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Thread: Should Gorshkov be fired?

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    Should Gorshkov be fired?

    Sure three spots in dance and pairs but men 1 and ladies 2. They were supposed to have a good ladies program! Should anyone be punished for the catastrophe of this worlds in singles skating?

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    I think whoever made the decision not to send Menshov should get at least a slap on the wrist.

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    not bad worlds. gold in pairs was huge) skaters did ok job for the newcomers..

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    Quote Originally Posted by koatcue View Post
    not bad worlds. gold in pairs was huge) skaters did ok job for the newcomers..


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    Quote Originally Posted by gmyers View Post
    Sure three spots in dance and pairs but men 1 and ladies 2. They were supposed to have a good ladies program! Should anyone be punished for the catastrophe of this worlds in singles skating?
    This is so Soviet Union .

    Send the entire kit and kaboodle, administrators, coaches, skaters, trainers, masseuses, cooks and boot-polishers (the boot-lickers can stay) to count trees in Siberia; that way there's zero chance of missing the offending miscreant.

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    Top Russian girls are only 16. They are not ready to challenge skaters like Kim, Kostner and Mao who are much older and experienced. Normally after an Olympics the top veteran skaters and medalists retire and the new girls take over. Not this cycle. The gold and silver medalists from Vancouver are still skating and will be in Sochi and veterans like Kostner and Suzuki also didn't retire. Plus Tuk and Adelina didn't have enough time before the Olympics to really establish themselves. One Worlds appearance before the Olympics is just not enough time. Mao and Kim had almost 4 years to build there reputation before the 2010 Olympics.

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    They dont have any good mens skaters, and their ladies still have a long way to go. Their showing wasnt really a surprise. OK it might have been thought Sotnikova and Tuktamysheva could do somewhat better and get the Russians 3 spots for Sochi, but that wasnt even a sure thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    Top Russian girls are only 16. They are not ready to challenge skaters like Kim, Kostner and Mao who are much older and experienced. Normally after an Olympics the top veteran skaters and medalists retire and the new girls take over. Not this cycle. The gold and silver medalists from Vancouver are still skating and will be in Sochi and veterans like Kostner and Suzuki also didn't retire. Plus Tuk and Adelina didn't have enough time before the Olympics to really establish themselves. One Worlds appearance before the Olympics is just not enough time. Mao and Kim had almost 4 years to build there reputation before the 2010 Olympics.
    Out of curiosity, what do you think Tuktamysheva, Sotnikova and the Russian Federation think of their performances? Yes, they are only 16, but the bottom five girls in the top 10 were all first-timers at Worlds, and the Russians finished behind Gold, who was solid, but not exactly stellar; Li, who was stellar in the free skate but not the short program; and Osmond, who was stellar in the short program, but not the free skate. I have a hard time believing that finishing fourth and fifth out of that group is going to be considered a good thing, considering their performances the past couple years.

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    Many skaters going through puberty deal with problems such as growing taller and developing hips. But Tuktamysheva's problem is NOT growing taller and developing hips. She is growing out rather than up---even her face has become round and she has a hint of a double chin. And it is affecting her jumps and ice coverage. She would do well to add lots of off-ice training to her regimen.

    The one thing she should not do is wear those horrible black costumes with heavy black tights that not only do NOT make her appear slimmer, but make her look short, squat and almost matronly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Many skaters going through puberty deal with problems such as growing taller and developing hips. But Tuktamysheva's problem is NOT growing taller and developing hips. She is growing out rather than up---even her face has become round and she has a hint of a double chin. And it is affecting her jumps and ice coverage. She would do well to add lots of off-ice training to her regimen.

    The one thing she should not do is wear those horrible black costumes with heavy black tights that not only do NOT make her appear slimmer, but make her look short, squat and almost matronly.
    This. Tuk problem is not height but it is weight
    the black costumes are indeed used to make her appear slimmer but its really terrible to look at

    Mishin has mentioned several times she is gaining weight
    It will do best Liza to eat only 1 meal a day or less intake or carbs, forumers mention she really loves ice cream
    imo, Mishin should monitor everything Liza eats and bar her eating any sweets that is causing her alarming weight gain

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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Many skaters going through puberty deal with problems such as growing taller and developing hips. But Tuktamysheva's problem is NOT growing taller and developing hips. She is growing out rather than up---even her face has become round and she has a hint of a double chin. And it is affecting her jumps and ice coverage. She would do well to add lots of off-ice training to her regimen.

    The one thing she should not do is wear those horrible black costumes with heavy black tights that not only do NOT make her appear slimmer, but make her look short, squat and almost matronly.
    At worlds she missed only 2A in SP and her base value in LP the same as Kim, she needs to get psc she deserves, ans be judge properly on her jumps
    Elizaveta pretty young lady and doen't need to loose any weight, her teens puffness on a face will go away soon. It is normal. She has difficult programs, charisma and phenomenal P/I skills, her ice coverege is relevant to her hight and huge on her jumps.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robeye View Post
    This is so Soviet Union .

    Send the entire kit and kaboodle, administrators, coaches, skaters, trainers, masseuses, cooks and boot-polishers (the boot-lickers can stay) to count trees in Siberia; that way there's zero chance of missing the offending miscreant.


    Pairs and Ice Dance did ok, although ladies a bit disappointing but there wasn't any real chance when Kim Yuna announced her comeback
    It was a bit shortsighted , they are 2018 skaters NOT 2014.

    Gorshkov is very well respected
    might as well fire Tarasova then etc for having too much influence and sending Kovtun

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robeye View Post
    This is so Soviet Union .

    Send the entire kit and kaboodle, administrators, coaches, skaters, trainers, masseuses, cooks and boot-polishers (the boot-lickers can stay) to count trees in Siberia; that way there's zero chance of missing the offending miscreant.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by gmyers View Post
    Sure three spots in dance and pairs but men 1 and ladies 2. They were supposed to have a good ladies program! Should anyone be punished for the catastrophe of this worlds in singles skating?
    No. It wasn't a catastrophe at all. OK, maybe sending Kovtun was a bone-headed decision, but this is Sotnikova's and Tuktamysheva's first Worlds. Finishing in the top 10 is actually a GOOD result for first-timers. Plus, it's worth noting that this year's Worlds was one of the deepest fields in awhile for the ladies. Sotnikova's and Tuktamysheva's point totals this year would have gotten Russia three spots last year (5th + 7th).

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    I actually thought the outcome was okay - pairs gold is huge, I was very surprised and happy to see B/S take bronze in dance, I/K were a bit disappointing but by no means disaster, they are still a young team and they still finished in the top 10 with a respectable score. Same goes for Liza and Adelina - Liza's SP was a bit of a letdown but she came back very strong in the FS, Adelina held it together in BOTH programs which is huge for her, their results are maybe not the absolute best they could have done but still very good and respectable considering the depth of this field and that both girls are just 16. As for Kovtun, yeah that was a bit of a letdown, but 2 spots for men was a crapshoot anyways without Plushenko, I still thought Kovtun skated pretty well in the FS, and 17th as a 17 year old in this deep a field really isn't a bad result, especially given the mistakes he had. Also, Leonova's meltdown is just an argument as for why switching up the men's team may not have been wise after all or made a difference. The fed swapped Gosviani for Leonova and Leonova tanked, Gosviani may not have scored or placed better, but Leonova completely underperformed and was lucky to get the scores she did so it doesn't even matter. Then for the men, the fed didn't swap Kovtun for Menshov and Kovtun didn't make top 10 - so there you have it, the switched one of the teams and it didn't work out, didn't switch the other and it didn't work out. There's no way to know if Menshov would have done better, my guess is he probably would have but not good enough to make the top 10, so in that sense, I think giving Kovtun the experience is worth it because he is so young and has a lot of promise for the future whereas Menshov is almost 30 and on his way out, surely after next season he will retire.

    It's sad we only get to see 2 Russian girls in Sochi next season but in a way maybe it's good because it will push the girls to do better, Liza to not mess up the SP and choose programs that show her off better, Adelina to work on getting full rotation credit for her jumps and not making headcase mistakes. Julia still has a chance too but she's soo young still and has plenty to work on so it's not a travesty if we don't get to see her until 2018. And then apart from those 3, everyone else has really been disappointing recently anyways - Leonova, Korobeynikova, Makarova, Shelepen, Biryukova, etc. or is otherwise very young, like Radionova who is not even old enough for Sochi, or Pogorilaya who is just the same age as Julia but with minimal experience so again 2018 will probably be a better time for her anyways, even Gosviani is only 16 so if she can improve her technical side, 2018 isn't out of the question either. Russian ladies are in a transitional age and I think Liza and Adelina have done VERY well this season given all the pressure on them and the obvious difficulties of dealing with the physical and mental changes of adolescence.

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