Figure skating is dying, and judges can't prop it up | Page 2 | Golden Skate

Figure skating is dying, and judges can't prop it up

Kissx3

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 23, 2009
Right yeah, that too. Falls, especially, need to be re-evaluated in how they are scored if the aim is to move back towards commercial appeal. You need the audience at large to feel like they know what's going on, it's that simple. I get the theory that we'd get watered-down content with harsher penalties for visible errors but I don't agree with it. The cream will still rise to the top and we won't have to explain and get all the apologist rambling/mathematician seminar going on about why that chick with 2 falls who stumbled out of every other jump won.

Judging should also never have been made anonymous in the first place. There is no possible excuse on this earth for that one. Judges afraid for their lives I'm guessing would be the primary defence and that just deserves an eyeroll to the moon and back for so many reasons.

Japan is definitely where all the money is these days. The degree of cultural penetration they still have there is amazing and any skater with a mind to make this a career should be working there as often as possible but the decline elsewhere is still an issue. There needs to be more experimentation on some level to correct it, stagnation isn't acceptable at this point.
 

TontoK

Hot Tonto
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Country
United-States
Yes you prove my point, that's because Yuna left competition. They had nobody else to win anything. If you took a competition to Korea last year vs. Yuna ice show, which do you think Koreans would rather attend? Foreigners they don't know and don't really care about? Or someone they do know? It's the same in the U.S. Most Americans don't care about sports where Americans aren't dominant. Soccer(futbol) and F1 racing are not popular at all in the U.S. despite having very large international interest.

Nonsense. American women are now a dominant force in gymnastics, but the rise in popularity had nothing to do with any American. 1972: Olga Korbut in Munich. 1976: Nadia Comeneci in Montreal. They inspired a generation of young girls from the big city and the farmland to tumble their way across America. Before them, gymnastics wasn't even popular enough to be a boutique sport.

They were foreigners. Even worse... COMMUNISTS! And at the height of the Cold War, at that.

Somebody at USA Gymnastics had the vision and gumption to capitalize on those moments and shift the athletic landscape in America. It's not the American sporting spirit that is lacking, but the leadership necessary to revive the sport.
 

skateluvr

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 23, 2011
Burying your head in sand is going nowhere. I sensed that even South Korea is less crazy about FS these days than just two 2 years ago.

Absolutely...where are all the yuna ubers...seems like hundreds were everywhere 3 years ago. Yuna herself didn't seem all that thrilled. Yes it is ethnocentric...that is the point. CANADA! LAND OF WINTER SPORTS ESP HOCKEY/FS! They have Chan, Osmond, Virtue Moir GOOD PAIR TEAMS! dumb cap key. Anyway, 7,000 is very small. Ten years ago CSOI I'm sure could sell that easily.

The scoring may be producing some interesting skaters but clearly it's an issue for 6.0 fans of many years. Not televising it is crazy here in US. I looked but found nom NBC coverage, but I'm away so, maybe I missed it? I found nothing on NBC website. Anyone know if next weekend there will be some coverage? At least gold medal ice dancers? It is dreadful...can't grow new fans without TV coverage.
 

Icey

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 28, 2012
Why would it be up to the judges to prop it up? And if it were, how would they do that?
 

louisa05

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 3, 2011
Why would it be up to the judges to prop it up? And if it were, how would they do that?

I think the headline, which the thread title came from, was intended as a bit of a pun as the judges are perceived to have "propped up" skaters at Worlds.
 
Joined
Jun 21, 2003
^ I think the title of the article is supposed to be sardonic. Like, "The judges can prop up their pet skaters and give them victories that they don't deserve, but they can't prop up the sport as it tumbles off into the abyss." (Something like that.)

Edited to add: What louisa05 said. :)
 
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jenaj

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Country
United-States
Just because the arena isn't filled to capacity doesn't mean people aren't watching, I watched most of it on live feed, so much more convenient. BTW a friend of mine took pictures of the event on Friday and the place looked pretty darn full.

I never bother with the gala, slightly more exciting than your average club carnival. Most skaters don't have a lot of time or energy to put into their show choreography and it shows. Not sure what kind of ratings it gets, suspect that the audience is not hard core skating fans but rather the general public looking for some nice family friendly entertainment.

People watching on the internet for free will not help the sport survive. Unless arenas can be filled and TV broadcast rights sold, the sport will end up being only for the competitors and their friends and families, like curling or dressage.
 

millie

Medalist
Joined
Nov 1, 2004
There is a certain amount of "was robbed" "was held up"and those lyin' judges is simlpy a figure skating instution...If you think it's bad now, go back to the 6.0 system....With the 4th skater on the ice and 3 more to go and that 4th skater gets all 6.0's, what should the rest now...that was the 6.0 system. The judges could do what they wanted and no explanation..if they had a favourite she won, always. Sometimes I think the more the crowd cheered, the higher the more 6.0's she got. With the CoP, the judges had to explain where the marks came from and the fans with any knowledge of the sport, could almost figure out the score. No matter what system they use, in some people eyes, there will still be lyin' judges.
 

Jammers

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
Country
United-States
Think about it someone like Gracie Gold would have had no way to make it to Worlds this year if 6.0 was in place. If you were not in the top 3 you couldn't win unless strange things like the 2002 Olympics happened. 9th place no way. But she skated a technically dominate program and moved up while others faltered.
 

Eislauf

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 26, 2012
Absolutely...where are all the yuna ubers...seems like hundreds were everywhere 3 years ago. Yuna herself didn't seem all that thrilled. Yes it is ethnocentric...that is the point. CANADA! LAND OF WINTER SPORTS ESP HOCKEY/FS! They have Chan, Osmond, Virtue Moir GOOD PAIR TEAMS! dumb cap key. Anyway, 7,000 is very small. Ten years ago CSOI I'm sure could sell that easily.

The scoring may be producing some interesting skaters but clearly it's an issue for 6.0 fans of many years. Not televising it is crazy here in US. I looked but found nom NBC coverage, but I'm away so, maybe I missed it? I found nothing on NBC website. Anyone know if next weekend there will be some coverage? At least gold medal ice dancers? It is dreadful...can't grow new fans without TV coverage.

Right. Too bad USFSA went down to the crossroads and sold its soul to the devil (Universal). Short term greed for a long-term decline in the sport. It's not the only reason the sport is dying here in the US, but it's a significant one.

I mean, are there NO successful business and marketing professionals working for USFSA?! Broadcast the major competitions for free!! Promote the heck out of the skaters - get them out on the talk show circuits! In fashion magazines! Gracie Gold is made for US media with her youth, All-American beauty, athleticism and soaring success!!!
 

suzukifan27

Match Penalty
Joined
Nov 24, 2012
Absolutely...where are all the yuna ubers...seems like hundreds were everywhere 3 years ago. Yuna herself didn't seem all that thrilled. .

You're absolutely right. Yuna ubers used to be atrocious on various forums. They're now gone. I don't even think South Korean media hyped this event that much. It is dying in South Korea as well. Japan might be the next. China? Never popular there.
 

szidon

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
You're absolutely right. Yuna ubers used to be atrocious on various forums. They're now gone. I don't even think South Korean media hyped this event that much. It is dying in South Korea as well. Japan might be the next. China? Never popular there.

You're living in your own imaginary world.
 

Moment

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 18, 2013
You're absolutely right. Yuna ubers used to be atrocious on various forums. They're now gone. I don't even think South Korean media hyped this event that much. It is dying in South Korea as well. Japan might be the next. China? Never popular there.

That must be why Ladies free skate scored ratings of close to 20% in SK in Sunday morning, and Yuna is still a mega-popular celebrity there who's earning tens of millions of dollars every year with her endorsements.
 

Eislauf

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 26, 2012
There is definitely something wrong with the branding....I'm guessing the ISU has no marketing team or what they do have lacks any sense of ingenuity.

Ottavio Cinquanta is a trained accountant - so it's not hard to see why he developed and pushed through something like COP. I wonder if he solicited any input from any sales, marketing or PR people. Doubtful. During Salt Lake in 2002, the real problem was revealed to be the Federations working behind the scenes trading votes for their respective skaters, something which probably still happens today. It wasn't the 6.0 judging system that was at fault - it was (and is) the corruption of ISU member federations.
 

jenaj

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Country
United-States
That must be why Ladies free skate scored ratings of close to 20% in SK in Sunday morning, and Yuna is still a mega-popular celebrity there who's earning tens of millions of dollars every year with her endorsements.

No offense to SK, but all this means is that Yu Na is a big fish in a small pond. It has no meaning for the future of figure skating.
 

pharmtech1

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 20, 2012
Just because the arena isn't filled to capacity doesn't mean people aren't watching, I watched most of it on live feed, so much more convenient. BTW a friend of mine took pictures of the event on Friday and the place looked pretty darn full.

I never bother with the gala, slightly more exciting than your average club carnival. Most skaters don't have a lot of time or energy to put into their show choreography and it shows. Not sure what kind of ratings it gets, suspect that the audience is not hard core skating fans but rather the general public looking for some nice family friendly entertainment.
I was there and the place was full most of the time ! I don't understand why people pass on information that is wrong !!!
 

trains

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 2, 2004
A few points:
Interesting that Cinquanta didn't come. There must be a story behind that.
As for the rink being not quite full: you have to remember that an all-event ticket was nearly $1500.00. For a family of four that's $6.000.00 + hotel, food, travel, etc. I think a near capacity crowd at that price shows pretty good interest IMHO.
The Canadian television coverage was first rate. All events, every skater plus the warm ups, as well as feature stories.
Skating always benefits when there is an American star. I think that Gracie Gold has that potential down the road.
The Canadian fans love Yuna, but didn't come to the competition specifically to see her.
 

skateluvr

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 23, 2011
Gracie and Osmond make a ready for prime time rivarly. They are so wonderful. Now NBC needs to exploit them with Cop knowledgeable commentators, or bring back Button. And if the feirce 5 are everywhere, then get their marketers on board. USFSA has blown it. And MK is now able to skate again. She should do what USFSA did for her-----promote the sport Ms Favorite Kwan. She has time and money. She benefitted from the whack more than any skater in the world. You'd think the huge stars would care.
 
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