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Thread: Best coaches in the world in each discipline?

  1. #16
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    My choices:

    Single: Mr. Nicks, with a shout out to Carlo & Christa Fassi.

    Pairs: Tamara Moskvina

    Ice Dance: Marina Zuoeva & Igor Shpilband

  2. #17
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    Singles: Carroll, Orser and Nicks

  3. #18
    Outdated Old Dinosaur
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    I happen to like Marina's "recycled" choreography... if that's what it is.

    However, if the top 2 teams retire after Sochi as expected, Shpilband's camp could begin to sweep medal stands again.

  4. #19
    Custom Title merrywidow's Avatar
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    Singles:Carroll, Nicks, Orser, Mishin & Sato. Interesting I chose all male coaches?
    Pairs: Moskvina
    Dance: Shpilband

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    Isn't it great that Orser has become one of the best coaches?
    This reminds me: he stepped up as a named coach only after Yuna. His interests were kids, amateurs, and leisure skaters, and Yuna crew spent a long time persuading him to be her (an elite skater's) coach. I guess she changed his likes on coaching competitive skaters. Although Orser was unnamed partly by his choice, his career and connections (besides fair coaching style & commitment) definitely made it easier for his coaching fame once he became confident.

    On the same note, I wonder how many unnamed talented coaches are out there that weren't lucky enough to coach a (potential) celebrity skater. Many should be glad to be recognized, but don't have the resources, opportunities, vigour, or sadly, talents - all four are needed in becoming recognized in any field. Also, sometimes, certain styles are inadequate for beginners but good on elites, but often the effect unknown even to oneself before tried; and one often must prove with a random baby who will by miracle continue working with the coach into seniors after realizing his/her talent. I assume quite a few, but who knows unless we've gone through each, if they indeed are just unlucky or not?

    Skaters with serious potentials choose to work with tried-and-proven ones; the more skaters a coach tries, the better he/she becomes at it; it takes one success to advance. No one can or should risk a serious skater to an uninsured choice, but at the same time, I really wanna see more than a handful of named & talented coaches managing the elite skater pool; I'm no mess seeker, but do want more competition than that. Dilemmas.

  6. #21
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    This brings up the interesting question of how coaches break into the field and move up. Someone like Orser had an unusual amount of luck: YuNa pulled him up the ladder quite a few rungs by "proposing" to him and then becoming one of the best skaters ever. What he gave her was impressive, but she also advanced his career with some uncanny idea that this was the coach who would get her through the Olympics.

    Sato and Dunjen are also relatively new coaches, though I gather that Dunjen became a coach before Yuka did. (In fact, he coached Yuka.) I'm sure her record as a world champion, and maybe her father's position in the coaching world, were great selling points that made her attractive to skaters.

    As for coaches who made it to the top ranks because (as bebevia says) they had a "random baby" who remained with them even when great talent revealed itself, I'd put Robin Wagner (Sarah Hughes' coach but not, interestingly, Emily's) and Linda Leaver, who coached no one else but Brian Boitano from his childhood through his pro career.

  7. #22
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    I do wonder how much the "Closed to the General Public" aspect of the Cricket Club appealed to Yu Na, who was suffereing from too many camera people and too many fans following her every move, and the fact that her choreographer David Wilson liked to work there. That may have been more important to her than Orser's coaching qualifications

  8. #23
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    Thanks, Doris; that answers a question I had had all along--namely, did YuNa choose David Wilson before she chose Brian. However it came to be, the relationship between YuNa and Brian proved fruitful for both of them, until 2010 at least.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    This brings up the interesting question of how coaches break into the field and move up. Someone like Orser had an unusual amount of luck: YuNa pulled him up the ladder quite a few rungs by "proposing" to him and then becoming one of the best skaters ever. What he gave her was impressive, but she also advanced his career with some uncanny idea that this was the coach who would get her through the Olympics.

    Sato and Dunjen are also relatively new coaches, though I gather that Dunjen became a coach before Yuka did. (In fact, he coached Yuka.) I'm sure her record as a world champion, and maybe her father's position in the coaching world, were great selling points that made her attractive to skaters.

    As for coaches who made it to the top ranks because (as bebevia says) they had a "random baby" who remained with them even when great talent revealed itself, I'd put Robin Wagner (Sarah Hughes' coach but not, interestingly, Emily's) and Linda Leaver, who coached no one else but Brian Boitano from his childhood through his pro career.
    I know this will sound mean... and I really don't intend it to be overly snarky, but Dunjen and Sato need to add a sports psychologist to their coaching staff.

    They seem to coach beautiful skaters who lack something in the mental toughness department. The talent's there... just not the grit.

  10. #25
    Medalist Willemijn's Avatar
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    What are the qualities of a good coach? I think that one of them is the ability to stay with a skater in good and bad times. Another is to divide your attention to your students and don't pay more attention to the ones with better results than the one who are not medalling. When I read interviews and skating news it strikes me that good skaters, like Fernandez and Amodio, leave Morozov accusing him of lack of attention. He focused on Amodio after his European victory and invited Takahashi to become his student again when he noticed that Amodio didn't make progress to the world podium. Therefore my question, is Morozov really a good coach? Apart from that I think that every skater would benefit from one year with Morozov to work on performing skills/expression...

  11. #26
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    Singles: Mr Sato, Manon Perron, Tarasova

    Pairs: Moskvina

    Dance: Shpilband


    Can we have a thread of who we think is the worst

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    I do wonder how much the "Closed to the General Public" aspect of the Cricket Club appealed to Yu Na, who was suffereing from too many camera people and too many fans following her every move, and the fact that her choreographer David Wilson liked to work there. That may have been more important to her than Orser's coaching qualifications
    Which one is more important and critical to a skater? A choreograper or a coach?

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    Which one is more important and critical to a skater? A choreograper or a coach?
    I may not have an answer, but I can recognize a good question when I see it...

    I look forward to responses to this...

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Willemijn View Post
    What are the qualities of a good coach? I think that one of them is the ability to stay with a skater in good and bad times. Another is to divide your attention to your students and don't pay more attention to the ones with better results than the one who are not medalling. When I read interviews and skating news it strikes me that good skaters, like Fernandez and Amodio, leave Morozov accusing him of lack of attention. He focused on Amodio after his European victory and invited Takahashi to become his student again when he noticed that Amodio didn't make progress to the world podium. Therefore my question, is Morozov really a good coach? Apart from that I think that every skater would benefit from one year with Morozov to work on performing skills/expression...
    It will be really interesting to see how Amodio develops after leaving Morozov. I always sensed that he was an amazing skater held back and imprisoned creatively by really awful choreography (done by Morozov). There was no way he was going to rise above a certain level if he stayed with Morozov. But one thing I noticed about Amodio was that he seemed to be very loyal to Morozov (at least until he announced his departure). My feeling is that he has the potential to be a better skater and rise to a higher level than he has yet achieved.

    Morozov is a person who comes off as quite a colorful character in his public persona but it does not seem, to me, to be a balanced one. He takes skaters up to a really high level, adding something wonderful at first, but it seems then that everything inevitably becomes unhinged.

    I can't help but think that Florent Amodio would have done so much better (like Fernandez has) under a more stable coach like Orser or Carroll (both of whom I think are a better class of coach than Morozov).

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    Which one is more important and critical to a skater? A choreograper or a coach?
    ...Mommy or daddy? Lol.

    Well, if you are established and actually manage one or the other, I guess none. No-coach is often damaging while no-choreo settles relatively safer than that. The fact is, techniques need a live third-eye to polish, while choreography is time consuming prior to polish. Elite competitive skaters should have no time to risk either. Then again, if one's techniques are habitually engraved, it could go great (not as perfect) alone for some time.

    The difference with skating is that you can actually choose your mommy and daddy, and not feel guilty to evaluate and seek anew. Ain't that something. :D

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