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Thread: 2013 Worlds Men LP

  1. #1036
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    Well..........judging what a skater will do in the future based on what they did in the past is like pounding sand in a rat hole. You never fill it up and you just make the rat mad! In other words..............pointless!

    I don't agree with those that say Patrick is not a great skater. He didn't have a good skate last night - absolutely! But you don't win 3 World championships because of poor judging and bad skates! Does he have to do alot of reflection before next year? Yes. Does he probably have to consider his coaching choices? Yes. But I still think he is one of the more all-around skaters we have right now. There are some that can jump. There are some that have good presentation. There are good spinners and there are men with fleet feet in footwork. But each of them has a weakness somewhere IMO. When Patrick lays down a good skate I don't think there is anybody that can beat him. But like Skater Boy said, we all have our favorites for different reasons. We all have aspects of figure skating that appeal to us more than other aspects. I don't care if someone lands 5 quads in a program if their spins are ugly and their lines are bad. In some ways I wish they would outlaw quads because it detracts from the rest of the program. Young kids coming up are all about the jumps and the rest of their skating suffers! I do get excited when a skater who has been around for a loooooong time puts it all together one more time. But like any sport, some of them stay past their expiration date!

  2. #1037
    Custom Title demarinis5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starryxskies View Post
    I read somewhere in this thread that Czech will keep its 2 spots because Tomas gets 16 points?? But he placed 21st final standings...how does that get him 16 points? Someone tell me how it works if I'm not getting something.

    I was also in the audience tonight. It was such a treat having Jeff Buttle and Joannie Rochette in the audience. They were sitting across from the judges (on the other side) in the lower bowl and they did a little commentary during intermission before the last 2 groups. They signed some autographs and took some photos with the fans after their mini segment, how sweet. Joannie is gorgeous as always and dang Jeff with those glasses. Swoon.

    It was really cute how fans started singing happy birthday to Dai. He was so tense waiting for his score, he didn't even realize until a while later haha. A lot of cheers when the announcer said he turns 27 tomorrow. But seriously, he definitely deserved higher PCS. I couldn't focus much after him at first because I was shocked and super sad. How could he get the same as Javier? Please dump Morozov and just do your own thing next season. Better to do something you're proud of next season and lose than try to play the game and lose. And even better if it wins. Although, I still have faith in him if he goes back to Pasquale. PLEASE!!! But then again, I think having Morozov's Russian name attached to his will help him in Sochi. I wonder if he'll get invited to the Gala, he is the most popular guy in the world right now and you can bet there will be a lot of japanese fans there.

    Yuzuru got underscored. If he had skated in the last group or even later in his own group, he definitely would've gotten a higher score be it from higher GOE or higher PCS. Easily one of the best tonight. He fought so hard, he was dying at the end. He deserved more. Judges need to stop thinking others will fare better just because the last group still has to skate.

    Brian definitely got low balled, I booed with the audience. It guess many of us didn't realize he zayaked at the time. Really shows how his performance got to the audience. But even so, judges really did no favours for him. It's amazing how he's still relatively in the game after so many years. Really proud of him today. He should get bonus just for being the fly that will never go away (meant in the nicest way possible)

    The audience was really silent when Chan got his score. Or perhaps that was just me because my eyes literally dropped. I was gonna flip if the score was above 160 after seeing how he got Chanada bonus in the SP.... and it got 169!?! w-t-f. You could tell by the way the screams were crazy as if George Clooney showed up in the building.

    I don't care how Denis just popped up during Worlds but he had the clean amazing SP AND he had the best FS of the night. AND YET HE DOESN'T GET GOLD?! I'm sorry, but there's something wrong if a great SP + splatfest LP beats out a very good SP + LP of the night. The balance is just not there. If Patrick's SP was not scored as outrageousy and his LP was scored correctly, Denis definitely would've been the champ.

    Crowd's favourites of the night: D10, Javier, Yuzuru and Joubert ...possibly Max as well. Orser must've been motivating his kids like hell. But really glad they were able to get back up. Unfortunate about the SPs.

    I'm excited for WTT for the fact that maybe we can possibly have a retry at what tonight should've been. At least for the skaters who belongs to a well rounded country.
    Thank you for your rinkside report!
    Last edited by demarinis5; 03-16-2013 at 09:32 AM. Reason: sp

  3. #1038
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    Agree with you on Patrick. Would Kevin winning have made the judging any more liked? I still like quality over quantity and think Patrick is definitely one of the best if not the best well rounded skater. Not a good night for him after those quads though. I was not really happy with 4cc results either.

  4. #1039
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    Quote Originally Posted by WeakAnkles View Post
    Until DOE and PCS are more closely tied to TES, you will always have problems There are 11 judges on a panel? Why not make it an even 12, and have 6 TES/GOE judges and 6 PCS judges. Make the relationship between technical mistakes and relevant PCS scores stronger. And get rid of anonymity. People are held accountable for their opinions in the real world. Well guess what judges? You live in the real world too. You shouldn't be allowed to hide behind a cloak of anonymity.
    I think that's a good idea. I also believe that, except for little things in the system that could be corrected or improved, the main problem are the judges. First it is too much for them to judge in such a short time and second, the GOE scores are given rather arbitrarily. The anonymity just prevents every accountability. So I would like to see those suggested changes. It could help.

  5. #1040
    One does not simply skate into Sochi MaiKatze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by figuristka View Post
    Agree with you on Patrick. Would Kevin winning have made the judging any more liked? I still like quality over quantity and think Patrick is definitely one of the best if not the best well rounded skater. Not a good night for him after those quads though. I was not really happy with 4cc results either.
    My first reaction after the LP was sadness for him. (I never would've thought he would get away with it...) He started doing so good - I was really enjoying his performance! I really think he improved artistically this year..... and then it all fell apart. The first mistake was a lapse of concentration, but I wonder what happened after that. He should've been so confident. He was skating at home with a huge advantage! The quads were awesome. I just don't know what happened and that makes it so frustrating. Now people say he didn't deserve to win. He could've shut up all the naysayers, but then goes and does something like this. Maybe we should analyze why this happened....

  6. #1041
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    Quote Originally Posted by noskates View Post
    Well..........judging what a skater will do in the future based on what they did in the past is like pounding sand in a rat hole. You never fill it up and you just make the rat mad! In other words..............pointless!

    I don't agree with those that say Patrick is not a great skater. He didn't have a good skate last night - absolutely! But you don't win 3 World championships because of poor judging and bad skates! We all have aspects of figure skating that appeal to us more than other aspects.
    He won 2 worlds with 2 VERY bad skates in the LP, that's exactly why it is so revolting. If falls are appealing to you, go watch Kim Kelly in 1990 chuchini cup on youtube, she falls in every tumbling pass, it's beautiful.

  7. #1042
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonardo View Post
    He won 2 worlds with 2 VERY bad skates in the LP, that's exactly why it is so revolting. If falls are appealing to you, go watch Kim Kelly in 1990 chuchini cup on youtube, she falls in every tumbling pass, it's beautiful.
    if Kim Kelly were a figure skater under COP though she would have won 3 or 4 World AA titles, as that is what COP rewards in the sport now for singles skaters.

  8. #1043
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  9. #1044
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    If Denis had not of done the 2F+2T and did a triple combo instead and still came second I would have been annoyed with the result. However I still think the best skater of the competition is Patrick. Due to the great short!

    Remember Chan may have made a lot of mistakes but he racks up a lot of points for those 2 quads. Also his in between skating is a lot better, he may not show to much emotion in his skating but it isn't an acting competition. It should come down to who is better at skating, which is CHAN.

  10. #1045
    ISU, stop promoting 2-foot skating!
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    And there we go again. *yawn*

    Two falls don't mean everything else doesn't count.

    A great competition for Denis but his skating is nowhere near Chan's level and both of his programs were quite bland and generic.

    A bit of crap event with a lot of errors. The most impressive performances came from the guys lower down the rankings. Liebers and Rogozine were both amazing and gave me goosebumps.

    Joubert frustrates me. His technical content is not at the level of the other men and it's just not possible for him to earn a lot of points even if he skates clean (which he didn't).

    Quote Originally Posted by ImaginaryPogue View Post
    Sorry but this is generic ranting without any actual thought in it. It basically says: 'I am angry.'

    The suggestion that ISU should do something just because people are incapable of critical thinking and do not understand neither figure skating, nor the judging system is laughable.

    Yes, let's let the angry mob dictate the results, that would be much better.

  11. #1046
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    Modified COP according to this thread

    TES

    A. Increase fall deduction and -GOE for quads
    B. 4t fall< good 3lz or 3f
    C. Put +GOE for triples back to +1, +2, +3
    D. GOE bullets: meets all for +3, 3/4 for +2, and 1/4-1/2 for +1
    E. Fall GOE is -3 regardless of other factors
    F. No postive GOE for visible errors

    PCS

    G. Cap PCS depending on errors (ie minor errors capped at 8, 1 fall 7.5, ect)
    H. Eliminate the corridor

    General stuff

    I. Get rid of anonymous judging
    J. SP has set TES, elements rotate each year
    K. SP PCS is .8x for all


  12. #1047
    Custom Title ks777's Avatar
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    I have to admit, I really enjoy Max Aaron.

  13. #1048
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    And there we go again. *yawn*

    Two falls don't mean everything else doesn't count.

    A great competition for Denis but his skating is nowhere near Chan's level and both of his programs were quite bland and generic.

    A bit of crap event with a lot of errors. The most impressive performances came from the guys lower down the rankings. Liebers and Rogozine were both amazing and gave me goosebumps.

    Joubert frustrates me. His technical content is not at the level of the other men and it's just not possible for him to earn a lot of points even if he skates clean (which he didn't).



    Sorry but this is generic ranting without any actual thought in it. It basically says: 'I am angry.'

    The suggestion that ISU should do something just because people are incapable of critical thinking and do not understand neither figure skating, nor the judging system is laughable.

    Yes, let's let the angry mob dictate the results, that would be much better.
    So I guess folks like Todd Eldridge, Johnny Weir, and Christina Gao just don't understand good skating? The issue here is many think that multiple glaring errors should effect your results. Feeling this way doesn't mean you don't understand the sport. Its not like Patrick had one fall and was brilliant elsewhere.

  14. #1049
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziggy View Post
    Sorry but this is generic ranting without any actual thought in it. It basically says: 'I am angry.'

    The suggestion that ISU should do something just because people are incapable of critical thinking and do not understand neither figure skating, nor the judging system is laughable.

    Yes, let's let the angry mob dictate the results, that would be much better.
    I'm normally on your side in this debate. I just don't think I am now. I have no problem thumbing my nose at the apostate mob, but I don't think you have to be incapable of critical thinking to find this result spurious at best. It wasn't just the two falls, in my mind.

  15. #1050
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    I love Canada!

    How can you not love the federation who is so good at politiking for their skaters in every dirty way possible. I wouldn't be that sure on D/W fans' place with FD outcome. SC is probably preparing the bed for Voir now to let them rest before each lift. And then there is Osmond..

    Ten should have won. But what is some Kazakhstan on ISU books.
    Watching Hanyu after he finished his FS was the most painful thing that I have ever seen in fs. I thought he would need an oxygen tank to breathe and some assitance to leave the ice. When they showed the overjoyed Orser I almost puked. On the other hand, maybe like a true Canadian patriot he was indeed happy. Afterall thanks to his coaching policy one of PChan's rival was removed from the medal scene.
    Dai- take a rest I would say. But he is already scheduled for a charity show in Kobe, and then WTT, then again ... It's gonna be the last competitive season for him so everyone is trying to get as much cash as possible from this milch cow. It's impossible to deal with this reality in Japan where Dai didn't have any holiday off-season. Perhaps NM was right afterall when he said to R-radio that next season Dai will be spending much time in Novogorsk, i.e. far from all this crap and JSF.


    Schizophrenic event in general.

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