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Thread: World Team Trophy 2013 Men

  1. #301
    - * - blue_idealist's Avatar
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    I just looked at the official results and realized Chan was 5th in the free skate! Wow! When was the last time that happened?!

  2. #302
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    Iam happy Dai ends the season with a fairly strong performance and a win. Patrick would never have won with his FS in 5th place as with not doing the 4 toe, 3 axel and falling on the last spin no matter how good his PCS is, it was too much to overcome and result would have been the same if it were in Canada. I wish some people supported the skaters as much as the Japanese audience did at WTT. They cheered Patrick on and supported him after mistakes even when Dai was the favourite. Wonderful fans in Japan. Iam hoping Patrick realizes he has to make changes next season.

  3. #303
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    Japan Open 2012 Patrick finished 6th place and Daisuke won that.

  4. #304
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    Quote Originally Posted by figuristka View Post
    Japan Open 2012 Patrick finished 6th place and Daisuke won that.
    Oh yeah, forgot about that one.

  5. #305
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Overall, Chan is certainly one of the best skaters in the World. I think he felt entitled to win over Ten, which was arrogant of him, but I don't think he can argue beating the other guys when they don't step up, and that's a matter of those guys not displaying their potential at their best. It really depends on the day too -- I mean look at Chan's Worlds SP and then his WTT SP; look at Fernandez's Euros SP and then his World SP; look at Hanyu's great SPs in the season and SP at Worlds. The field is vastly inconsistent, which shades of potential being met and other days where they bomb.
    Maybe the skaters have tried to skate well this season, but are still saving their all for the Olympics? Fernandez was really good at the Europeans, but still not totally perfect. I hope that next season he will not put his all heart for defending that title, but will save his very best performances for the Olympics. I remember that Ilia Kulik had to withdraw from the Europeans because of an injury, and concentrated for the Olympics where he was really strong and in best condition. And of course peaking at the right time is really important.

  6. #306
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Sale and Pelletier were potentially cheated of a gold medal, because the French judge admitted to cheating and deliberately placing the Russians ahead in a 5-4 decision. Whether a different judge would have still given B/S the win or S/P the win is something we will never know. But saying B/S won the short as some arbitrary tiebreaker is BS, because as we know under 6.0 anyone in the top 3 after the SP, if the won the FS, would win overall... and with a non-cheating judge, that could have been S/P. Your tiebreaker is as arbitrary and biased as if I said "the tiebreaker should be to add up all the technical and artistic scores of the remaining judges in the FS and whichever team has a higher total should win" ... "oh and it happens to be S/P, look at that... no, it doesn't work like that. What happened was obviously to save face, but the reality is 4 (supposedly) non-cheating judges chose S/P and 4 (supposedly) non-cheating judges chose B/S.
    ITA. Machin et al's version of what actually occurred at the 2002 Olympic games has morphed into an alternate history. Crucial details have somehow blurred and been omitted. The "crying" he speaks of was crying foul, when it was discovered that Didier Gailaguet, head of the French Skating Federation had allegedly pressured M. De Gougne (the French judge) to give B/S higher marks in exchange for the Russian judge awarding A/P a higher score in the dance. The ISU consequently suspended both De Gougne & Gailaguet for 3 years. And of course there’s the Russian mobster connection to this whole sordid story. He was charged with fixing 2 figure skating events at the 2002 Olympics but unfortunately Italian authorities did not succeed in having him extradited to the U.S for a trial.

    I stopped going on GS Forum months ago but today I’m avoiding studying for an upcoming exam, so I decided to distract myself & see if things had (miraculously) changed; if the site moderators had actually weeded out some of the haters, whiners, bashers & ranters. Fat chance! Just a mild "please guys don't bicker". There are all the usual suspects - some already banned from all the other forums - still whinging about scores & spewing their vitriolic mumbo jumbo about certain nations & skaters. So boring.

    As for Patrick Chan, he receives high scores, even with mistakes because his skating is sublime & at such an exceptional level. He’s been sliding on his butt as often as any of the top skaters this season, especially the Japanese & Russians. IMO the World Team event is a joke: it serves no purpose, the skaters are exhausted after a grueling season but are pressured to skate yet again – in a team. The Worlds should be the end of the season.

  7. #307
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    MEN'S FREE SKATE - RESULT & VIDEOS (Updated)

    1. Daisuke TAKAHASHI (JPN) - 249.52 Free Skate, 2nd Copy, 3rd Copy, 4th Copy
    2. Patrick CHAN (CAN) - 240.21 Free Skate
    3. Kevin REYNOLDS (CAN) - 237.65 Free Skate, 2nd Copy, 3rd Copy
    4. Max AARON (USA) - 236.62 Free Skate
    5. Takahito MURA (JPN) - 233.68 Free Skate
    6. Jeremy ABBOTT (USA) - 231.84 Free Skate, 2nd Copy
    7. Brian JOUBERT (FRA) - 227.95 Free Skate
    8. Maxim KOVTUN (RUS) - 221.79 Free Skate, 2nd Copy
    9. Han YAN (CHN) - 207.81 Free Skate
    10. Yi WANG (CHN) - 183.57 Free Skate
    11. Romain PONSART (FRA) - 165.59 Free Skate
    WD. Konstantin MENSHOV (RUS) Free Skate

  8. #308
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    Thanks for the video of Konstantin's free skate. I was hoping it would get around; not because I wanted to see him hurt, but because I wanted to see the quads and the beginning layout of the program. His first two jumps were a bit iffy but he didn't look overly tense or out of whack, he just slipped forward on the landing of the 3A. Devastated for him. And it was nice to see the concern of everybody, not just Team Russia.

    Was his collarbone actually broken? I had heard rumours that he broke the collarbone AND dislocated his shoulder...

  9. #309
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Oh seriously, get over yourself. You're insulted because I grouped together the two skaters with the highest PCS in the men's field (heaven forbid! ). Generally, Chan has better skating skills/transitions/choreography, Takahashi has better interpretation/performance. I don't care how much you hate Chan or adore Takahashi, the vast majority of the figure skating world (and the judges' PCS marks) view Chan/Takahashi as PCS ("artistic") ideals that other skaters should be striving for. Chan's higher quality of skating (artistry on the blade) in general is rewarded more than Takahashi's greater expressiveness (artistry in expression) hence his consistent edge over Takahashi on PCS.
    The vast majority of the figure skating world do not view Chan as artistic ideal. The vast majority think that it is Takahashi who is the true artist with superior expressivness and projecting the emotions while Chan's expressions are fake/artificial. Chan has the edge in terms of SS and T which have nothing to do with "artistry". Not that Dai is weak in those areas but his surely head and shoulders above Chan when it comes to P/E and I. PCS are not exactly the old "Presentation". The fact that the judges give Chan higher marks in those departments DOES NOT mean that he is really better as far as those are concerned. While he usually deserves 9's dor SS and T his P/E score should not be higher than 6/6,5 for some of his skates this season, namely Worlds and WTT. His falls and other mistakes clearly and considerably disrupt the flow of the program and its EXECUTION. This last spin was a joke; he didn't even bother to wait until his music finishes. How that should deserve 8's for P/E and I?

  10. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Oh seriously, get over yourself. ... Generally, Chan has better skating skills/transitions/choreography, Takahashi has better interpretation/performance. I don't care how much you hate Chan or adore Takahashi, the vast majority of the figure skating world (and the judges' PCS marks)...
    I am always serious. You keep repeating "Chan is a better skater than everyone else" but he is not. Your only proof and defence is "vast majority of fs world" but you give no evidence of where this "majority" was actually voted and calculated. You are not the vast majority of fs world. To bring judges' PCS as a proof is plain stupid because that is exactly what is being critisized in Chan's score and CoP in general. So, take your own advice and get over yourself until you have the real argument. Seriously.

  11. #311
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    I watched both long programs. Patrick Chan does so much "stuff" (I guess these are the transitions?) that are not really jumps or spins. He leaps, turns around, falls to his knee, does a little spin or a little single jump, that by the time he's ready to jump again after his first couple of quads, he's exhausted. But the judges don't care. Either it's fixed (i.e. the judges want him to win for some reason that they will overlook anything) or to them the "stuff" is really important, much more important than not falling. So, yes, Patrick fell numerous times, but look at how many times he fell to his knee like he was proposing to someone! Look at how many little single jumps he did with his arms in the air! Look at how many times he made a face and started to "run" across the ice!

    My question is, if this is what the judges want, why is he the only guy smart enough to figure it out? Why are these other men worrying so hard about landing their jumps when they could win with a pile of hops and skips? Seriously.

    Call me the ultimate hater, but I'm so sick of this man I hope he doesn't even go to the Olympics next year. No, I don't wish an injury or family tragedy for him (although how he's managed to avoid an injury from all these falls is a miracle), but if he gets married and his wife goes into labor the day of the free skate, or if he decides that his true calling is medicine or law or something, I for one won't miss him.

  12. #312
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ice Diva View Post
    I stopped going on GS Forum months ago but today I’m avoiding studying for an upcoming exam, so I decided to distract myself & see if things had (miraculously) changed; if the site moderators had actually weeded out some of the haters, whiners, bashers & ranters.
    Alas, the haters, whiners, bashers, and ranters will always have a certain presence in any Internet discussion. It is the price one pays for vigorous debate and free exchange of ideas.

    Look at it this way. If a poster writes something mean and foolish about a skater, that is the poster revealing him/herself as mean and foolish, not the skater.

  13. #313
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaana View Post
    Maybe the skaters have tried to skate well this season, but are still saving their all for the Olympics? Fernandez was really good at the Europeans, but still not totally perfect. I hope that next season he will not put his all heart for defending that title, but will save his very best performances for the Olympics. I remember that Ilia Kulik had to withdraw from the Europeans because of an injury, and concentrated for the Olympics where he was really strong and in best condition. And of course peaking at the right time is really important.
    I hear you but I look at things differently. I think there are only three medals and while we all have our faves and none of us would or could agree as to who is the best. In some ways and I know there will be many dissenters or most dissenters it is kind of weird and "unfair" in a just way that some person flukes out and gets an Oly medal or gold. Did they earn often yes on that day but can you imagine there are skaters like Kwan at the top for so long and Orser with no gold. If there were real justice they would have gold...ah but what is justice for many would argue Boitano and Hamilton deserved it over orser and that Hughes and Lipnski deserved their gold. The thing is those skaters usualy don't skate that well or in the case of Orser what bad luck changing scorign ssytem and he ended up on the short stick. had Boitano not had BEzic the gold woud have been Orsers but such is life I guess.

    I'd like Chan, Dai and then a wide open bronze. Chan and Dai are well rounded skaters who have been up there for a while. I know life is timing but it almost would be sad to see someone just fluke out . But ThaT WON'T HAPPEN What will be will be. I know I will be hated but I really do want chan to win OGM or at least a medal with Dai. h I hope he skates clean. But I do want justice so I kind of hope he loses if he doesn't smarten up and get a proper coach.

  14. #314
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    I think most of these posters are adults. Oh the joy of skating in one's youth when winning was not the joy. But the exhileration of the wind going through your hair as you skated from end to end often falling. When I read what is written I start to understand why we have wars and why world peace is unlikely:( I wish including myself we could use our passion for something good, something noble. Why can't we all be friends ???? yes people I hear the hate towards a skater when it is the system you should be hating. I think some of these skaters have grounds to get restraining orders against us the way we talk.

  15. #315
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    Quote Originally Posted by let`s talk View Post
    I am always serious. You keep repeating "Chan is a better skater than everyone else" but he is not. Your only proof and defence is "vast majority of fs world" but you give no evidence of where this "majority" was actually voted and calculated. You are not the vast majority of fs world.
    Chan is a better skater than everyone else.

    He is not, however, the best performer or the one with the most musicality.

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