2013 worlds pairs FS | Page 23 | Golden Skate

2013 worlds pairs FS

Art&Sport

Medalist
Joined
Apr 28, 2011
Agreed. I understand that spectators who boo are, generally, booing the scores and the officials who determined them, but with a skater or pair sitting in the kiss and cry while it happens, it can't help but be felt to be rather uncomfortably directed at the skaters themselves, which I think is completely unfair. I didn't like it when Chan's scores were booed and I don't like it now with S/S.

It's too bad V/T's magnificent performance has been somewhat overshadowed. Because that? That was what I've been missing in pairs skating for a long time. V/T were stunning — they're just quality, quality, quality. That section where they did mirroring spirals down the length of the ice? Gorgeous. That triple twist was out of this world. Just stunning. But...can someone please give this incredible pair choreography that matches the level of their talent? Please? It's not that it was bad, it just wasn't special enough, IMO, for what this team is.

I'm thrilled for D/R. They are fighters and got all out for the most difficult technical elements. I confess, though, that I love M-T/M more. Hopefully with this worlds result they'll start to get a bit more respect in terms of scores. I think their stock was definitely affected by their disastrous season last year. Great to see such a comeback. For me, they had the second best FS of the night.

The booing was a bit more mild for S/S here than in Nice because after all, it was not that huge a deal here re silver medal placement, except for Canadian fans. Even D/R are more realistic than Canadian fans in realizing they were lucky to be a few decimal points ahead of S/S in the sp, which was more IMO about the judges sending Aliona and Robin a message.

The booing in Nice was louder and much more disruptive and it continued into the medal ceremony. Another difference is that the Nice crowd was not booing because they felt a French skater wuzrobbed. It was because they felt Dai Takahashi from Japan was wrongfully denied a deserved World championship gold medal over Patrick Chan of Canada who made too many errors in both programs but still won. The Nice crowd was mesmerized by Dai's performances and couldn't understand why Patrick was rewarded over him with disruptive mistakes.

The two situations and circumstances are hugely different but if it makes you feel better to think they're the same, I get why. ;)

And don't cry for V/T! What's the tears about? They are the current pairs team pets of ISU and Russian fed, and the odds-on favorites for pairs gold in Sochi. V/T certainly are not being overshadowed by anything that occurred in London, Ontario. You've got that wrong too.

And there you go, crying over M-T/M not being on the podium. Jeez, like I said a couple of times already, what do you want, your cake, the icing, a cherry-on-top, and eat it too?! The Worlds isn't even over yet and you guys are acting out cuz you can't have two pairs teams on the podium. And believe me, that ain't gonna happen in Sochi either, unless some top teams who are not Canadian incur injuries and don't compete. Patrick has won with falls again, and Kevin Reynolds had a good showing. V/M is gonna medal whether it's gold or silver, and KO is threatening for the podium too her first year at Worlds in the senior ranks no less. Still, some of you whiners are just so unhappy all the time and over-anxious and greedy.
 

rain

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 29, 2003
The booing was a bit more mild for S/S here than in Nice because after all, it was not that huge a deal here re silver medal placement, except for Canadian fans. Even D/R are more realistic than Canadian fans in realizing they were lucky to be a few decimal points ahead of S/S in the sp, which was more IMO about the judges sending Aliona and Robin a message.

The booing in Nice was louder and much more disruptive and it continued into the medal ceremony. Another difference is that the Nice crowd was not booing because they felt a French skater wuzrobbed. It was because they felt Dai Takahashi from Japan was wrongfully denied a deserved World championship gold medal over Patrick Chan of Canada who made too many errors in both programs but still won. The Nice crowd was mesmerized by Dai's performances and couldn't understand why Patrick was rewarded over him with disruptive mistakes.

The two situations and circumstances are hugely different but if it makes you feel better to think they're the same, I get why. ;)

And don't cry for V/T! What's the tears about? They are the current pairs team pets of ISU and Russian fed, and the odds-on favorites for pairs gold in Sochi. V/T certainly are not being overshadowed by anything that occurred in London, Ontario. You've got that wrong too.

And there you go, crying over M-T/M not being on the podium. Jeez, like I said a couple of times already, what do you want, your cake, the icing, a cherry-on-top, and eat it too?! The Worlds isn't even over yet and you guys are acting out cuz you can't have two pairs teams on the podium. And believe me, that ain't gonna happen in Sochi either, unless some top teams who are not Canadian incur injuries and don't compete. Patrick has won with falls again, and Kevin Reynolds had a good showing. V/M is gonna medal whether it's gold or silver, and KO is threatening for the podium too her first year at Worlds in the senior ranks no less. Still, some of you whiners are just so unhappy all the time and over-anxious and greedy.

Wow, you are seriously what the ignore button is for, aren't you? So here you go...
 

Art&Sport

Medalist
Joined
Apr 28, 2011
Canada sucks. It's people are awful. They shouldn't be let out of zoos let alone to sporting events. Seriously, how the UN doesn't bomb them is beyond me. They need to take after their politer neighbours to the south (and north). Americans are clearly a superior specimen of humanity.

That said, the audience booing was rude and unfair. Massively disappointing to hear i

... Think next year at US Nationals will be a bloodbath.

Awww, now, Canada and Canadians don't suck, but sometimes over-protective Patrick Chan fans do, and so do his SS-happy judges usually so eager to gift him when he makes mistakes, and to set records for him when he happens to skate clean. And I think cheese connoisseur, PJ Kwong, and many V/M fans tend to have a sucky attitude toward anyone they think could possibly threaten or who doesn't bow down to their do-no-wrong skaters.

This factor doesn't make me dislike Canada or Canadians in general, just some of the attitudes of some of Canada's figure skating fans in particular. Any skater I'm enamored of, it makes no difference to me what their nationality is. Of course, I will root for many U.S. skaters who I'm gonna know more about as a U.S. fan, but as the skating world and world in general has grown smaller, the boundaries of country and politics don't seem to make a whole lot of sense anymore. The skating community is so intertwined now too in a good way. I think the sport should be less about politics in any case, but I doubt that is going away any time soon, if ever.

In any case, an example of how we are all truthfully one big happy (if bickering) family, there was an article in the Canadian press which wrote about the fact that Meryl Davis' grandmother on one side of her family has Canadian roots in the London, Ontario area.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
Awww, now, Canada and Canadians don't suck, but sometimes over-protective Patrick Chan fans do, and so do his SS-happy judges usually so eager to gift him when he makes mistakes, and to set records for him when he happens to skate clean. And I think cheese connoisseur, PJ Kwong, and many V/M fans tend to have a sucky attitude toward anyone they think could possibly threaten or who doesn't bow down to their do-no-wrong skaters.

This factor doesn't make me dislike Canada or Canadians in general, just some of the attitudes of some of Canada's figure skating fans in particular. Any skater I'm enamored of, it makes no difference to me what their nationality is. Of course, I will root for many U.S. skaters who I'm gonna know more about as a U.S. fan, but as the skating world and world in general has grown smaller, the boundaries of country and politics don't seem to make a whole lot of sense anymore. The skating community is so intertwined now too in a good way. I think the sport should be less about politics in any case, but I doubt that is going away any time soon, if ever.

In any case, an example of how we are all truthfully one big happy (if bickering) family, there was an article in the Canadian press which wrote about the fact that Meryl Davis' grandmother on one side of her family has Canadian roots in the London, Ontario area.


Very well said, especialy regarding PJ Kwong who tries to elevate V&M and Chan to god all time perfection status, and gets tizzy at anyone who dares to contest the notion.
 

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
Awww, now, Canada and Canadians don't suck, but sometimes over-protective Patrick Chan fans do, and so do his SS-happy judges usually so eager to gift him when he makes mistakes, and to set records for him when he happens to skate clean. And I think cheese connoisseur, PJ Kwong, and many V/M fans tend to have a sucky attitude toward anyone they think could possibly threaten or who doesn't bow down to their do-no-wrong skaters.

If it's any consolation, I genuinely think the same thing of you, your attitudes about American and international skaters, and how as soon as any international skater gets higher marks than a specific American skater, it's because of politicking and otherwise. So I guess were are one big, bickering family after all. That said, my comments you refer to are juvenile at best, and I wish I had been more tactful.
 

chiocciola

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
What a night!!!

1) KS - the most beautiful program of the night... even the audience...the Canadians were ready to give them the podium and standing O but for the mistakes...I wish Moscvina took some young promising couple or maybe BL that style would suit them...
2) MMT - I really like them, more than DR but I think that's the national placement as well...they're the second pair.
3) DR - definetely deserved the silver... but since the protocols say they had mistakes...ok...anyway, a deserved medal.
4) SS - another empty program, there's no spark.
5) VT - what a performance...how brilliant technically they are... and those elements do deserve +3... if they don't what way do you have to do that??? Stupid fall but even charming))) The score - HUGE... I was WOW??? I don't think they should have cracked 149 yet)))

My placement:
1) VT - with a big lead
2) DR - with a margin
3) SS
 

davogt

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 16, 2013
Chuckum
You reply with such conviction that the boos heard were all from Canadians. I presume then that you were in the audience in London. If you were not how could you possibly know. I was watching the feed on tv and I could hear the noise yes but the audience was not panned and there was no way I could know that every boo came from a Canadian fan. Neither could even if you were there. Unless you could see them with a Canadian flag or piece of clothing denoting there were indeed Canadian. I have watche for years and in every competition there are boos and rumblings from the crowd when they do not like the marks. So please get off the backs of the Canadians every other country is just as guilty at one time or another. I believe they cheered V/T because they felt they deserved what they had won.
jfdw

After lurking for a while, I figured as a Canadian I should put my two cents in.

I was in the audience. I can't say who was booing around the arena as a whole, but I'd wager confidently that the vast majority were Canadians (if only because the majority of those present were Canadians). I cheered quite loudly, actually, not because I loved S/S's program, but I was frankly disgusted by how it was received. We all know exactly, without having to think about it, how Canadian fans would have reacted if the situation were the reverse and a Canadian pair had eked out an unlikely victory after a tough performance. There would be no boos, and probably no griping about bad judging. This isn't even a hypothetical question: witness the reactions to Chan's performance a few hours later. It's ludicrous to think that a Canadian audience would loudly boo judges who had delivered an unfairly high score to a Canadian skater(s). People were cranky that their team lost and the judges were a good target to aim their anger at.
 

Art&Sport

Medalist
Joined
Apr 28, 2011
If it's any consolation, I genuinely think the same thing of you, your attitudes about American and international skaters, and how as soon as any international skater gets higher marks than a specific American skater, it's because of politicking and otherwise. So I guess were are one big, bickering family after all. That said, my comments you refer to are juvenile at best, and I wish I had been more tactful.

Yep, good points. We're all human and we get so identified as a human species with stuff we are emotionally attached to that gives us pleasure or pain. Sure I've had some knee-jerk reactions, but I genuinely love and pull for a lot of Canadian skaters, and many are some of my favorite skaters. I love S/P and hate how they are so often picked on for what they had no control over whatsoever at SLC. They and B/S were the victims, as well as all the skaters are victims to the system, including Patrick Chan.

I happen to really enjoy and admire D/R, and M-T/M have great choreo this season. I didn't like it tho' when Dube/ Davison were held up along with another Canadian pairs team at 2010 Olympics over Evora/ Ladwig who skated better than those teams. And I also didn't like it when Patrick Chan and Stephane Lambiel were held up over Johnny Weir when both of the former made numerous errors in both their programs at 2010 Olympics. You could probably pick out instances where you didn't like some occurrences/ results either. That doesn't keep me from admiring Lambiel and I loved watching Dube/ Davison and I rooted for them when they skated well. I also rooted for Jessica with her new partner. I've already mentioned other current and former Canadian skaters on my list of favorite skaters of all time. I don't like over-hype and favoritism whether it's an American, Canadian, or any other skater. Its a fact of figure skating, that fairness often goes out the window under any judging system due to subjectivity and politics.

Even if there were problems and unfairness with 6.0, at the least there were often more interesting, engaging and artistically unique programs to enjoy. I don't blame the skaters for the problems. And I suppose it's never gonna be a scenario where fans always get along, because of our differences in perspectives and experiences, likes and dislikes. It might be helpful though if the more overzealous fans who love Patrick would stop acting as if he always deserves the scores he receives. Even he might benefit from a serious wake-up call.

Not sure what suzukifan27 means about Canadians having "not many things except FS to be proud of and clinch to." That's a ridiculous statement. Canada has loads of wonderful natural resources, sports teams, different cultures, places to go and things to do, history to uncover, fascinating people to meet. Wake up and smell the roses. We all need to wake up and realize that figure skating is not life or death, but just something we are emotionally attached to for different reasons, not always good ones. Putting it all into perspective is difficult, but doing that may help us enjoy fs more. For example, it might help to try not putting so much weight on what the judges think in the first place. :biggrin:
 

daphna

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 6, 2004
Canadians should have been 2nd and 3rd in any order between the 2 teams. S&S should have been left of the podium with the 3 big errors they had. what a disasterous judging.
 

cutesonic

Rinkside
Joined
Oct 29, 2011
Poor Sui. Can't stand seeing her crying after the FS. They should rest and prepare for the next season. Coming to WC wouldn't help China gaining three spots but only hurt her. Strong girl. What a fighter and pleasant pair to watch. With time, they can become the champion.
 

Ilvskating

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 30, 2010
I felt so lucky to be there watching V/T' s superb performance. It was just gorgeous ! Long standing ovations all around and loud cheering that lasted. they were well loved here!!!

As a canadian I didn't boo S/S's score and after seeing the protocol I'm even more at peace with the placement. S/S do have better SS and more transitions. in addition S/S skated beautifully besides those big errors, but they did a 3Ath and they got all level 4 while Meagan and Eric also had a urs in their jump combo, and all the lifts were level 3, so I can understand S/S getting the silver. In fact, D/R got a SB was a bit surprising as I think their FS at 4 CC was better. Overall, I think the medalist are all well deserving and in the correct ranking.

Sui / Han was very exciting to watch but I feel so sorry seeing her in such pain after finishing the program. They should let her stay home resting.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
I felt badly for Sui & Han too especialy as in an injured state they shouldnt have even been at Worlds. Unfortunately skating poorly while injured, when due to their injury they shouldnt have been assigned to Worlds to begin with, will drop their already fading stock further. Sui & Han wont even be on the Olympic team next year with China having only 2 spots. Pang & Tong are a shoo in for the first spot. The other spot will likely go to Peng & Zhang. They show more overall promise than Sui & Han despite Zhangs age, and they are showing positive momentum now. Yu & Jin might have a shot at that 2nd spot as well.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
I felt so lucky to be there watching V/T' s superb performance. It was just gorgeous ! Long standing ovations all around and loud cheering that lasted. they were well loved here!!!

As a canadian I didn't boo S/S's score and after seeing the protocol I'm even more at peace with the placement. S/S do have better SS and more transitions. in addition S/S skated beautifully besides those big errors, but they did a 3Ath and they got all level 4 while Meagan and Eric also had a urs in their jump combo, and all the lifts were level 3, so I can understand S/S getting the silver. In fact, D/R got a SB was a bit surprising as I think their FS at 4 CC was better. Overall, I think the medalist are all well deserving and in the correct ranking.

Sui / Han was very exciting to watch but I feel so sorry seeing her in such pain after finishing the program. They should let her stay home resting.

I really like Duhamel & Radford but honestly their PCS were generous as it was. No way they deserved higher PCS than Moore-Towers & Moscovitch. I actually had M-T & M 2nd in the LP, and quite possibly wining the bronze ahead of D&R overall. I do wish both pairs could have medaled, but the only way that would have been warranted is if S&S completely missed their last throw triple axel try.
 

sky_fly20

Match Penalty
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
I felt badly for Sui & Han too especialy as in an injured state they shouldnt have even been at Worlds. Unfortunately skating poorly while injured, when due to their injury they shouldnt have been assigned to Worlds to begin with, will drop their already fading stock further. Sui & Han wont even be on the Olympic team next year with China having only 2 spots. Pang & Tong are a shoo in for the first spot. The other spot will likely go to Peng & Zhang. They show more overall promise than Sui & Han despite Zhangs age, and they are showing positive momentum now. Yu & Jin might have a shot at that 2nd spot as well.

I think they aggrevated her injury more, she was in pain after the FS
Sui seems to have gotten taller and her build has changed too, I don't think their partnership will last any longer
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
I think they aggrevated her injury more, she was in pain after the FS
Sui seems to have gotten taller and her build has changed too, I don't think their partnership will last any longer

I tend to agree. The question is whether either or both can find a suitable partner in China to have a brighter. I cant see them staying together much or any longer, and wouldnt be surprised if they split in the summer. She is just too big for him now, and he is not big enough for her.
 

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
I really like Duhamel & Radford but honestly their PCS were generous as it was. No way they deserved higher PCS than Moore-Towers & Moscovitch. I actually had M-T & M 2nd in the LP, and quite possibly wining the bronze ahead of D&R overall. I do wish both pairs could have medaled, but the only way that would have been warranted is if S&S completely missed their last throw triple axel try.

Interesting. I'd argue that D/R tick the PCS boxes quite well with all the transitions they do and their choreography is more complex. MT/M has stronger interpretation. Both had solid performances (I think Mt/M at Nationals or 4CC would've earned higher P/E marks though). Given that it's about 1.7 points overall, I think I agree with D/R ahead of Mt/M, but I understand the reverse.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
Interesting. I'd argue that D/R tick the PCS boxes quite well with all the transitions they do and their choreography is more complex. MT/M has stronger interpretation. Both had solid performances (I think Mt/M at Nationals or 4CC would've earned higher P/E marks though). Given that it's about 1.7 points overall, I think I agree with D/R ahead of Mt/M, but I understand the reverse.

Well of those 3 competitions this is actually the first one D&R had the higher PCS in the LP (they had the higher PCS in the SP in all 3). I can see the argument for transitions but I am not impressed with their overall choreography that much. Their LP does nothing for me even when they skate it well, except for being technically impressive. Their SP is much better.
 

sky_fly20

Match Penalty
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
I tend to agree. The question is whether either or both can find a suitable partner in China to have a brighter. I cant see them staying together much or any longer, and wouldnt be surprised if they split in the summer. She is just too big for him now, and he is not big enough for her.

Sui can find a new Partner for sure, she is still petite for a pairs skater
Cong on the other hand, No, he is too short to be a male pair skater in the first place that is why were bound to get this problem
 

let`s talk

Match Penalty
Joined
Sep 10, 2009
Finally. The beauty in Pairs is back. That was so unbearable to see so many plain-looking champions with ugly lines, horrible postures and crappy progs during last years. Glad to see that the classy elegance is alive and well.

Thanks, Tanya and Max!
 
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