At the risk of being a troll, I think there is something in coolboogie's original post.
When you are going for the championship, look like a champion, conduct yourself like a champion, take the ice with a champion's attitude. Do not skate to lightweight music in a silly costume. You own the ice, you are the one the audience has been waiting all evening for.
Then when you are done, give a modest little smile and put your hand over your mouth as if to say, "I know, right? Sometimes I can't believe it myself!"
Yuna is grossly overscored in GOE and especially in PCS. Like Chan. But unlike the Canadian she actually deserved her wins, all of them. Just not with that score.
Then, who else isn't overscored? She may get high GOEs and PCS, but then, technical panels were very strict to her. She was given an edge call for her flip at this Worlds, but Caro's 3T didn't receive an UR call and Mao was given a +GOE for an 3A with a two-footed landing.
Originally Posted by let`s talk
I wouldn't call Yuna a great artist, her expressions consist of sad faces and making frown eyebrows
Carolina is a great artist but Yuna is the better athlete
- high consistency
- not very consistent
-amazing skating skills
1. Yuna's grace and elegance are unparalleled. She acts like a queen without being pretentious or stuck up. Her personality, to the extent we can see, is very endearing.
2. She is more confident and consistent than any other skater. This gives her an aura and presence that others cannot match.
3. Yuna is by far the fastest skater of the ladies. The speed into her jumps is amazing.
4. She is the best jumper of all the ladies and many would say the best toe jumper of all time.
5. Her other elements are all world class too. Her spins are beautiful. Some of her laybacks have been out of this world.
6.. Yuna IS an artist, the way she feels the music makes me feel the music with her.
7. Her music and choreography choices, her dress choices, everything she does to put on the SHOW ... it's amazing.
8. She has the perfect instrument for figure skating. Her body is perfectly proportioned and beautiful to watch dance on the ice in a very classy and elegant way.
9. Yuna just happens to be the most beautiful woman on the ice.
10. She nearly always wins and kicks butt when she does it!
Is there, though? There is merit to discussing about what makes Yuna one of the all-time greats, but the way in which coolboogie approached this subject amounts to nothing more than blind Yuna-worship. This sort of gushing belongs, at most, in the Fan fest threads and I don't believe for a minute that the initial post was actually meant to incite serious discussion.
Originally Posted by Mathman
I happen to think that Carolina looks plenty like a champion, but that didn't really help her when she splatted on her ending 3S in the Worlds FS. So maybe there is more to winning that "looking like a champion"? This, after all, is supposed to be a sport, not a beauty pageant.
Originally Posted by Mathman
Or you could simply skate to music that suits you and plays to your particular strenghts instead of trying to fit into other people's narrow notions of what a champion/"lady" skater is. Yuna's Olympic programs (especially her SP) were skated to what could be considered "lightweight" music, but that didn't seem to hurt her or make her look like less of an Olympic champion.
Originally Posted by Mathman
(As a sidenote, figure skating costumes often are silly and/or campy -Yuna's "blood collar" thing, Carolina's "bloody hands on white dress" from Europeans, Mao's very literal Swan Lake costume etc. -, but I've always considered that half the fun of watching figure skating and it's part of the reason why I enjoy the sport so much. Maybe that's just me.)
Darn I was only going to do 10 but there's one thing I overlooked ... all of her connecting movements. She never wastes a moment or movement on the ice. So important!
I admit that she was a bit overscored in FS in 2013 Worlds. (Not SP) but I think others' did, too. Caro and Mao's FS score was their personal best score.
Originally Posted by let`s talk
first of all, she has never won by PCS like Chan, while patrick chan has many winnings with weak skates but by pcs, and some top skaters win by that way.
when she win major titles, she always has clean or close to clean skating. she has been always less mistakes than competitors.
And as you said, She didn't won unfair medal(while other top skaters won several times). Also If she had been grossly overscored because she is judges' favorite, isn't this fact strange?
Also, what i think interesting is that when she skated superior(clean or close to clean programs), and her winning is confirmed, then judges had judgement generously.
But when she have similar mistakes with her competitors like 2008 WC, 2011 WC, She was defeated by very small margin(1~2 point). IMO judges were a bit harsh to her - This is why I think she must always looks like strongest, perfect - if judges wanted her winning, then they can do that easily by gave PCS a bit(1~2) more to her. I know my words will Sounds strange, I also wonder why...
As a skater of many years and a coach I can tell you that there is absolutely nothing wrong with Carolinas flip, her triple flip is perfect, TBH I don't see how one could have a salchow like flip the weight has to be over the right side on a flip take off or the toe will slip for it to be like a salchow the weight would have to be over the opposite side. hope that clears it up
Originally Posted by mateusp1
what a lame troll bait thread and posters jumped in!
I think what makes Yuna special is the totality of her skating. With other ladies, I'm always aware of the "ups and downs" of the program. I feel it when they're slowing down/hesitating/conserving energy in certain sections, and I also feel when they're attacking and putting out more energy. I don't sense those "ups and downs" with Yuna. With her, I feel like every movement in the program is skated with the same energy, the same attack, the same lack of hesitation. She enters a spin or transition with the same speed and immediacy as a triple Lutz/triple toe. All elements are treated equally, attacked equally. There is thus a seamlessness and a totality to the experience.
In 2011, I saw Yuna skate her Fever exhibition at Evening with Champions. In this program, she did not perform a single jump, not even a double Axel. And yet, the program was dazzling. Everything was fluid, seamless, and performed with such energy and speed and interest. It went by in a flash. And this without any jumps at all. So, for those who say her brilliance is all about her jumps, I don't agree. Her jumps are amazing, and hugely important in her success, but there is more to it.
I think what really sets her apart is her fearlessness. She has all that tremendous speed, and the confidence to bring it into every single element. Carolina has speed too, but she is more cautious, and she doesn't harness it as consistently and completely as Yuna does.
I do love Carolina and Mao tremendously, as well as Yuna. I think they're all wonderfully talented. But there's a reason that Yuna is Olympic champion, and they are not (yet), and I don't think it's trollish to consider what is special about Yuna. And for those who think I'm an uber, this is not the case, I actually didn't really like Yuna that much even up through Vancouver. It's only since 2011 that I've come to appreciate her (a lot).
I gotta say, I honestly don't get it. I find her bland and nothing special. But I tend to find most of the ladies that way.
And 2011 Worlds really rubbed me up the wrong way. She had the arrogance and conceit to just swan in to Worlds, not even having earned her place there, having even skipped her own Nationals, while everyone else had been working their butts off all season. Oh man, did that EVER rub me up the wrong way.
Originally Posted by Moment
OK, I am gonna give my 2 cents here...
It really depends on what you consider to be "good" or "bad" for a jump. Almost everything you said I consider to be qualities of Carolina's flip.
When you say:
"However before the toe pick hits the ice Carolina "pushes" the edge and it goes to a pretty deep inside, making a deep curve."
For me(I am not my expert, just my point of view), this is a quality. As you said..."PRETTY DEEP INSIDE". I think everyone knows that skating/jumping with deep edges is much more difficult and complicated. Also, since it is "PRETTY DEEP INSIDE", the edge of her flip very clear, if have no doubt that she is doing a "lip" or making changes of edge in the last second. It is possible to see in TV that her flip is a real flip with a correct, clear, deep(curved, if you prefer) inside edge.
"By that she gains some rotational force just like a Salchow jump. In short, her flip not completely toe-assisted."
I think that this is also a quality! Since she does not put so much power in her toe pick, the take off looks smoother, softer. Some people even make severe critics to some skaters who put "so much power" in their toe jumps, calling this "hammer toe", like Kanako Murakami, who puts so much power into her toes.
I don't see problems with this flip.
Originally Posted by skatel80
Thank you so much for your attention.