents Championships 2013 09.02.2013
    19 228.32 Joshua FARRIS USA World Junior Championships 2013 02.03.2013
    20 227.63 Jeremy ABBOTT USA ISU GP Trophee Bompard 2012 17.11.2012
    21 226.57 Maxim KOVTUN RUS European Championships 2013 26.01.2013
    22 224.15 Jason BROWN USA World Junior Championships 2013 02.03.2013
    23 223.72 Konstantin MENSHOV RUS ISU GP Rostelecom Cup 2012 10.11.2012
    24 222.00 Nathan CHEN USA ISU JGP Austria 2012 15.09.2012
    25 217.61 Sergei VORONOV RUS ISU GP Cup of China 2012 03.11.2012
    26 216.84 Peter LIEBERS GER World Championships 2013 15.03.2013
    27 216.60 Andrei ROGOZINE CAN World Championships 2013 15.03.2013
    28 211.88 Alexander MAJOROV SWE European Championships 2013 26.01.2013
    29 210.47 Adam RIPPON USA ISU GP NHK Trophy 2012 24.11.2012
    30 209.84 Artur GACHINSKI RUS ISU GP Rostelecom Cup 2012 10.11.2012


    Impressive that Nathan Chen's score from JGP in Sept. still managed to stay in the top 24!

  15. #30
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    Here's the list of GP 'guarantees' for the men, which includes Worlds 2013 results. The World Rankings list has been purged to remove 2010-2011 points and reduce 2011-2012 points to 70% of their value.

    Top 12 at Worlds 2013, guaranteed two spots each (top 6 are seeded):
    Patrick CHAN
    Denis TEN
    Javier FERNANDEZ
    Yuzuru HANYU
    Kevin REYNOLDS
    Daisuke TAKAHASHI
    Max AARON
    Takahito MURA
    Brian JOUBERT
    Michal BREZINA
    Peter LIEBERS
    Florent AMODIO

    Skaters who are top 24 on Worlds Ranking and/or Seasons Best list are guaranteed at least one event. The lists below do not include skaters who finished top 12 at Worlds.

    Top 24 on World Ranking AND Seasons Best:
    Takahiko KOZUKA
    Nobunari ODA
    Tatsuki MACHIDA
    Ross MINER
    Han YAN
    Richard DORNBUSH
    Nan SONG
    Joshua FARRIS
    Jeremy ABBOTT
    Maxim KOVTUN
    Jason BROWN
    Konstantin MENSHOV

    Top 24 on World Ranking list only:
    Thomas VERNER

    Top 24 on Seasons Best only:
    Nathan Chen (JGP)

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