03-26-2013, 07:45 PM
There's something so inspiring about Plushy's endurance that I really hope he wins Russian Nationals and makes it to Sochi with a great "credit rating." My gold-medal dream is Daisuke, but I want to see Plushy wow the crowd, and all of us millions of (tape-delay) viewers across the globe. The guy's already gone down in history, but a little more history would be pretty awesome, yes?
03-26-2013, 10:39 PM
I think he would be making some history just by showing up. Most male skaters are lucky to get to 2 Olympics, but 4 would be amazing. I don't think he'll get a medal, but who knows with him. I would love for him to get a better choreographed program because he'll need to face off against guys who now match his technical content.
03-26-2013, 11:48 PM
Stuck in the Kwan/Cohen years
Plushenko is right, it is ridiculous that Chan won and everyone knows it. Watch out for SP over scoring, this is the result. It is a pretty neat trick the judges have come up with. It is also one of the reasons skating is losing it's audience. Too many deserving skaters have gotten the shaft, people get frustrated with it and stop watching. This whole judging/scoring system needs an overhaul.
03-27-2013, 02:02 AM
Can we as even semi rational people look at this situation like Kostner and many of her medals and Squared and even Mao, Lambiel and Buttle. Can all these trained judges under COP be wrong? Were they all bribed? Can you know see the parameters onthes coring how while you missed some things you picked it up in other areas. So the theory is all thejudges are biased "idiots"? Come on folks - where is the evidence. Denis ten skate his best but over all it wasn't enogh and the quality of his skating is ho hum. Maybe we are saying no gold should have been given? But then we can say that for many medals probably.
03-27-2013, 05:57 AM
Chan's score is inflated (in many people's opinion) does not mean other skaters marks (Kostner, Mao, V/T for some competitions) are not inflated. Nobody argue that. Why Chan is spot on star for the argument: 1. this post is all about Plushenko's opinion on Chan's winning; 2. Chan won the GM; 3. his LP performance is just a disaster. Chan's performance probably deserves THIS GM in IJS book. But this win is just plain ugly. The LP is just too messy to let anybody proudly point out "that is the winner". So it leads to the argument whether the system is terribly flawed and need to be modified to avoid this from happening again.
Originally Posted by Skater Boy
As for the over score part, personally I really doubt with this particular performance Chan should get the PE and IN marks that high. So many mistakes and PE 8.6, really? And as messy as that the IN is 8.96, really?
TO CanadianSkaterGuy, why do you think Plushenko will take it as granted if he only finished 4th or 5th at RN and head to Olympics? If Plushenko is healthy enough, he will not allow himself making so many mistakes in a program so that he will end it up in lower placement. Then the question will be do you really think a clean Plushenko will not beat other RUSSIAN skaters in RN? Highly doubted. But I think all the speculations are meaningless since even Plushenko himself does not know whether his back can handle all these loads.
03-27-2013, 05:10 PM
If you look at history, Plushenko attended all three Olympics as the rightful Russian National Champion. Even in 2002 when he had injury, he still competed to earn his spot. He only skipped RN in 2003 because a serious flu, but he earned his World spot as the Euro Champion. Plushenko has never been gifted a ticket to Olympic or Worlds in his whole career, unlike his other compatriots in the past.
Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy
And if other skaters have been gifted with a spot before, why cannot Plushenko, who is apparently at a different level? Why he should be held at a much higher standard compared with the rest of the Russian athletes?
03-27-2013, 05:18 PM
I can't imagine plushenko 4th or 5th at a Russian nationals! That would be a plushenko with no quad or 3a attempts! But then maybe that would be enough? Surely Enough to place top 3 to go to euros and then maybe quad and 3a then place first there among Russian men. Like he could fall on every 3a and quad attempt and still probably win a Russian nationals. He couldn't do singles and win- no way- it's not so bad that plushenko could do singles or doubles.
There is no reason for plushenko to get a gift because his competition is such that he could win against he best of his home country in any conceivable condition.
03-27-2013, 06:08 PM
I think you would find that if Plushenko finished fourth or fifth at Russian Nats, he would not want to go to Sochi because it would be a sign for him that if he can't even win Russian Nats, what hope is there higher?
Anyway, Russian Nats is just one piece of the puzzle. What happens at Euros is just as important.
03-27-2013, 07:58 PM
OK, so the Canadian federation bought or bribed or threated the judges. . . or whatever it is they do. . . and that's why Chan won, right? So why didn't Virtue & Moir win the ice dance competition? Does Skate Canada only get one bribe per competition? As I recall, Plushenko complained that Lysacek shouldn't have won the 2010 Olympics without a quad, and the ISU responded by raising the value of quad jumps and reducing penalties for underrotated quads, just to encourage everyone to go for quads. So maybe now they will change the rules based on Plushy's response again. Now *THAT* is power!
03-27-2013, 10:41 PM
Do they need evidence?! Plushenko - the expert - said so.
Originally Posted by Skater Boy
Originally Posted by vlaurend
When Plushenko said he and Brian Joubert didn't have transitions, Mr. Inman has suddenly realized it. And rushed to send out group e-mails to the judges and urged them to be cautious on TR judging.
When Plushenko said sport means stronger, faster, higher, ISU agreed and raised up the quad value.
This time, when Plushenko said Canadian federation must be the evil behind the Patrick Chan's win, ISU would punish Canadian federation according to the words of Plushenko...
03-28-2013, 07:38 AM
Oh dear goodness. Just because Plushy says something doesn't mean it is truth, God or anything else. I take back us being semi rational - non rational lol.
Originally Posted by Bluebonnet
03-28-2013, 07:39 AM
Plushy still is probably Russia's best hope in Sochi - sadly. They just don't have the consistency of one man yet to take over the mantle. Vornov and GAtchinkski just haven't really fully developed or been cnosistent and Kovutun is too young still.
03-28-2013, 09:26 AM
I take that Plushenko is speaking from personal experience - you know, how many times the Russian Fed made sure he won through bribing and back door politics, especially prior to SLC. Otherwise, how does he know so much? Is he telepathic? In other words, what he is really saying is lamentation about Russian Fed's 2nd tier status federation as being unable to broker anything of significance for its skaters since their disastrous Olympics in 2010 with only one bronze medal.
How many years has it been since Russia is unable to place a man in the top 10 at Worlds? The sad truth is Plushenko himself is not man enough to attend the London Worlds as a dutiful Russian National Champion should to give Russia a chance to win 3 spots in Sochi and give the youngsters a chance to be inspired and grow. And by his action of immediately giving up after a less-than-optimal SP at the Euros, then use a pre-existing condition totally unrelated to the fall as the excuse, you have to wonder - can he really compete internationally?
After all, if he is still competing, then bad mouthing a fellow competitor is considered very poor sportsmanship. Unfortunately, Plushenko has a history of trash talking other competitors, including calling Lysacek's win in Vancouver : Ladies Skating because he had no Quads, give himself a "Platinum medal" and post the picture online for the whole world to see and now, this. This isn't just a light-hearted joke about someone's age - Plushenko is actually serious when he said and did all of that. He may have accomplished a lot as an athlete but as far as his character and sportsmanship is concerned, it's almost impossible to find a more mean spirited and arrogant person than this guy. He is better off going back to Russian politics and being a full-time politician, that's much more suitable to him.
03-28-2013, 09:32 AM
FYI, the ISU training video using Plushenko as the "model" existed since at least 2008. Unlike another poster who falsely stated that the ISU only started to circulating the video after Plushenko made his return in 2009-10 season as part of a conspiracy to undermine him. At the Vancouver Olympics, Plushenko did not do a 3 jump combo as he could have. And had he add a mere double toe at the end of any of his jump combo, he would have won the Gold - it is that simple.
03-28-2013, 10:18 AM
It think there is a lot of heat and not much light in this thread. I have to admit that boith Chan and Plushenko are quite a ways down my personal list of scoundrels and reprobates deserving of my scorn.
For instance, they are both below Wolfgang Schwartz.
After that, he was arrested and convicted of falling on a triple Lutz but winning anyway, and of badmouthing his opponent.
Originally Posted by Wikipedia