Skaters who have performed to Les Miserables | Page 2 | Golden Skate

Skaters who have performed to Les Miserables

iluvtodd

iluvtodd

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 5, 2004
Country
United-States
Didn't Caryn Kadavy skate to "I Dreamed a Dream" @ some point in her career?

Thanks for the Marigold Unity link - that was fabulous!

Loved, loved, loved Kurt & Paul's "Bring Him Home" & Moore-Towers Moskovitch's "Les Mis" program (in fact that was the program that piqued my interest in them). :)
 
Z

zschultz1986

Final Flight
Joined
Mar 18, 2013
Honestly, Yuna's was nothing to write home about artistically. It was amazing that she rose to the pressure of the moment and technically, it was the class of the field by a country mile, but really, it is kinda generic for Yuna and I really hope she finds some good music and constructs some more interesting programs for this Olympic year.

I'm not saying what she did at Worlds was bad... it was very exciting to watch in the moment. However, I don't think it has as much of a shelf-life as some of her other programs (particularly, some of her SPs for me: Tango de Roxanne: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTCAsSGgFWc and Danse Macabre: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVasw3hP3Rw

Anyway, I do love Jeremy's artistry and Bring Him Home was a perfect piece of music for him, though he never skated it to its full potential... and Really, Kurt can skate to anything and make it amazing and Paul is a favorite too.
 
M

Moment

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 18, 2013
Yuna's performance was perfect both technically and artistically, all those little moves playing perfectly with the little nuances of the music. Sorry if you don't recognize that!
 
J

jenaj

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Country
United-States
Moment said:
Yuna's performance was perfect both technically and artistically, all those little moves playing perfectly with the little nuances of the music. Sorry if you don't recognize that!
Click to expand...

Technically, brilliant. Artistically, high average. The bad music cuts don't help.
 
OS

OS

Sedated by Modonium
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
zschultz1986 said:
Honestly, Yuna's was nothing to write home about artistically. It was amazing that she rose to the pressure of the moment and technically, it was the class of the field by a country mile, but really, it is kinda generic for Yuna and I really hope she finds some good music and constructs some more interesting programs for this Olympic year.

I'm not saying what she did at Worlds was bad... it was very exciting to watch in the moment. However, I don't think it has as much of a shelf-life as some of her other programs (particularly, some of her SPs for me: Tango de Roxanne: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTCAsSGgFWc and Danse Macabre: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVasw3hP3Rw

Anyway, I do love Jeremy's artistry and Bring Him Home was a perfect piece of music for him, though he never skated it to its full potential... and Really, Kurt can skate to anything and make it amazing and Paul is a favorite too.
Click to expand...

jenaj said:
From a performance standpoint, Michelle's, Kurt's and Jeremy's are all better than Yu Na's. I haven't watched the others. Also Yu Na's music cuts are awful. Could there be more obscure music cuts from a musical with so many memorable songs? The first time I saw her program I hardly even recognized the music as Les Mis. I only recognized On My Own. In fact, I commend those who have watched it multiple times, because I turn it off after she finishes with On My Own.
Click to expand...

Actually from a music and a creative perspective, I actually thought the team did a great job deconstruct the musical in the similar fashion as to how 'Homage to Korea' with the main theme of Arirang had been arranged and integrated in 4 parts. I find approach to be refreshing to adaptations and love the non linear approach, making the wildly familiar sound unfamiliar, and avoided being generic and contrivances to ladies figure skating cliche 101s (usually follows some sob story, sexy moves, love story, or skate lovely, or relies entirely on the charisma of the skater but has little to do with the honesty and the integrity of the source) In doing so, the music is uniquely shaped to the choreography and not the other way round. As an avid fan of Les Mis who cares great deal about preserving the essence of the epic, I deeply appreciate what the team have tried to do, and what is realistically feasible to do in a free skate program and how to utilisize these precious seconds to make every second count. To find the right tone, level of expressions that is honest and truthful to the skater in the classic Wilson choreography way. (btw generic doesn't become generic overnight, but are about what has been established to be popular. When it is done by the team that originally founded them, they are classics. Otherwise it is like saying Prada only does generic bags because they are all in black.)

Deconstructionism in performance arts is characterized by unpredictability, and controlled chaos, making things that appear fragmented and non linear in a way that is significant - mirroring the unique expressions and opinion of the performer. There's no doubt in my mind, the skater who performed at the world championship 2013 FS knows the material backwards and forwards while she skate. Understand and conveyed the solitude, fortitude, courage and bravery. Contemplation, simmering anger, generous heartfelt love and most of all, deep resilience against impossible odds these Les Mis characters went through. The result isn't some easily digestible heart on a sleeve type of traditional ladies skating program, but far more potent and lingering that covers the grand epic quality as powerful as a men's program. It delivered the premise of the type of emotions as I have walking out of the Queen's theater in London where Les Mis is currently playing. A celebration of human conditions, the human spirit, a standing ovation, a triumph and uprising of the underclass.

I remember a thread a few months ago on GS when people complained about how boring Les Mis is, but I have questioned then if there had ever been an definitive Les Mis program that tackled the complex story definitively? To me, Yuna's Les Mis is distinguishable like Katerina Witt's Carmen out of hundreds and thousands of Carmen out there, past and present. It might not appeal to the general standard of taste of a conservative figure skating observers, who perhaps used to certain standards of spoon feeding 'expression' and emotional conventions. But in the long run, it is the youtube hits and the amount of times it get mentioned by public broadcasters and written about all of the world every time there's a new Les Miserable program will determines its true value (just like Witt's Carmen). Figure skating forums attract certain type of opinionated posters, each shaped by the baggage and the learning themselves carries (include myself). I'd be very curious to see what other distinguishable Les Mis program will there be in the future that is bold and gutsy enough to cover the epic quality and ambition of Les Mis. One could have said, it is far easier to focus on one strand, a feeling, an emotion, a theme, a character or a particular score, which wouldn't do the epic Les Mis justice, but about leverage a strand from Les Mis, a popular musical.

I do think work as fine and fully realized as Yuna's Les Mis deserve another perspective and appreciation. It is an ambitious and mature piece of work among today's ladies program. It has depth and essences that I look for that are truthful to the source and is a program that many will find infinitely watchable. (Heh...At least a few judges and journalists agrees with me ;) )
 
B

bebevia

On the Ice
Joined
Jun 22, 2011
os168 said:
generic doesn't become generic overnight, but are about what has been established to be popular.
Click to expand...
I so agree with this. I remember when I first looked at a photo of a particular Valentino dress, it was such a typical hourglass gown with that typical tone of red; then again, I took a second look at it, and realized that it was the Emperor himself who created that signature Red Crepe Gown of his (let's not debate on styles he referred from). Since then, I always reminded myself to respect all cliches as an appreciation of inventions that became timeless.

Now, safe? Yes. Memorable? Not quite. I was also one of those who shrugged at the LesMis choice of Yuna's; as any spectator of artistic fields, I do get excited by the news of an unexpected. Because she's got such a short competitive career, she really needs best of everything in all competitions. In the end, it felt as generic as expected, with no surprise; I hope Les Mis doesn't get overdone again, like one in every Olympic quad.

Bad? Nope. Despite my complaints, Yuna's program looked quite good. The music pieces were, IMO, very well integrated and flowed well from one to another with an adequate emphasis on On My Own. Storywise, the program starts with the atmosphere of the era (revolution), then transits onto the more delicate parts of individuals, which settles on Eponine, making her love the centre of the storyline; then it outs into the streamline of the era with her in it; it actually felt like a single score. This is by no means spicy like her 08/09 or lux like the last Olympics, but very sophisticated.

As for others' Les Mis, I feel they are more scene-oriented, which draws an audience with a single powerful emotion. If this is a person's preference, than Yuna's may not be a cup of tea - may even feel boring, too, but let's just say there are options like Yuna's. I sometimes can't stand Tom Ford shoes, and have hard time liking Max Mara.
 
Z

zschultz1986

Final Flight
Joined
Mar 18, 2013
os168 said:
Actually from a music and a creative perspective, I actually thought the team did a great job deconstruct the musical in the similar fashion as to how 'Homage to Korea' with the main theme of Arirang had been arranged and integrated in 4 parts. I find approach to be refreshing to adaptations and love the non linear approach, making the wildly familiar sound unfamiliar, and avoided being generic and contrivances to ladies figure skating cliche 101s (usually follows some sob story, sexy moves, love story, or skate lovely, or relies entirely on the charisma of the skater but has little to do with the honesty and the integrity of the source) In doing so, the music is uniquely shaped to the choreography and not the other way round. As an avid fan of Les Mis who cares great deal about preserving the essence of the epic, I deeply appreciate what the team have tried to do, and what is realistically feasible to do in a free skate program and how to utilisize these precious seconds to make every second count. To find the right tone, level of expressions that is honest and truthful to the skater in the classic Wilson choreography way. (btw generic doesn't become generic overnight, but are about what has been established to be popular. When it is done by the team that originally founded them, they are classics. Otherwise it is like saying Prada only does generic bags because they are all in black.)

Deconstructionism in performance arts is characterized by unpredictability, and controlled chaos, making things that appear fragmented and non linear in a way that is significant - mirroring the unique expressions and opinion of the performer. There's no doubt in my mind, the skater who performed at the world championship 2013 FS knows the material backwards and forwards while she skate. Understand and conveyed the solitude, fortitude, courage and bravery. Contemplation, simmering anger, generous heartfelt love and most of all, deep resilience against impossible odds these Les Mis characters went through. The result isn't some easily digestible heart on a sleeve type of traditional ladies skating program, but far more potent and lingering that covers the grand epic quality as powerful as a men's program. It delivered the premise of the type of emotions as I have walking out of the Queen's theater in London where Les Mis is currently playing. A celebration of human conditions, the human spirit, a standing ovation, a triumph and uprising of the underclass.

I remember a thread a few months ago on GS when people complained about how boring Les Mis is, but I have questioned then if there had ever been an definitive Les Mis program that tackled the complex story definitively? To me, Yuna's Les Mis is distinguishable like Katerina Witt's Carmen out of hundreds and thousands of Carmen out there, past and present. It might not appeal to the general standard of taste of a conservative figure skating observers, who perhaps used to certain standards of spoon feeding 'expression' and emotional conventions. But in the long run, it is the youtube hits and the amount of times it get mentioned by public broadcasters and written about all of the world every time there's a new Les Miserable program will determines its true value (just like Witt's Carmen). Figure skating forums attract certain type of opinionated posters, each shaped by the baggage and the learning themselves carries (include myself). I'd be very curious to see what other distinguishable Les Mis program will there be in the future that is bold and gutsy enough to cover the epic quality and ambition of Les Mis. One could have said, it is far easier to focus on one strand, a feeling, an emotion, a theme, a character or a particular score, which wouldn't do the epic Les Mis justice, but about leverage a strand from Les Mis, a popular musical.

I do think work as fine and fully realized as Yuna's Les Mis deserve another perspective and appreciation. It is an ambitious and mature piece of work among today's ladies program. It has depth and essences that I look for that are truthful to the source and is a program that many will find infinitely watchable. (Heh...At least a few judges and journalists agrees with me ;) )
Click to expand...

I can see what you and bebevia are saying. I just think the program is trying to be too much. I'm saying its generic, in that, it's not specific, that there really isn't a strong POV through the whole program... it's just "Les Mis". Sure, there's Eponine, but really, that's only the character shes portraying in the middle. I don't think Les Mis is boring, the score is powerful, and I STILL get that emotional ball in my gut listening to Lea Salonga singing ANYTHING from the the musical (and really, I can listen to the whole score in general).

I do think David and Yuna know Les Mis through and through.... but you only have 4 and 1/2 minutes out there, and its just NOT enough time to do what they were intending to do. You say you have those feelings as if you were walking out of the Queen's theater after watching Les Mis, but Les Mis is what... 2-3 hours long? Plus, Les Mis has what, 9 or 10 major and tons of minor, but still impactful, characters? The novel is what, 1500 pages? There's a reason that a lot of figure skating is based on a single theme, because that's what the time constraints call for. Also, I don't think that simplicity in a theme is a bad thing, if the skater commits. I think a well done strand of Les Mis would do it justice. Sure, it wouldn't convey EVERYTHING that Les Mis is, but you couldn't realistically DO that in 4 1/2 minutes and with only one person. The strength of Les Mis is that it is a tapestry of many Points Of View woven together to create something epic. You can't do that in 4 1/2 minutes and with just one person.

You might say that Yuna's was a "Grand Epic" but to me it just seems like "Cliff Notes". The Point of View isn't strong, which is the trouble you can get into with "deconstruction." Honestly, I think the only reason Yuna's "Les Mis" worked so well was because of the limited number of times it was skated competitively. To me, it was more the excitement of the skating world of having Yuna back in competition (and the fact that Yuna skated that LP flawlessly) that carried the performance, not the strength of the music or the choreography. I didn't like the choice of music cuts, but the editing of them together WAS top notch. I just think that this program was trying to be too much by trying to convey EVERYTHING and ended up coming off muddled.

Can I ask a question? I don't know whether or not you're insulting my taste level, or calling me simple with your response (so I will reserve judgement as that is me reading into your statement).

Did anyone understand this post? (Full disclosure: I'm a huge fan of Yuna... I hope this reads as a fan's analysis and not someone who is trying to "hate" on her or her amazing talent.)
 
Mathman

Mathman

Joined
Jun 21, 2003
I do think it is possible for a sensitive viewer to inject all sorts of cool stuff into a performance that isn't really there. Is Yu-na's triple Lutz-triple toe combination done in the style of Jean Valjean, or of Inspector Joubert?
 
B

bebevia

On the Ice
Joined
Jun 22, 2011
I do understand when someone says "epic" about this program; that this may be outstanding and one of the most memorable. For me, it's great but subtle, less than dramatic, but am convinced why some regard it that way. Also, in the editing of music, it has technical qualities that has to be better than the past, which is a case in most things. I believe it has artistic qualities that are unique to itself; no two are the same, and of course it does. What I do feel is that it is very well done to serve its purpose, and I actually think it's all it meant to deliver.

I think this is where we have discordance: what is the INTENSION? Like I've said it before, I think it's Eponine's Theme, not the entire LesMis. If you are familiar with fan fictions (I'm a halfway nerd), this could be a spinoff of Eponine's Great Epic of Love in the Dust of Revolution, or whatever. A spinoff episode or any story rewritten from a different (character's) POV assumes that you've observed the original plot already. It's a type of piece where you need to know the original plot before acquainting this episode, and different from focusing on an existing scene.

The same thing happened with Yuna's Giselle. Instead of retelling the entire story, Yuna picked up on Willies' theme, where the program portrays the general resentment of the dead maidens after how they went from being happily in love then suddenly betrayed. The program didn't just use the scores from the scene of the Willies, but used bits of other scenes to do that. The important thing is that this is not a reenactment that summarizes a staged piece, but reemphasis on a subpoint. Expand and add some interpretation/fill-in-the-blanks, make it a complete supplemental story - thing.

I didn't mean to say that anyone who doesn't agree in the first place is tasteless; if something sounded that way, I apologize, and please refer it to me. On my defence, I did say things are up to persons' preferences, like how I'm not a fan of certain celebrity -though I see the talents- designers. I believe in constructive criticism, and I believe you also have a valid opinion; given that, do believe that no one has tried to insult another (here, yet, so far).

...

Now that aside, I wonder when the battle between "too much expression" and "too little expression" will start. For someone who feels Yuna had "adequate expression", that'd be one interesting fire over the horizon. (What a troll I am.)
 
dorispulaski

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
Mathman said:
I do think it is possible for a sensitive viewer to inject all sorts of cool stuff into a performance that isn't really there. Is Yu-na's triple Lutz-triple toe combination done in the style of Jean Valjean, or of Inspector Joubert?
Click to expand...

Well, when my imagination starts adding accessories that the skaters aren't really carrying, then I know they are putting on a really convincing performance ;)

W&P's 2011 SD program without imagining that Kaitlyn was carrying a little rhinestone studded clutch purse during the not touching step sequence.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UO2tEQZsvFo
 
Krislite

Krislite

Medalist
Joined
Sep 22, 2010
Mathman said:
I do think it is possible for a sensitive viewer to inject all sorts of cool stuff into a performance that isn't really there. Is Yu-na's triple Lutz-triple toe combination done in the style of Jean Valjean, or of Inspector Joubert?
Click to expand...

Brian Joubert is an inspector now? Or did you mean Javert? ;)

By the way, the triple-triple is for when Valjean is breaking out of prison. Notice the choreography at the beginning where Yuna is clearly running swiftly to escape the prison guards? And the triumphant expression right after the combo when Valjean is finally out and is free of his chains?

During the transition into the 3Flip when Yuna does a series of choctaws changing directions, you see Valjean's wavering mind before he decides. The 3Flip is when Valjean commits himself to change his ways and becomes good. (The spin that follows shows the transformation.)

That's just what, book 1? You all know the story. Doesn't everybody see this? :p
 
S

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
os168 said:
Actually from a music and a creative perspective, I actually thought the team did a great job deconstruct the musical in the similar fashion as to how 'Homage to Korea' with the main theme of Arirang had been arranged and integrated in 4 parts. I find approach to be refreshing to adaptations and love the non linear approach, making the wildly familiar sound unfamiliar, and avoided being generic and contrivances to ladies figure skating cliche 101s (usually follows some sob story, sexy moves, love story, or skate lovely, or relies entirely on the charisma of the skater but has little to do with the honesty and the integrity of the source) In doing so, the music is uniquely shaped to the choreography and not the other way round. As an avid fan of Les Mis who cares great deal about preserving the essence of the epic, I deeply appreciate what the team have tried to do, and what is realistically feasible to do in a free skate program and how to utilisize these precious seconds to make every second count. To find the right tone, level of expressions that is honest and truthful to the skater in the classic Wilson choreography way. (btw generic doesn't become generic overnight, but are about what has been established to be popular. When it is done by the team that originally founded them, they are classics. Otherwise it is like saying Prada only does generic bags because they are all in black.)

Deconstructionism in performance arts is characterized by unpredictability, and controlled chaos, making things that appear fragmented and non linear in a way that is significant - mirroring the unique expressions and opinion of the performer. There's no doubt in my mind, the skater who performed at the world championship 2013 FS knows the material backwards and forwards while she skate. Understand and conveyed the solitude, fortitude, courage and bravery. Contemplation, simmering anger, generous heartfelt love and most of all, deep resilience against impossible odds these Les Mis characters went through. The result isn't some easily digestible heart on a sleeve type of traditional ladies skating program, but far more potent and lingering that covers the grand epic quality as powerful as a men's program. It delivered the premise of the type of emotions as I have walking out of the Queen's theater in London where Les Mis is currently playing. A celebration of human conditions, the human spirit, a standing ovation, a triumph and uprising of the underclass.

I remember a thread a few months ago on GS when people complained about how boring Les Mis is, but I have questioned then if there had ever been an definitive Les Mis program that tackled the complex story definitively? To me, Yuna's Les Mis is distinguishable like Katerina Witt's Carmen out of hundreds and thousands of Carmen out there, past and present. It might not appeal to the general standard of taste of a conservative figure skating observers, who perhaps used to certain standards of spoon feeding 'expression' and emotional conventions. But in the long run, it is the youtube hits and the amount of times it get mentioned by public broadcasters and written about all of the world every time there's a new Les Miserable program will determines its true value (just like Witt's Carmen). Figure skating forums attract certain type of opinionated posters, each shaped by the baggage and the learning themselves carries (include myself). I'd be very curious to see what other distinguishable Les Mis program will there be in the future that is bold and gutsy enough to cover the epic quality and ambition of Les Mis. One could have said, it is far easier to focus on one strand, a feeling, an emotion, a theme, a character or a particular score, which wouldn't do the epic Les Mis justice, but about leverage a strand from Les Mis, a popular musical.

I do think work as fine and fully realized as Yuna's Les Mis deserve another perspective and appreciation. It is an ambitious and mature piece of work among today's ladies program. It has depth and essences that I look for that are truthful to the source and is a program that many will find infinitely watchable. (Heh...At least a few judges and journalists agrees with me ;) )
Click to expand...


Wow. Hmm, now I know why people say what is art? Thanks for the deconstruction of the situation - seriously - I never thought of it quite .like that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Ichatdelune
Rant
Replies
17
Views
1K
bartlebooth
B
N
TASS reports ISU technical committee intends to simplify the skaters' programs
2 3
Replies
50
Views
4K
theblade
T
C
  • Locked
Was the ISU right to increase age limits?
4 5 6
Replies
100
Views
6K
orzin
O
P
I Wish They Would Give More Importance To The Spiral!
2
Replies
37
Views
2K
RobinA
RobinA
S
Figure skating and Artistic roller skating cross paths
2
Replies
31
Views
2K
Sk8swan
S
Top