2013 Worlds Ladies SP

daniel1406 · Mar 14, 2013

yuki said:
Her expression was adequate for the theme of her program, but the problem is that this kind of style is not a natural fit for her performance ability. Sassy and/or fierce Yuna (a la Danse Macabre, Bond SP) is better than angsty Yuna (Giselle, Kiss of the Vampire) IMO.

I loved Giselle..... I was kinda hoping that Yuna use Giselle and Homage to Korea once again.

I prefer Danse Macabre over Kiss of the Vampire for sure but still it doesn't mean that I don't like her new sp. I love it actually (tho it needs to be polished, it was still fantastic)

demarinis5 · Mar 14, 2013

berrycute said:
If you think (as many here do, I see) that Kostner is being held up despite mistakes, you have to ask, WHY? She comes from a middle sized country without any of the weight of the Japanese, US, Canadian or Russian feds, and her coach isn't a know mover and shaker like TAT, Frank Carroll or Mishin. I don't think she benefits from any behind the scenes advantages. More likely, I think, is that the judges are holding up beautiful skating, which she is delivering right now. A fall in an otherwise beautiful program might just be preferable to a clean but dull and I-can't-be-bothered program from some other skater. I for one am glad they continue to reward artistic innovation and beautiful line. Otherwise all we'd have is a bunch of girls in gloves and body suits squeezing out triple triples while some generic tango music plays unnoticed in the background.

This!

yuki · Mar 14, 2013

berrycute said:
If you think (as many here do, I see) that Kostner is being held up despite mistakes, you have to ask, WHY? She comes from a middle sized country without any of the weight of the Japanese, US, Canadian or Russian feds

She comes from the country of the current ISU president.

berrycute said:
A fall in an otherwise beautiful program might just be preferable to a clean but dull and I-can't-be-bothered program from some other skater[/B]. I for one am glad they continue to reward artistic innovation and beautiful line. Otherwise all we'd have is a bunch of girls in gloves and body suits squeezing out triple triples while some generic tango music plays unnoticed in the background.

While I totally agree with you on principle, the SP is supposed to be the technical program and technical mistakes ought to be penalized more severely.

yuki · Mar 14, 2013

daniel1406 said:
I loved Giselle..... I was kinda hoping that Yuna use Giselle and Homage to Korea once again.

I prefer Danse Macabre over Kiss of the Vampire for sure but still it doesn't mean that I don't like her new sp. I love it actually (tho it needs to be polished, it was still fantastic)

Not a big fan of Giselle, but Homage to Korea was fantastic - my favourite LP of hers along with The Lark Ascending. I would love to see her bring that program back for the Olympic year.

David21 · Mar 14, 2013

CanadianSkaterGuy said:
Hey, why not save her the effort of having to jump then, and just have her skate and still beat everyone. Clearly jumping ability doesn't matter if you're a stronger skater in general.

Why are you repeating the same dubious crap about Kostner in this thread again and again and again?
The jumping ability is one of the things that sets her apart from other skaters. Most of them didn't even attempt a triple-triple combination and Caro's jumps are always high and (mostly) fully rotated. And she has correct edges on lutz and flip.
The triple loop she did in this SP is only marginally easier than the triple flip.

The jump mistake she did was actually the reason why didn't place first so your comment does make even less sense.

FlattFan · Mar 14, 2013

Kostner had ONE mistake. A big mistake, we all agree.
But the other 6 elements required in the SP, she did them extremely well.

Her 2A got the highest GOE of the field.
Her step sequence also got the highest GOE of the field.

Did people suddenly forget that she's really strong on the other 6 elements?

When you aggregate scores for each element together, then you have her as #2. Goodness, what's so hard to understand. if you have A and A+ in 5 classes, and a C in one class, you are still going to be a top student.
If you have Bs in a bunch of classes, well, enjoy community college.

pangtongfan · Mar 14, 2013

FlattFan said:
Saturday will be nail biting. Caro will need to skate clean. That's the only way to pressure the rest of them.
Yuna needs to ignore the flip call. Take an edge hit, don't second guess it.
Mao needs to be free. Just skate. Don't worry about placement. They will fall into place.
Akiko needs to have a skate of her life to make sure she's still Japan #2 (or #1 if Mao falters)
Kanako needs to avoid becoming a serial URer.
Kaetlyn needs to be clean to show people that she can do 2 clean programs back to back. Set herself up for 2014 and beyond.
Ashley needs to keep her place.
Gracie needs to move up and gain back 3 spots for the US.
As for the rest of them, they can do whatever they do as long as they don't spoil my wishlist above.

Even if Suzuki somehow beats Mao it would not make her the Japanese #1 in the JSF eyes. She beat Mao at Worlds last year, and clearly that did not make her the Japanese #1 on the grand prix this season. I agree though if she loses to Murakami again here, she will be demoted to Japanese #3 next season.

daniel1406 · Mar 14, 2013

FlattFan said:
Kostner had ONE mistake. A big mistake, we all agree.
But the other 6 elements required in the SP, she did them extremely well.

Her 2A got the highest GOE of the field.
Her step sequence also got the highest GOE of the field.

Did people suddenly forget that she's really strong on the other 6 elements?

When you aggregate scores for each element together, then you have her as #2. Goodness, what's so hard to understand. if you have A and A+ in 5 classes, and a C in one class, you are still going to be a top student.
If you have Bs in a bunch of classes, well, enjoy community college.

I agree she skated beautifully. but I was focusing on YUNA's score. And people need to compare Yuna's score to other top skaters to see if it was fair.
it's not about Kostner's score is hight but it's about Kim's score is too low.

FlattFan · Mar 14, 2013

yuki said:
While I totally agree with you on principle, the SP is supposed to be the technical program and technical mistakes ought to be penalized more severely.

In that case, Yuna did another lutz, should her second lutz be invalidated? What is technical mistake? What should be penalized more severely compare to others?
Stop your nonsense. Pull out an abacus and tally up her score. I promise you they add up to 66.86.

Colanboy · Mar 14, 2013

FlattFan said:
Kostner had ONE mistake. A big mistake, we all agree.
But the other 6 elements required in the SP, she did them extremely well.

Her 2A got the highest GOE of the field.
Her step sequence also got the highest GOE of the field.

Did people suddenly forget that she's really strong on the other 6 elements?

When you aggregate scores for each element together, then you have her as #2. Goodness, what's so hard to understand. if you have A and A+ in 5 classes, and a C in one class, you are still going to be a top student.
If you have Bs in a bunch of classes, well, enjoy community college.

Eclair · Mar 14, 2013

But we not talking about comparing her with 'most of them'. She's placing on top of a group of skaters of which everyone attemps a triple-triple and went clean or had harder jumps like the 3axel.
Most ladies in the top groups have the jumping ability but potentially perfect jumps are not what is judged, there's no point in insisting that she has the jumping ability if she doesn't deliver.

Carolina didn't rotate her Toeloop at the second half of her combination. It's not about falls on fully rotated jumps vs. underrotation. It's underrotion being differently penelized by the judges depending on the skater doing them. She should have gotten -3 GOE for them just like every other skater would have gotten in her place.

daniel1406 · Mar 14, 2013

Guys, with my Korean friend's help, I captured some images of Kim's 3F. and it hasn't been changed.

look at her left knee and her body.

http://postimage.org/gallery/agr394vc/

As the commentators of Universal Sports said, it was "absolutely some human element making that call".

I don't see any wrong with that 3F either.

By the way, only Osmond and Kim received a standing ovation lol

FlattFan · Mar 14, 2013

pangtongfan said:
Even if Suzuki somehow beats Mao it would not make her the Japanese #1 in the JSF eyes. She beat Mao at Worlds last year, and clearly that did not make her the Japanese #1 on the grand prix this season. I agree though if she loses to Murakami again here, she will be demoted to Japanese #3 next season.

I know she's never going to be Japan #1. Probably due to mostly look and maybe raw talent. It was wistful thinking on my part. But she can't afford to be Japan #3. Then her chance at anything is OVER.

FlattFan · Mar 14, 2013

Melon said:
Do you expect a person who's bitten by a vampire to be all joyful?
Come on now, this isn't Twilight.

I like to argue this is TWILIGHT. She got the Kristen Steward's blank look down to a tee.

aftertherain · Mar 14, 2013

FlattFan said:
I like to argue this is TWILIGHT. She got the Kristen Steward's blank look down to a tee.

She's got Edward's sparkles too. Or rather, she's got Bella's sparkles after Edward bit her a dozen times.

katymay · Mar 14, 2013

Melon said:
Do you expect a person who's bitten by a vampire to be all joyful?
Come on now, this isn't Twilight.

Well, I would say it is the program theme...except this is how she has skated all week, even doing run throughs of her long program. And it isn't just 'smile', it is having any expression whatsoever-many of the skaters have solemn themes, but they still manage facial expression, some sort of clue that they are actually 'feeling' the performance. Yuna is a beautiful girl, and a beautiful skater...but her program today was uninspired, and I found her performance methodical and emotionless. (I don't dispute her placement however, I think the point margin probably should have been larger.)

FlattFan · Mar 14, 2013

Yuna's best SP was Danse for me. I don't know why she's picking a stinker this year. She needs to learn from Mao. Picking the wrong programs in the Olympics year and the chance of Gold diminishes greatly. Her TES will keep her up, but her PCS will not.

bmelanie · Mar 14, 2013

FlattFan said:
I like to argue this is TWILIGHT. She got the Kristen Steward's blank look down to a tee.

I object!
http://i2.media.daumcdn.net/photo-media/201212/09/yonhap/20121209004806468.jpg
http://img.seoul.co.kr/img/upload/2012/12/09/SSI_20121209110917_V.jpg

I mean, I'm not the hugest fan of the music or theme here either, but a lot of people keep saying she 'phoned in' and I simply don't agree.

David21 · Mar 14, 2013

daniel1406 said:
I agree she skated beautifully. but I was focusing on YUNA's score. And people need to compare Yuna's score to other top skaters to see if it was fair.
it's not about Kostner's score is hight but it's about Kim's score is too low.

Why is Kim's score too low? She's more than 3 points ahead of Kostner even though she had a clear mistake as well (took off from the wrong edge).

daniel1406 · Mar 14, 2013

katymay said:
Well, I would say it is the program theme...except this is how she has skated all week, even doing run throughs of her long program. And it isn't just 'smile', it is having any expression whatsoever-many of the skaters have solemn themes, but they still manage facial expression, some sort of clue that they are actually 'feeling' the performance. Yuna is a beautiful girl, and a beautiful skater...but her program today was uninspired, and I found her performance methodical and emotionless. (I don't dispute her placement however, I think the point margin probably should have been larger.)

I think it's totally up to each individual's personal preferences.

But if her performance was truly methodical, emotionless and uninspiring, why did she received a standing ovation from the crowd. Only Osmond and Kim received a standing ovation. The crowds are not fools. They see it and they feel it. and in fact, they are in a better position to judge (as they get to see the real performance) than most of us who watch the performance on TV or youtube....

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