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Thread: Can Evgeni Plushenko win the 2014 Olympic title?

  1. #556
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    Yagudin 2 quads 1 3a original plan 2 quads 2 3a

  2. #557
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    I don't see what 2002 has to do with Plushenko's 2014 chances. Every judge put him 2nd in the LP in SLC. Case closed.

  3. #558
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    Quote Originally Posted by drivingmissdaisy View Post
    I don't see what 2002 has to do with Plushenko's 2014 chances. Every judge put him 2nd in the LP in SLC. Case closed.
    Well every plushenko thread becomes about yagudin and 2002! Lol!!

  4. #559
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    Quote Originally Posted by gmyers View Post
    Well every plushenko thread becomes about yagudin and 2002! Lol!!
    Yes, because the members did not want to admit Plushy's greatness ... they say "yes, yes, he is good, but Yagudin is better." But if anyone knows every programs of Plush, SP's, LP's, exhibitions, it is clear that Plush is better in all aspects of skating. Only his popularity is smaller here, but if you know this information, you will have idea about reality..
    https://twitter.com/EvgeniPlushenko 108 399 followers
    https://twitter.com/PlushenkoNews -6340
    https://twitter.com/yagudinofficial - 5004 followers
    https://twitter.com/AlexeiNews -145 followers

  5. #560
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    ^ Yagudin was very popular, too, in 1998-2002. There were no Facebook (started in 2004) and no Twitter (started in 2006) back then, but on the skating boards Yagudin fans would tease Michelle Kwan fans because the Yagudin fan sites had the most members.

    THose were the good old days. If you were a Kwan fan you could troll TaraWorld and SashaFans and post how great Michelle was, until you got banned.

  6. #561
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    True! Very exciting times! Yagudin was indeed a very popular skater and I think he still is, but now Plushy grabs the attention because he's still competing.

  7. #562
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    Who's the queen? Yuna Kim has 661,441 followers on Twitter.

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    Only 661,441? I thought she had more! Anyway, Yuna rulzzz!

  9. #564
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    I think it has a lot to do with what country you skate for; there are some diehards out there for popularity.

  10. #565
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    Quote Originally Posted by gmyers View Post
    Yeah maybe like a Point more for putting those together! Or maybe like a halfway point style multiple.
    So you want skaters, such as Patrick Chan, who has steady quad combo win more convincingly than before?

    Quote Originally Posted by plushyfan View Post
    But if anyone knows every programs of Plush, SP's, LP's, exhibitions, it is clear that Plush is better in all aspects of skating.
    You cannot really compare a skater whose career has unfortunately been cut short with a skater who has a longlasting career. I've seen almost all Plushenko's programs. Yagudin was definitely better in artistic abilities, in posture, and in emotion. Plushenko is better in jumps compare with Yagudin. One thing I do know is that they both are like ironman. I adore both of them, and so do many other skating fans!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    ^ IMHO it is still up to the skaters. I don't think Pushenko will get extra points just for showing up and being Plushenko. He will have to skate for it.

    Same with Chan, If he skates his best, he will get high PCS no matter what country is in. But I think the judges will not be generous with PCS if he falls and flubs. I do not expect that the ISU and the judges will let anyone back into the gold medal. They are certainly hoping that at least someone brings his A game so they don't have to just give the OGM away.
    This is going to be a big ask considering the guys are now attempting more difficult programs as a whole... 2 quads and 2 axels is much harder to execute when you've got complex spins, harder choreo/transitions, and footwork to think about. I'm hoping the OGM winner is clean or near clean (whoever he is), but I'm anticipating errors given the pressure of the event and inconsistencies in the field as a whole. In the past season, nobody has been truly consistent... not that it would matter because next season some skaters might be more or less consistent than this past season. I think certain skaters though have planted the idea of being of being a gold medal favourite though in this past season, like Hanyu and Fernandez, and others have positioned themselves as potential medal threats like Ten, Reynolds, and a returning Plushenko.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    It doesn't have to go through Guinness... it is the highest score ever recorded for a man. And what was your excuse for when he got the record in 2011 Worlds, which wasn't on Canadian ice? And the records for total score and highest FS score aren't on Canadian ice - he got them in Russia ... so what's your excuse for that? He doesn't need Guinness to recognize that they're World records, everyone already does that anyways since they know basic math and what numbers are higher than other numbers.
    Hahaha! A demagogue's cowardness at its lousy end. First, he brought himself the WGR with pride as some worthy trophy. Then, when it turned out that the current WGR is a curruped institution owned by a Canadian company that gives its awards based entirely on nationalistic bias, i.e only to the Canadain Chan but never gave it Plu, Dai or Hanyu when they hit the record, CSG hypocritically dismissed his own argument of WGR . It's unbelievable how somebody can be so silly. The best part is that he needs excuses for Chan's win in 2011 too, the only of his WC titles that wasn't questioned by the community. Poor Patrick. His fans make him look like an idiot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vlaurend View Post
    OK, new question, sort of. . . It is assumed that judges are encouraged to be friendly to the Olympic host country's skaters, which would give Plushenko a political advantagee. We can also assume that the judges are all aware of the criticism they have received this season for Chan's high PCS. So how many points can we expect as an "adjustment" to the PCS scores between Chan (- ?) and Plushenko (+?), regardless of how well they skate?
    None. The scoring system does not have major changes this coming season comparing it with the last season. I believe the judges have heard the criticism about Patrick Chan, but they have believed that they had scored him correctly. So don't count on it. ...One thing you can do. That is to be prepared to make even bigger fuzz after Sochi Olympics.

    As of Plushenko, I believe the judges will be kind to him for the respect they pay to the host country like always, like in Vancouver. But he will be marked down if he cannot deliver as expected. What they marked down on Plushenko will be well stand without controversy. What they didn't mark down, which either you or anyone believe they should have marked down, will be so vague that anyone could defend them.

  14. #569
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    Yup, I'm sure the judges believed they scored him correctly at Worlds because of how they placed him in the FS, because they credited Ten's great performance with a huge SP score and a huge freeskate score (ranked comfortably higher than Chan's) that was 21 points higher than his previous PB. Not to mention, Ten doubled two triples, and Chan had a lead in the SP. To the crowd and fans it matters that Ten won (and he should have), because visibly he was much better than Chan in the LP, but points-wise it wasn't going to amount to Ten winning. I think the judges are also fine with it because it was Denis Ten, who had never had decent results until that point -- and if a known top competitor like Hanyu/Fernandez/Takahashi had skated as well as Ten but still lost to Chan, the judges would have a lot more to answer for (it isn't right, but it tends to be the way things are with consistently inferior skaters who suddenly skate exceptionally well).

    I doubt Chan will get lower PCS because of Worlds (and one assumes he and the other guys won't skate as poorly as at Worlds in Soch); I predict his PCS will probably be low-40's SP/low 90's FS for decent skates and 44-45 & 93-94 for clean skates). If Plushenko does a quad in his SP I can picture him scoring about about 43-44 points for PCS (so a few points higher than Euros 2012 where he had no quad in an otherwise clean SP), and getting about 91-92 points for PCS if he has a clean FS with two quads. I don't think the judges will give Plushenko 45+ PCS in the SP and 94+ PCS in the FS just because he's on home ice.

    What will hold back Plushenko from getting maxed out PCS should he go clean is the fact that, unlike Euros 2012 (where his main competitors were Gachinski and Brezina and an inconsistent Fernandez), in Sochi Plushenko would be competing against skaters who have better programs and consistently better PCS than him (including a much improved Fernandez compared to 2012), so the judges will accordingly not max out his PCS even if he goes clean and others have yet to skate, because there's the potential for others to skate better (to use 6.0 rhetoric, they give him 5.9 for presentation because a clean Takahashi/Chan could top that... or they give 5.9 for technical elements because a clean Fernandez/Reynolds should get 6.0 technically).

    It's not like when Yagudin was his only real competition -- there are about 4 or 5 skaters who have the potential to be technically superior and/or have higher PCS that could push Plushenko off the podium should they skate well. Thus, him actually winning gold is even less of a chance unless all of those other guys bomb (which actually happened in Van 2010 -- a cleaner Takahashi could have pushed him to 3rd, and a clean Lambiel/Chan would have pushed him off the podium). One thing he does have over the other guys though is his consistency, so he could possibly go cleaner, but these days a cleaner program isn't necessarily a win if your competitors have higher scoring potential and thus more buffer room for errors than you do.

  15. #570
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciocio View Post
    True! Very exciting times! Yagudin was indeed a very popular skater and I think he still is, but now Plushy grabs the attention because he's still competing.
    Yagudin was very popular, but Plushy was also very popular in 2002. Maybe you know the North-American poularity, only. And of course, Yagudin is very popular now, but Plushy is more popular, your explanation is false. Plushy is competing, yes, one year two competitions

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