Which past US girls to send to Sochi? | Page 2 | Golden Skate

Which past US girls to send to Sochi?

mskater93

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Oct 22, 2005
If we could guarantee Harding was training and not goofing off/playing pool/drinking beer et al, I would have her on my team in a heartbeat. When she was trained, she was unbeatable except for by Midori at her best.
 

kwanatic

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May 19, 2011
Kwan also had outstanding spirals but even struggled on those under COP, getting a level 1 on her spiral sequence in some of the rounds at the 2005 Worlds and seemingly confused what she should be trying to do with it.


The spiral talk is irrelevant b/c there is no more leveled spiral sequence...just the choreographed spiral sequence and I know Michelle would receive nothing but +2s and +3s on that. No one was better at building up to spiral than Michelle.
 

FlattFan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jan 4, 2010
I think at her best, Kwan could do this

SP:
3T3T
3Lz
2A
level 3 on spins
level 3 on steps

TES: 33
PCS: 33

Total: 66, basically a few points behind the top 3, maybe one point below the other girls if they hit (Adelina, Akiko, etc)

In the LP
3T3T
3Lz
3F
2A
3Lo
3F-2T-2Lo
3S-2Lo

-1 on the Lz. Everything else should be +1 or +2.
66 in TES
68 in PCS
134 total.

Should crack 200 at her best. Maybe not able to beat a clean Kostner, Kim, and Asada, but should perch near the top.
 

FlattFan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jan 4, 2010
Kristi is a bit tricky

SP
3fLz-3T
3F
2A
should have level 3 and 4 on spins and steps.
TES: 35
PCS: 33

Total: 68.

LP
3fLz-3T
3F
3S
2A-3T
3F-2T-2Lo
3Lo
2A

TES: 68
PCS: 68

136. I think Kristi at her best can beat Kwan in TES. Might also beat Kwan in PCS as well.
Combined, she should also clear 200. Still not enough to take down the top 3.
 

pangtongfan

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Jun 16, 2010
This is not exactly true. Her WR under COP was during the inflation period. She would not get that kind of score even with a quintuple axel.
Another fallacy regarding Cohen is her amazing spins. No, she did not get the most points in spins ever. Her direct competitors always beat her in spins.

Well Shizuka beat her at the 2006 Olympics, and Slutskaya might have in spins at the 2005 Worlds. Those are the only ever instances I can think of, and even those times she got the 2nd most points in spins, beating all her other direct competitors.

Kwan could get level 3 on all her spins. Maybe mostly level 3 and one level 4 for combo. Rachael Flatt regularly got level 4 spins, so I don't think it's impossible for Kwan to get it.

Well if it is that easy how would Cohen who is way more suited to COP spins, and a better spinner in general than Kwan and much better than Flatt, ever have problems doing so as you seem to think?


Kwan should have picked a coach who understands COP. There's no way if she holds the spiral a bit longer, she wouldn't be able to get level 3 at least. I mean, Miki Ando and Flatt got level 4 in spirals. Not exactly hard to get if you follow the recipe for level 4.

Agreed on that.



Well, if Harding can repeat one of her 91 National, wouldn't you say she's competitive for the gold medal? Say 3A, 3Lz, 3T3T in the SP. And then just 7 triples in the LP.

Of course she would be. The question is how one could feel relatively secure Harding even pinpointing when the peak time of her career (probably 1991, but even there she had some meltdowns) was would give a performance like that, unless there was a button on her to guarantee good Tonya that day. She was wildly unpredictable even in her best years to put it mildly. If we could guarantee her best performance though then for sure send Tonya. Give her some of her 86-89 choreography rather than her 91-92 choreography and it would be even better, but even with the horrendous music cuts she would still be contending at the very top with that level of performance I agree.
 

FlattFan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jan 4, 2010
Tonya
SP
3A
3T3T
3Lz
level 3 on spins and steps

TES: 42
PCS: 31

Total: 73

in the LP
3A
3Lz
3T3T
3S
3Lo
3F-2T
3Lz-2T-2T

This program will spank all of the top 3 in TES
TES: I can see her getting around 85 in TES
PCS: 65

Total: 150.

Combine, she should be front runner for the gold medal.
 

yunabestever

Spectator
Joined
Jun 24, 2013
The judges hated Tonya`s artistry. It is dreaming to think she would get such huge PCS even at her best. Also while her basic skating and spins were great, her footwork was very weak and she would probably have a level 1 footwork sequence, or level 2 if lucky.
 

yunabestever

Spectator
Joined
Jun 24, 2013
Tonya could never beat Kristi when both skated cleanly. The only times Tonya beat Kristi very few was when she fell or made mistakes, and Tonya was squeeky perfect with a triple axel. So why would one have Kristi scoring like 30 points lower than Tonya in COP. Even if COP suits Tonya more she wouldnt beat someone she could never beat in her own time that easily. Yeah Tonya should get more GOE on jumps, but Kristi would score higher on all other things, and PCS would be alot more than 1 point higher than Tonya, try more like atleast 10 points.
 

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be
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Sep 14, 2008
Country
France
I think at her best, Kwan could do this

SP:
3T3T
3Lz
2A
level 3 on spins
level 3 on steps

TES: 33
PCS: 33

Total: 66, basically a few points behind the top 3, maybe one point below the other girls if they hit (Adelina, Akiko, etc)

Kwan should be getting more than 33 for PCS at her best. Her footwork would definitely be Level 4, if she trained under the current CoP. She could get Level 4 on the Combination Spin as well.
 

FlattFan

Match Penalty
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Jan 4, 2010
The judges hated Tonya`s artistry. It is dreaming to think she would get such huge PCS even at her best. Also while her basic skating and spins were great, her footwork was very weak and she would probably have a level 1 footwork sequence, or level 2 if lucky.

Only the US judges hated Tonya's artistry. The international judges loved her.
I think if she hits, her PCS would be higher. Obviously I'm being very conservative when it comes to her PCS.
 

Icey

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Joined
Nov 28, 2012
Rosalyn Summers (she won silver to witt's OG ), Linda Fratianne, Elaine Zayack . Of course, I am assuming they are at their prime and have jumps competitive with the current crew.
 

Jammers

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Nov 4, 2010
Country
United-States
She won a silver medal at the olympics with a fall and step out in the long

Only because the competition was so mediocre. If Sasha had skated like she did in Turin at the 2010 Olympics she would have been lucky to make the top 7.
 

pangtongfan

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Jun 16, 2010
Only because the competition was so mediocre. If Sasha had skated like she did in Turin at the 2010 Olympics she would have been lucky to make the top 7.

True at that, but most Olympics are not as strong as Vancouver (heck none in history has been) and Sochi probably wont be either despite the deep field. A whole field handling Olympic nerves like that was astonishing and very rare. Furthermore Cohen on a good day could perform better than she did in Turin. She had an injury in Turin too.
 

pangtongfan

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Jun 16, 2010
Why pick someone like Cohen who you just know is going to fall once or twice and blow it yet again?

I picked her for lack of better options. Come to think of it further though you are probably right and Yamaguchi, Debi Thomas, and one of Tara Lipinski or Michelle Kwan maybe would be my team since while neither Kwan or Tara would be as strong under COP as 6.0, both would still be fairly strong, and all 4 of those were great under pressure. Past skaters assumed to have the difficulty of todays skaters translated into a different time though my team would be Yamaguchi, Hamill, and Lynn probably.
 

Dee4707

Ice Is Slippery - Alexie Yagudin
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Jul 28, 2003
Country
United-States
Why pick someone like Cohen who you just know is going to fall once or twice and blow it yet again?

I keep forgetting that she's the only skater that ever did!!
 

ffionhanathomas

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 12, 2013
I'd love to see Sasha Cohen skate at the Olympics again. There's no one like her, she really tells a story when she skates and is just incredible, regardless of the mistakes!
 

Icey

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 28, 2012
I keep forgetting that she's the only skater that ever did!!
Yes, like Cohen, other american female skaters have fallen at the Olympics.
Kristi had what would be considered a fall today in her 1992 Olympics.

I find it amazing though that she had a triple lutz/ triple toe in 1992 and our national champion today doesn't have any kind of 3/3.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dozwFZ5NoNs

At the same Olympics, Harding had a fall.

Janet Lynn had a fall at the 1972 Olympics. Emily Hughes fell qt the 2006 Olympics. NIcole Bobek fell at her Olympics in 1998.

So if a fall at an OLympics is a basis for elimination in this thread, quite a few suggested skaters would have to have their name withdrawn.

Was there a name for the tanyo-like double axel Nancy did at her first Olympics?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5v6qwtKRKeM
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
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Feb 24, 2012
Rosalyn Summers (she won silver to witt's OG ), Linda Fratianne, Elaine Zayack . Of course, I am assuming they are at their prime and have jumps competitive with the current crew.

so like a total fantasy right??? :)
 

Icey

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 28, 2012
Not under the assumptions of this thread: If Elaine' s skating days were today, she would probably have an amazing arsenal of triples. Since Rosalyn did well against witt, if her skating days were today, I think she would be competitive with many of the top skaters today. Same for Linda. If they were frozen in time, of course, it would be fantasy to think they could do well today. But since looking at Kristi's olympic program I think some of today's top skaters would find her a very worthy competitor (all of the american ladies, in fact)
 
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