The Return of Marina Anissina to Ice Dance
- Thread starter Macassar88
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I spent several days after the 1994 ice dance finals wondering what possessed Christopher Dean to add an obviously illegal lift (I think he flipped Torvill over his head) when they had won the rhumba and were in contention for the gold. Drat! But their reputation didn't need the burnish of an extra OGM. They've done just fine holding on to their spot as one of the greatest couples ever.
....Annissina and Piezerat were never on that level, though, and I don't know what it is they think they can add to French team competition. Ah, well, it's not in our hands.
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Yes they were.
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- Mar 20, 2013
Yes, I too hope to learn more about what happened behind the scenes in 1994 to convince T&D that it was OK and necessary to do a lift that even the most adventurous pairs don't do. She hopped onto his back, jumped up, and then did a backflip over his head. In what ice dancing world was that ever legal? Out of the hundreds of creative, original, and dramatic moves T&D have done over the years, they had to choose that one? No one bothered to warn them? Did someone warn them and Chris was too stubborn to change it? That lift cost them the gold. It wasn't that G&P and U&Z were better. It wasn't that the judges were corrupt (at least in this case). The judges gave them the chance to win, especially placing them 1st for the OD. The judges were ready to give them a second gold if their FD held water. It did, but the illegal lift ruined everything. Correct me if I'm wrong, but there haven't been any ice dancers, except T&D, to come back to amateur competition, let alone being close to winning gold.
A&P say that they're skating for glory and joy, not medals. Seriously, if they're bored with their lives that lack meaning, find something else to do. They're only going to feel worse if they place 10th, and then they have to put themselves in denial and console themselves that the "process" was more important than results. I vaguely recall that T&D said they would choose not to come back if they knew how difficult it would be. Even A&P's best was never the best. The most realistic chance they have is embarrassing themselves with those glacially slow twizzles and spins.
I was there at the OWG in 1994. T&D were upset over the judging at Euros, even though they won, so they totally restructured their FD. But what they did was retool it to become "the best of T&D" using many of their "tricks" from past programs throughout their career. Plus their CDs were slow with visible errors and even their FD was SLOW. Their OD was by far their best performance.
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Dean's argument is too lawyerly and obscure, rendering it fallacious. It's a supposed loophole that he found, but it's no loophole at all to the naked eye. As long as she goes OVER his head and shoulders, that's illegal. It doesn't matter whether whether she was lifted or that she had to jump over him herself. It's far too acrobatic.
The ice dancers were at a disadvantage that year because the judges decided that they could only use music that people dance to. So the innovative programs such as Klimova/Ponomarenko's Bach program and Usova/Zhulin's Vivaldi program (if I recall correctly) done in 1992 were no longer a possibility. This is how Torvill and Dean ended up with Fred and Ginger (mind you, Fred Astaire is one of my favorite dancers ever) and Grishchuk/Platov performed to Rock Around the Clock. G/P adapted and made their speed work for them, but for Torvill and Dean it was a considerable step backward, and I'm sure they chafed at the limitations. By 1998 that rule was modified, but it was too late for Jayne and Chris. I'm sure if the music had been less stringently regulated, we would have seen something considerably more inventive from them.
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I remember the European Championships that year. Usova/Zhulin won both CDs, with Torvill/Dean and Grishuk/Platov each gaining one 2nd and 3rd ordinal. T/D did, in fact, win the OD with that classic program. G/P won the FD. So, signals were sent across the Figure Skating World that the OWG would not be a slam dunk for T/D. At Euros, they had won only the OD in a very tight competition. They only won the OD at the Olympics, as well, so those results were somewhat consistent.
I never warmed to G/P; they just weren't my kind of ice dancers. But the fact remains that their win in the Olympics was not some out of the blue aberration.
Several phrases come to mind. "too cute by half" "splitting hairs" "violating the spirit..." etc! Lol!
Perhaps, but everyone had the same problem. T&D were mostly upset that they lost the FD at Euros. I was at every practice and watched them totally rework their FD from what they performed at Euros. They spent more ice time trying to decide which "trick" to put where in the program.
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I agree that the T/D lift certainly appeared illegal, and to me was rightfully judged illegal -- but then, G/P danced apart for a length of time that was supposed to be penalized (more than 10 seconds, or some such -- I don't remember the specifics), but wasn't -- which was also hotly discussed in the media right after.
I loved T/D's dances at that Olys. And I thought G/P were fast but a titch sloppy-looking, just to me. But really, like TontoK, they just weren't dancers I enjoyed watching, so I was always a bit prone not to like their programs.
I loved T/D's dances at that Olys. And I thought G/P were fast but a titch sloppy-looking, just to me. But really, like TontoK, they just weren't dancers I enjoyed watching, so I was always a bit prone not to like their programs.
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I absolutely agree with everything you said. The judges should have been consistent with making deductions against the stupid rules they came up. I never really liked G&P also. On paper, they accomplished the most medals, yet very few of their programs could be considered masterpieces. Libertango and Memorial were their best pieces, but they certainly didn't impact the audience or ice dancing in a profound level.
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Dream on. Why would the French fed. consider a second rate team who could never come close to winning a major title, and managed only 1 bronze at Worlds the last 3 years despite being supposed to finish 3rd over a super weak field (after the first two) each time as their number 1 over a dominant team who won all the major titles and is an Olympic Champion. Marina and Gwendal return in good shape the French will give them full backing as number 1.
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I love T&D as an ice dancing team but as people they are super arrogant and unlikeable. The fact they whine about judging over an event they WON is pathetic, and their arrogance proved their downfall at the Games. Why did people feel sorry for them anyway, they already had all the titles and did well to medal at the Games at almost 40. People should feel more sorry about poor Usova & Zhulin who are the best team to not win an Olympics or more than 1 Worlds, and who narrowly lost in their last chance after so many close calls against them in their career, and to the Russian number 2 who they had always beaten before.
I think p/b would get first place scores because they do have more experience with cop. A/p are Olympic champions by it was 2002! P/b just have more of a current relationship with all the relevant people now too. That matters too.
All that exist are her statements of wanting to compete in Russia and talking with Gwendel and her other statements. She could be serious but it Might never get off the ground and if it doesn't get off the ground that doesn't mean she wasn't serious.
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deedee1, it certainly sounds serious, but I have have to see them competing before I believe it.
http://web.icenetwork.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20130617&content_id=50885566&vkey=ice_news
There's both the original announcement & an update.
And this
http://web.icenetwork.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20130617&content_id=50885566&vkey=ice_news
There's both the original announcement & an update.
And this
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Thank you so much, gmyers and doris! 
She IS serious. So cool. I love her! more than I did love her when she & Gwendel were competing back then. Yeah I understand wanting to come back/compete and making an actual comeback is two different things. But still COOL, isn't it? I always admired her will power and rooted for this French team...ever since I heard about the story btwn Anissina and Lovacheva...
She IS serious. So cool. I love her! more than I did love her when she & Gwendel were competing back then.
Yeah I understand wanting to come back/compete and making an actual comeback is two different things. But still COOL, isn't it? I always admired her will power and rooted for this French team...ever since I heard about the story btwn Anissina and Lovacheva...
