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Thread: Mao's new SP!!

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by babyalligator View Post
    The way os168 describes the music makes the task sound daunting, but ultimately, what I believe she is talking about, is whether or not the skater in question understands what he or she is skating to. Does the skater have an understanding of the music, what its context is, what it is meant to convey. All that should translate into a skater's performance, enabling him or her to better connect to the music and the audience. And she's right. Chopin is anything but emotionally disconnected.
    In the clips I've seen of her skating this program at her ice shows, Mao seemed to have no problem connecting to the music and audience.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by chloepoco View Post
    In the clips I've seen of her skating this program at her ice shows, Mao seemed to have no problem connecting to the music and audience.
    I don't think the problem here is Mao's connection with the music. She connects beautifully with the mood of the music. It's just that the choreography of her program isn't matched to the music and could be fitted to nearly any lyrical, subtly emotive piece that grows in quiet but intense emotion. This lack of choreographic match-up, however, does have some level of impact on Mao's perceived (or even actual) ability to connect with the specific nocturne she is skating to, for reasons os168 notes. Even if Mao still captures the general atmosphere of the piece and skates like a dream (and I am a Mao fan), it means that it just becomes a nice program that Mao skated beautifully - a memorable skate - rather than a masterpiece of a program. For a skater as gifted as Mao I she deserves the latter rather than the former.

  3. #63
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by os168 View Post
    Oh please... it is one thing to mock my music interpretation and analysis of the music...
    No, no. I was praising your analysis of the music. I just don't think any mere ice skater can skate up to it.

  4. #64
    Outdated Old Dinosaur
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    Good grief.

    We make things so complicated, and then wonder why the sport is losing popularity in some places.

    It's a pretty piece of music, and she looks pretty skating to it.

    It has some emotional impact for many viewers. The program is not complete. It's a work in progress.

  5. #65
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Welcome, rcelaya4, thanks for posting. I love it, too.

    But then again, I am one of the few people who liked her "I got rhythm" last year, so what do I know.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    But then again, I am one of the few people who liked her "I got rhythm" last year, so what do I know.
    Funny, so did I. Maybe that means we have no taste (or something).

    Quote Originally Posted by TontoK View Post
    Good grief.

    We make things so complicated, and then wonder why the sport is losing popularity in some places.

    It's a pretty piece of music, and she looks pretty skating to it.

    It has some emotional impact for many viewers. The program is not complete. It's a work in progress.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orange Cat View Post
    Even if Mao still captures the general atmosphere of the piece and skates like a dream (and I am a Mao fan), it means that it just becomes a nice program that Mao skated beautifully - a memorable skate - rather than a masterpiece of a program. For a skater as gifted as Mao I she deserves the latter rather than the former.
    This is how I feel too. A skater of her caliber deserves better than what looks like a generic pretty skater program--especially in an Olympic year. You could stick any soft music in there and it wouldn't make a difference, but it should.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by babyalligator View Post
    This is how I feel too. A skater of her caliber deserves better than what looks like a generic pretty skater program--especially in an Olympic year. You could stick any soft music in there and it wouldn't make a difference, but it should.
    Shouldn't we all just be relieved it's not Masquerade Waltz? At least she chose to bring back her Chopin program...

    Mao had much better programs under Lori Nichol than Tarasova. Her original Chopin and Lieberstraume programs were beautiful and exquisite choreographically. Even Mao's fun program "I've got Rythym" was choreographed by Nichol. Tarasova's programs for her have been a mixed bag. She just seems to insist on heavy Russian music.

  9. #69
    Custom Title mary01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orange Cat View Post
    I don't think the problem here is Mao's connection with the music. She connects beautifully with the mood of the music. It's just that the choreography of her program isn't matched to the music and could be fitted to nearly any lyrical, subtly emotive piece that grows in quiet but intense emotion. This lack of choreographic match-up, however, does have some level of impact on Mao's perceived (or even actual) ability to connect with the specific nocturne she is skating to, for reasons os168 notes. Even if Mao still captures the general atmosphere of the piece and skates like a dream (and I am a Mao fan), it means that it just becomes a nice program that Mao skated beautifully - a memorable skate - rather than a masterpiece of a program. For a skater as gifted as Mao I she deserves the latter rather than the former.
    one of the thing I love about Mao is that, you can give her anything to perform to, and she will make it memorable. it's funny hearing you talk about lack of connection, because Mao hit every note and she interpreted every note in the music. There were so many new moves, which i have never seen before. I also love that they kept the original music and didn't mix it with something else just to create a (bigger) highlight that's easier for the viewer to understand.

    The music alone doesn't give a big impact, but when put together with her skating, it magic! I have watched her performance everyday and I still notice new things, and everytime I rewatched it I get a new wider understanding of it.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krislite View Post
    Shouldn't we all just be relieved it's not Masquerade Waltz? At least she chose to bring back her Chopin program...

    Mao had much better programs under Lori Nichol than Tarasova. Her original Chopin and Lieberstraume programs were beautiful and exquisite choreographically. Even Mao's fun program "I've got Rythym" was choreographed by Nichol. Tarasova's programs for her have been a mixed bag. She just seems to insist on heavy Russian music.
    You said it! First of all, I think Lori Nichol is a choreographer of unusual lightness and subtlety, and a lyrical skater like Mao is ideal for her particular gifts. Also, I'm always surprised that Tarasova, who has the whole of Russian music at her fingertips, tends to choose such familiar pieces for her skaters. Even if she restricted herself just to two composers, Rachmaninoff and Rimsky-Korsakov, she could create programs that would transfix audiences without ever going near the Second Piano Concerto, Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini, or Scheherazade. Of course, this SP is not Russian music, but it just seems as if Tarasova goes for the obvious in both movements and melodies. She certainly has one of the best track records in skating--in three different disciplines, everything except pairs, she's coached people to an OGM. But I'd love to see her widen the horizons in terms of music choice and choreography.

  11. #71
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    Personally I think some of you guys are over-analyzing this WAY too much. It was a musical choice that was personal to her, and she's already mentioned in the press many a time that she wants to give the best performance she can at Sochi with a program that would serve as a culmination of her career. It's fair enough to have an opinion, but its incredibly rude to assume that the great Mao Asada just dilly dallied with her choices as if they were nothing and decided to go for something easy to end her career. We know Asada is lyrical and nuanced, hence why Chopin was the perfect choice. Personally, I wanted Ballade no.1 but Nocturne a great piece too- and one with a clear sentimental value. Let's not invalidate these skaters' choices as if they don't know what they are doing. They are the ones doing the skating, and they are certainly not skating for us- so if you don't like it, or if you think it's some heinous mismatch, tough.

    I stand firmly with my opinion- this is Olympic calibre. She doesn't need big bang music, a kilo of sequins and a bang-bang Big Spender routine to win. This Nocturne IMO could have saved her in Vancouver.

    Also, to that person who said she should perform better for the audience in Osaka? As far as I am concerned, that exhibition (with the long sleeved dress) was the first time she performed her new SP in public. Under show light. on a non-competitive sized rink. With a triple axel. The Japanese public would pay hard earned money to see whatever Asada does and the fact that she gave them a first showing of her competitive program complete with an attempt at her signature jump was more than what they could have hoped for on a show setting. Did she cop out and doubled everything? No. Considering her circumstances and her tendency to start slow in the season, this was the best she could have performed.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    You said it! First of all, I think Lori Nichol is a choreographer of unusual lightness and subtlety, and a lyrical skater like Mao is ideal for her particular gifts. Also, I'm always surprised that Tarasova, who has the whole of Russian music at her fingertips, tends to choose such familiar pieces for her skaters. Even if she restricted herself just to two composers, Rachmaninoff and Rimsky-Korsakov, she could create programs that would transfix audiences without ever going near the Second Piano Concerto, Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini, or Scheherazade. Of course, this SP is not Russian music, but it just seems as if Tarasova goes for the obvious in both movements and melodies. She certainly has one of the best track records in skating--in three different disciplines, everything except pairs, she's coached people to an OGM. But I'd love to see her widen the horizons in terms of music choice and choreography.
    I think that's true for her competitive programs by TAT. But TAT has chosen lesser used and more interesting pieces for Mao's exhibition programs. Por Una Cabeza and Chopin Ballade are examples of programs that highlighted all of Mao's strengths while bringing out different sides of her. In contrast, Lori tends to choose pieces that work best for her style, which is why they are usually more pleasant but also there is less risk involved. I wasn't too enthused when I first heard they were bringing back the Nocturne SP because the original version was very memorable and there are 20 other pieces to choose from Chopin's nocturnes. Although I am pleased by the new version, I still wish they could have chosen a different nocturne. Nocturne op 27 or Nocturne op 48 would have been especially good.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheCzar View Post
    Personally I think some of you guys are over-analyzing this WAY too much. It was a musical choice that was personal to her, and she's already mentioned in the press many a time that she wants to give the best performance she can at Sochi with a program that would serve as a culmination of her career. It's fair enough to have an opinion, but its incredibly rude to assume that the great Mao Asada just dilly dallied with her choices as if they were nothing and decided to go for something easy to end her career. We know Asada is lyrical and nuanced, hence why Chopin was the perfect choice. Personally, I wanted Ballade no.1 but Nocturne a great piece too- and one with a clear sentimental value. Let's not invalidate these skaters' choices as if they don't know what they are doing. They are the ones doing the skating, and they are certainly not skating for us- so if you don't like it, or if you think it's some heinous mismatch, tough.

    I stand firmly with my opinion- this is Olympic calibre. This Nocturne IMO could have saved her in Vancouver.

    THIS. And as I read the comments of the nay sayers, they sure have expectations for Mao in a competitive program. I do wonder do you have the same expectations for your favorite skater. Some people here are asking for something that no one has done in a competition. But then I realized for some people Mao could be 100% perfect and they would still find something to complain about.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by miki88 View Post
    Although I am pleased by the new version, I still wish they could have chosen a different nocturne. Nocturne op 27 or Nocturne op 48 would have been especially good.
    1 or 2? I would love to see her skate to no.1 one day. It would certainly be a challenge for anyone, but I think she could manage it.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    But then again, I am one of the few people who liked her "I got rhythm" last year, so what do I know.
    Quote Originally Posted by aftertherain View Post
    Funny, so did I. Maybe that means we have no taste (or something).
    Me, Three!
    As for the comment that TAT did not give Mao good competitive programs, I happen to really love her 2007-08 season's SP by Madame Tarasova. ...since I have no taste in figure skating, either, I guess. Her step sequence is just to die for me. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1GfZW03lM4

    Go Mao!

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