2013 Worlds Ladies SP | Page 65 | Golden Skate

2013 Worlds Ladies SP

guanchi

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 31, 2012
After watching kostner, she could've easily been back at least 7-8 pts instead of 3- what a major gift she got. That 3t was 2footed, prerotated to hell, and ur'ed, perhaps even dgraded. Oh, and that hard fall. Plus that ?choke? face she did, ***??? More arm flailing than usual. Spins did not look great, or even really good. Really looks like no more than a 63-64 performance. But not as bad as 2008 worlds (that was a travesty)
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Kostner had ONE mistake. A big mistake, we all agree.
But the other 6 elements required in the SP, she did them extremely well.

Her 2A got the highest GOE of the field.
Her step sequence also got the highest GOE of the field.

Did people suddenly forget that she's really strong on the other 6 elements?

When you aggregate scores for each element together, then you have her as #2. Goodness, what's so hard to understand. if you have A and A+ in 5 classes, and a C in one class, you are still going to be a top student.
If you have Bs in a bunch of classes, well, enjoy community college. :)

I wouldn't say she did all her other elements extremely well. Her loop was a bit tight on the landing, and her final layback wasn't great. But her other spins were good as was her 2A and footwork sequence.

Honestly though, when was the last time internationally that a ladies skater fell in her short program and was still 2nd? (Well, other than Euros. ;) :rolleye:)
 

WeakAnkles

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 1, 2011
ITA! Thanks WeakAnkles for your articulate and insightful assessments re the falls vs pops bust-up. Maybe you are a long-time watcher of figure skating, like me. ;)

Since the dawn of Sonjia Henie era, I think figure skating has been all about a deal with the devil. Lots of other factors coming into play now over the past few decades. I speculate that nothing much will change unless die-hard fans actively revolt. The sport will continue on bleeding its youth dry and giving nothing much to its fans unless and until someone with vision who has a figure skating background, and who is politically impartial takes the reins and implements well thought out changes to the entire structural system and regulations. That may never happen, and the sport may be content to continue limping along with the math-obsessed CoP generation of fans, and with the sport's impressionable young dreamers with damaged limbs bringing up the rear.

Sorry I didn't notice this earlier--I got caught up in a VERY interesting Ice Dance competition. Thank you for the compliment and yes, I've been a long-time watcher (and listened to every single thing Uncle Dick and Peggy had to say--you can learn a whole bunch listening to those two!).

COP has its problems, but you should remember that things weren't so rosy in the pre-COP era either. Though I admit I miss hissing at all the judges who didn't agree with me! At least then I knew who they were and what scores they had given. :)
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Just found something ridiculous.

Skating Skills 7.00 7.00 7.25 7.25 8.00 7.50 7.75 7.25 6.50
Transition / Linking Footwork 0.80 6.75 6.75 7.00 7.00 8.75 7.50 7.75 6.75 6.00 7.07
Performance / Execution 0.80 7.25 7.50 7.25 7.50 8.00 8.00 8.25 7.00 6.25 7.50
Choreography / Composition 0.80 7.25 7.25 7.00 7.50 8.50 7.50 8.25 7.25 6.50 7.43
Interpretation 0.80 7.50 7.50 7.25 7.50 9.00 8.00 8.50 7.25 6.25 7.64

This is Osmond's PCS score sheet.
You can clearly see...............something odd about this score...
Such as a random 9 in between 7.5's.....
hmmmmmmmmmm judges hmmmmmmmmmmmm

What about the random 6.25 and 6.00?
 

daniel1406

Rinkside
Joined
Oct 18, 2009
You think If I have to take a guess, many Canadians are still offended by the lack of tact she showed when she abruptly broke up with Orser after the Olympics despite that Canada nurtured and supported her for all those years even though she was a big rival to Joannie Rochette (without Yu Na, Rochette would have won Worlds in 2009). On the other hand, her performance today also wasn't very inspiring, so there was that as well.

Many swimmers from Asia train in Australia (with Aussie coaches). I wouldn't say my country is nurturing and supporting those Asian swimmers. They pay for everything (coach, training, accommodation and etc). And it is for them to decide where to get trained and whom they want to get trained from. And they can change their coaches under their contractual terms (generally after one season or something). They might change their coaches during the season but they might have to pay some extra as stated in the contract.

As far as I understand, Yuna didn't break up with Brian. Their contract ended after the olympics (or before, I'm not 100% sure but surely around the olympics season). I don't know why she didn't choose Brian as her coach after the olympics (she once said she would retire after the olympics).
I've heard that there were misunderstandings caused by cultural tensions bw Japan and Korea... but I don't want to know it and I don't need to know it. Anyway, I don't see why many Canadians are still offended.

and let's get the fact straight, Yuna won the 09 worlds and the olympics because of her talent not because of Canada -_-

I've watched Yuna's interview this year, and she still calls Canada, her 2nd HOME, she loves the country and loves her Canadian fans+skaters.

Oh and she's a huge fan of David Wilson -_-
 

wallylutz

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
Mao's Triple Axel attempt and GOE

There was a question re: Mao's Triple Axel attempt in the SP and why it gathered some positive GOE despite the 2 footed attempt.

Here is a short answer: Mao's Triple Axel attempt today was in fact quite solid. The audience's reaction suggested that the vast majority of people felt, at the moment when she landed, that it was a fully rotated clean attempt. This means, to the necked eyes, the touch down was not easily detectable. From my angle, it was totally invisible. My first reaction when she landed it was that it was a fully rotated attempt and you guys know how critical I have been about her Triple Axel attempts over the years.

Now, when the replay was shown on the big screen, I saw the touch down on the slow-motion replay but felt the jump got enough rotations in. Even then, many people still missed it. When the marks came out, some people in the stands were extremely surprised by the low scores, so I explained to the eldery couple in front of me that Mao in fact two footed the 3A and the landing on the 3F was iffy.

As far as the judges were concerned, they did not have the opportunity to review the jumps on slow-motion replays like you guys do in front of a screen - the rules simply do not permit them to do so. Granted, the angle they were sitting at was much better (to detect any touch down) than where I was sitting on that particular jump. What this means is all of you who feel outraged by some judges giving positive GOE for this 3A attempt should know that you have an advantage that the judges simply did not have. They were required to look at the jump in real-time speed and in this case, that would make it very difficult to detect the touch down. So some will naturally catch it, and some won't. Plus, a slight touch down is a type of error where the GOE doesn't necessarily have to be negative as the suggested penalty is only -1, which can be easily compensated by other positive features of the jump such as creativity/difficulty of the entry, power/height of the jump, flow in/out of the jump and any other variations. In reviewing this jump, assuming the -1 penalty is applied but the jump was overall very well executed, I feel 0 or +1 GOE are all possible and acceptable values in this case. It is hard for me to tell you how much GOE I would gave given her in this case because I completely missed the touch down from where I was sitting. For me to see the TD during slow-motion then apply it is not the right process. However, based on the circumstances I provided you from the rink today, I think you can understand why the scoring of this element really isn't controversial at all as many seemed to think.
 

wallylutz

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
Maybe tickets were sold out before Koreans could get them (or realized Yuna was competing) -- seems like a good crowd of Canadians and Americans.

You could be right. The Koreans I saw seemed to be Koreans living in Canada, possibly from the Toronto area. Their English is way too good for an average Korean.
 

Robeye

Final Flight
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
Just because you didn't notice something, doesn't mean it didn't exist. Maybe you were not affected by the phenomenon back then because you did not search for any other figure skating video besides the ones of Yuna Kim, which is, of course, understandable.

You completely misconstrue the point (which is, of course, understandable), which is that it wasn't only Yuna's fans who were indulging in over-the-top antics on Youtube. Or were you not aware of that?
 

sunrock

Rinkside
Joined
Feb 24, 2009
Hey, I'm glad it's me, rather than any particular skating related subject that brought you out of you lurkdom. I am truly honoured. As for your question - it's very easy. My negativity toward her ubers started at a time when I couldn't search for one single figure skating video on Youtube without having 2 or 3 pages of Yuna videos come up (or tactless "Japanese skaters obstructing Kim during practice" videos and all sorts of other ridiculous crap). I mean what kind of fans do that kind of stuff? :laugh:
i like how you conveniently leave out the part that a certain other skater's fan did exactly the same thing. any time i tried to look up skating youtube vids i got just as many results for skating obstruction as i did with ugly korean, plastic surgery skater and yuna kim hated by other skaters. maybe you had better search filters? :/

also, in your line of logic, what kind of figure skating fan comes to a forum to continually attack one particular skater and her fans only for years? oh, that's right. you.
 

daniel1406

Rinkside
Joined
Oct 18, 2009
There was a question re: Mao's Triple Axel attempt in the SP and why it gathered some positive GOE despite the 2 footed attempt.

Here is a short answer: Mao's Triple Axel attempt today was in fact quite solid. The audience's reaction suggested that the vast majority of people felt, at the moment when she landed, that it was a fully rotated clean attempt. This means, to the necked eyes, the touch down was not easily detectable. From my angle, it was totally invisible. My first reaction when she landed it was that it was a fully rotated attempt and you guys know how critical I have been about her Triple Axel attempts over the years.

Now, when the replay was shown on the big screen, I saw the touch down on the slow-motion replay but felt the jump got enough rotations in. Even then, many people still missed it. When the marks came out, some people in the stands were extremely surprised by the low scores, so I explained to the eldery couple in front of me that Mao in fact two footed the 3A and the landing on the 3F was iffy.

As far as the judges were concerned, they did not have the opportunity to review the jumps on slow-motion replays like you guys do in front of a screen - the rules simply do not permit them to do so. Granted, the angle they were sitting at was much better (to detect any touch down) than where I was sitting on that particular jump. What this means is all of you who feel outraged by some judges giving positive GOE for this 3A attempt should know that you have an advantage that the judges simply did not have. They were required to look at the jump in real-time speed and in this case, that would make it very difficult to detect the touch down. So some will naturally catch it, and some won't. Plus, a slight touch down is a type of error where the GOE doesn't necessarily have to be negative as the suggested penalty is only -1, which can be easily compensated by other positive features of the jump such as creativity/difficulty of the entry, power/height of the jump, flow in/out of the jump and any other variations. In reviewing this jump, assuming the -1 penalty is applied but the jump was overall very well executed, I feel 0 or +1 GOE are all possible and acceptable values in this case. It is hard for me to tell you how much GOE I would gave given her in this case because I completely missed the touch down from where I was sitting. For me to see the TD during slow-motion then apply it is not the right process. However, based on the circumstances I provided you from the rink today, I think you can understand why the scoring of this element really isn't controversial at all as many seemed to think.

I'm literally speechless mate...

1. "Mao's 3A was quite solid" : how so? it's clearly two foot landed and should've been downgraded.
2. "audiences reactions....." : -_-
3. "... felt the jump got enough rotations in" : you FELT. but it didn't. The rotation wasn't finished when she landed.
4. "the judges didn't have the opportunity to review the jumps on slow-motion replays like you guys do in front of a screen" : really? how come I could tell Mao's 3A was two footed and should get downgraded straight from the live stream? I didn't have to watch it over and over again. And where was the tech judge? why was he/she so generous on Mao not on some skaters?

5. "I think you can understand why the scoring of this element really isn't controversial at all as many seemed to think" : no I literally do not understand why she got 8.50+0.14 on that 3A.
 

FlattFan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jan 4, 2010
Honestly though, when was the last time internationally that a ladies skater fell in her short program and was still 2nd? (Well, other than Euros. ;) :rolleye:)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAnl1pAGztY
The last time was in 2011 where Yuna almost landed on her *** on the lutz. Did a flip-2toe. Uninspiring program and guess what, she WON the SP.

Almost 66points for ONE clean triple.
Caro did 2 clean triples and had harder steps and only scored 1 point higher.

So there you go.
 

Krislite

Medalist
Joined
Sep 22, 2010
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAnl1pAGztY
The last time was in 2011 where Yuna almost landed on her *** on the lutz. Did a flip-2toe. Uninspiring program and guess what, she WON the SP.

Almost 66points for ONE clean triple.
Caro did 2 clean triples and had harder steps and only scored 1 point higher.

So there you go.

*Almost* a fall is not a fall. She saved herself quite a few points by not *actually* landing on her behind like Carolina.
 

cooper

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
Everyone knows that the poster above has an axe to grind with Yu-Na, so no need to guess on the motivations of the poster above. I was there today. Yu-Na did indeed get a standing ovation. I can't guess on percentages, but most of my section stood (upper section). (Oh, and did you all know that Joannie Rochette was a rival to Yu-Na? Really? Rochette was her own biggest enemy in terms of success, and she and Yu-Na were never really rivals, seeing as Rochette only beat her once at Yu-Na's senior debut. I love Rochette but am appalled at the above.)

Kanako did get a nice standing ovation, and she was lovely. One of my top three performances of the afternoon, along with Yu-Na and Osmond.

The only chilly reaction from the audience during the ladies SP today was that to Carolina Kostner's score, but not to Kostner herself. It was stunned silence afterwards. That's just my observation sitting in the audience today. I'm not arguing right now about whether or not Kostner deserved her scores, but I am pretty sure that second 3T was UR--they played it in slow-mo on the arena.

thank you for this.

im hoping yuna will skate her heart out in her lp. she will be even more nervous now because she will be last.
 

Krislite

Medalist
Joined
Sep 22, 2010
thank you for this.

im hoping yuna will skate her heart out in her lp. she will be even more nervous now because she will be last.

No. I think she'll be even more fired up and less nervous than in the short program. She's actually been more confident with her LP this season.
 

b-man

Final Flight
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
I'd rather see falls than things like cheats which expose the fact that a skater didn't learn proper technique.

So a fall exposes the skater did learn proper technique? You apparently believe the correct finishing position for a fully rotated jump is a fall.
 

CoyoteChris

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 4, 2004
Just a comment from the peanut gallery. There are some nice YuNa posters on the wall here but if this is a sellout crowd, then lots of folk decided to throw away there tickets rather than fill there seats. I cant think of seeing one Korean flag being waved that I could see from my angle but I am sure there must be a few. But this is nothing like SA Lake Placid where the Korean folk would pour into the arena for HER performance and then leave. Then again , this isnt a cheep event to see!
Old coyote headed for poor house and bed. (Look for major report on Worlds, everything except skating, when I retuun.) (They ran out out of programs. Rumor of more tomarrow)UOTE=Mrs. P;722564]Maybe tickets were sold out before Koreans could get them (or realized Yuna was competing) -- seems like a good crowd of Canadians and Americans.[/QUOTE]
 

uncchristine99

Rinkside
Joined
Oct 29, 2012
Wow, I'm AMAZED at how solid Yuna Kim was! Peter Carruthers is right--she doesn't look but a day past Vancouver. Unreal! I love that she just comes in and throws it down. She never seems to care who else is competing--she just shows up and takes care of biz. It'd be super cool for her to run away with gold but then I'd feel bad for all the other ladies--no one else has been absent since Vancouver and Yuna swooping back in for an easy win would be a telling statement. The ladies field has been blah since Vancouver so this is really exciting! 87 pages of analysis already!
 

Gymfan15

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Hoooooly crap, I guess I'm glad that I have to work on Saturday because I don't think my nerves could take the pressure. The US ladies are SO CLOSE. They're either going to do this, or they're going to choke...aaaaaaaaghhhh.

Looking at who they are up against, Gracie is tasked with improving her placement the most...Ashley might find it hard to move up any further. She could pass Kaetlyn if rookie nerves come into play, but Mao is also very close and the two could just swap places. Gracie has more wiggle room at the bottom and has the most pressure to perform.

Guess we'll see...nailbiting!
 
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