Gracie Gold is without coach

Sk8Boi · Sep 19, 2013

If Gracie's own words during interviews are to be believed, it appears that all this happened because she has become so full of herself that she was no longer coachable by her staff, at least in a way that would bring her Olympic and World success.

She stated she feels she is a magnificent jumper and just needs to "pull it all together..." So, Gracie thinks she knows what is best for her, but obviously she is dead wrong, as she presented totally nasty and craptastic programs for the season with ugly choreography and ugly costumes at the recent International B. BTW, she lost. By. A. LOT.

IMHO, it looks like Gracie Gold is self-destructing due to buying into the hype and losing her humility, that is what the problem is right now.

With 4 months to the Olympics, what a disaster of planning this appears to have been, IMHO driven in part by an amazingly immature girl's view of herself. This is not a rant, but my HO about what has transpired.

Mrs. P · Sep 19, 2013

Sk8Boi said:
If Gracie's own words during interviews are to be believed, it appears that all this happened because she has become so full of herself that she was no longer coachable by her staff, at least in a way that would bring her Olympic and World success.

She stated she feels she is a magnificent jumper and just needs to "pull it all together..." So, Gracie thinks she knows what is best for her, but obviously she is dead wrong, as she presented totally nasty and craptastic programs for the season with ugly choreography and ugly costumes at the recent International B. BTW, she lost. By. A. LOT.

IMHO, it looks like Gracie Gold is self-destructing due to buying into the hype and losing her humility, that is what the problem is right now.

With 4 months to the Olympics, what a disaster of planning this appears to have been, IMHO driven in part by an amazingly immature girl's view of herself. This is not a rant, but my HO about what has transpired.

I don't agree with that at all. I think we view Gracie's words differently. Can you point to examples where you feel she's "buying into the hype and losing humility?"

In the end, there's a lot we don't know and that's why I am not quick to say this was a case of Gracie being a diva or whatever. I really think there were some tough decisions that had to be made, that's all.

ice coverage · Sep 19, 2013

Mrs. P said:
Well, the whole situation wouldn't have been out in the open if a certain catty duo *ahem TSL ahem* tweeted about several weeks ago and then carelessly tweeted all this "Hope Frank Carroll fixes this for Gracie" teaser tweets during SLC Senior B.

Carelessly? I don't think so. Stirring the pot seems to be one of TSL's specialties.

Mrs. P · Sep 19, 2013

golden411 said:
Carelessly? I don't think so. Stirring the pot seems to be one of TSL's specialties.

That may be, but they were certainly careless with the information.

As I said before, there's nothing wrong with trying to scoop the USFSA, but there's a way to do it without "causing harm," a key tenant in the Society of Professional Journalists' Code of Ethics. Not only that they were completely inaccurate too. The change to Frank was NOT a done deal and they tweeted like it was.

Tonichelle · Sep 19, 2013

Mrs. P said:
That may be, but they were certainly careless with the information.

As I said before, there's nothing wrong with trying to scoop the USFSA, but there's a way to do it without "causing harm," a key tenant in the Society of Professional Journalists' Code of Ethics.

TSL are not journalists - even if she did go to school for it and has student loans to show for it. Their disregard for professionalism in their vids and blogs and whatnot have proven that. The USFSA should've just come out and said it instead of beating around the bush over the SLC credential. (Which TSL's continued childish behavior over that turned me completely off to their site.)

ice coverage · Sep 19, 2013

Mrs. P said:
That may be, but they were certainly careless with the information.

As I said before, there's nothing wrong with trying to scoop the USFSA, but there's a way to do it without "causing harm," a key tenant in the Society of Professional Journalists' Code of Ethics.

I think you and I mostly are on the same page.

What I mean is that I think TSL in fact took great care to ensure that they would stir up lots of further speculation with their quasi-cryptic tweets and comments.
I don't think that they accidentally forgot that their audience was supposed to be in the dark.

Like others, I have found that some of TSL's interviews are worthy of their name -- and provide a substantive (and un-gossipy) lesson in how skaters create, train, compete, evolve, etc. I do appreciate that side of their content.
But their gossipy side is incorrigible.

Mrs. P · Sep 19, 2013

golden411 said:
I think you and I mostly are on the same page.

What I mean is that I think TSL in fact took great care to ensure that they would stir up lots of further speculation with their quasi-cryptic tweets and comments.
I don't think that they accidentally forgot that their audience was supposed to be in the dark.

Oh, I know we're on the same page. But yeah, I agree that they were trying to get their audience salivating. I'm just saying that it had done a lot of harm and I'm surprised that Jenny Kirk would not only allow it but downright mock Gracie for her poor performance. Jenny has had her share of bad performances and I think some of them were likely under the cloud of the issues she's talked about in the past, i.e. eating disorder, issues with coaches, the death of her mother. The lack of compassion on her part is a bit disconcerting. Sure, you can argue that Dave is likely the one tweeting those things, but she's under the TSL umbrella, so what he says reflects on her too.

Tonichelle said:
TSL are not journalists - even if she did go to school for it and has student loans to show for it. Their disregard for professionalism in their vids and blogs and whatnot have proven that. The USFSA should've just come out and said it instead of beating around the bush over the SLC credential. (Which TSL's continued childish behavior over that turned me completely off to their site.)

Yes, I agree that USFSA should have been straight forward. And I also agree that their behavior has turned me off to their site. I'd rather support things like Manleywoman podcast. Allison Manley has done the interview podcast LONG before TSL and without the childish snark. (Her interview with Kori Ade is one of my faves).

ETA: That's not to say I don't think TSL has done good interviews, there's a few I've enjoyed, in particular the ones with Mary Beth Marley and Ashley Wagner. But I really feel the other stuff, i.e. the tweets and the gossip session videos, really dilute the power of those interviews.

Mathman · Sep 19, 2013

Tonichelle said:
... and has student loans to show for it.

ice coverage · Sep 19, 2013

Mrs. P said:
The lack of compassion on her part is a bit disconcerting. ...

That's not to say I don't think TSL has done good interviews, there's a few I've enjoyed, in particular the ones with Mary Beth Marley and Ashley Wagner. But I really feel the other stuff, i.e. the tweets and the gossip session videos, really dilute the power of those interviews.

Very well said about the snarky stuff diminishing their work as interviewers. :agree:
[I too sometimes have wondered how a younger Jenny Kirk would have felt to be on the receiving end of some of TSL's snark. :eek:

hwell:]

ETA:

And sorry, Mrs. P ... I'm with you now on "careless:" you meant in the sense of "rude/thoughtless" -- which had not crossed my mind previously. I had been thinking of "careless" as the opposite of "careful." My apologies.

ETA, I keep forgetting to say:

However Gracie's situation is resolved, I hope that the outcome is the best-case scenario for Carly as well. As much as they are deeply supportive of each other, it can't be easy to have one's own future determined by what is most advantageous for your twin. I realize that being Gracie's sister has given Carly an opportunity to share some exciting experiences and "perks" -- but I suppose it is too much to hope that Carly and Frank Carroll also are trying each other out before both Golds make a permanent commitment to working with him and vice versa.

mskater93 · Sep 19, 2013

Mrs. P said:
I won't speak for mskater93, but I don't think it's a paradox to say that a coach was right for a given skater in the past but not now. Things happen. Things may have changed that may have made the relationship no longer viable.

That is exactly the case. As stakes raise, things change and dynamics that were good become no longer good...

aftertherain · Sep 19, 2013

Mrs. P said:
Oh, I know we're on the same page. But yeah, I agree that they were trying to get their audience salivating. I'm just saying that it had done a lot of harm and I'm surprised that Jenny Kirk would not only allow it but downright mock Gracie for her poor performance.

Really? When was this?

FlattFan · Sep 19, 2013

Mrs. P said:
I don't agree with that at all. I think we view Gracie's words differently. Can you point to examples where you feel she's "buying into the hype and losing humility?"

Last year, didn't she say Ashley deserved to be on the same podium with her or something like that. I'm paraphrasing.
This girl knows she's good. We know she's good. The problem is, she's not exactly consistent, but she thinks she can pull out 7 triples LP any day (the things that made her good) so she thinks she's better than what she actually is.

Her PCS score is a joke! I would give her 7.5 for SS, 7 for TR, the rest should never crack 5 even on a good day. Bad day, how about 2 for the catastrophe she put out last weekend?

Mrs. P · Sep 19, 2013

FlattFan said:
Last year, didn't she say Ashley deserved to be on the same podium with her or something like that. I'm paraphrasing.
This girl knows she's good. We know she's good. The problem is, she's not exactly consistent, but she thinks she can pull out 7 triples LP any day (the things that made her good) so she thinks she's better than what she actually is.

Her PCS score is a joke! I would give her 7.5 for SS, 7 for TR, the rest should never crack 5 even on a good day. Bad day, how about 2 for the catastrophe she put out last weekend?

Can you give a link or something? I read the articles pretty thoroughly and I don't remember reading that. Or was a it a tweet?

FlattFan · Sep 19, 2013

Seems like Mrs. P selectively remember things and selectively pick up things. This girl is only very good when she's doing 7 triples LP. If her jumps are missing, she's one of the worst skaters when it comes to choreography, program, interpretation, execution. Nothing special without the jumps.

I cheer for her when she does well, I just hate it when she's rewarded for some of the worst programs ever. If she's a skating island, then no problem. The problem is Angela, Courtney, Caroline, Samantha, and a bunch of other sad girls are not given the opportunity at the expense of this girl. Are you kidding me?

Mrs. P · Sep 19, 2013

aftertherain said:
Really? When was this?

I'm guess I'm talking more a general tone.

I just feel like the tweets analyze everything they hate about her program and how Frank needs to fix this or that. They did tweet a few reasonable things like when she jump a a good 3-3 or something, but again the snark really offsets that. They also retweeted a lot of other people's about Gracie's hair or "ugly costumes." or windmill arms.

You can say "That was a terrible program" without being snarky about it.

Mrs. P · Sep 19, 2013

FlattFan said:
Seems like Mrs. P selectively remember things and selectively pick up things. This girl is only very good when she's doing 7 triples LP. If her jumps are missing, she's one of the worst skaters when it comes to choreography, program, interpretation, execution. Nothing special without the jumps.

I cheer for her when she does well, I just hate it when she's rewarded for some of the worst programs ever. If she's a skating island, then no problem. The problem is Angela, Courtney, Caroline, Samantha, and a bunch of other sad girls are not given the opportunity at the expense of this girl. Are you kidding me?

Can you give me an example of when one of the other girls was deprived of an opportunity because of Gracie skating a poor program and getting held up for it? Can you give me a link that quotes Gracie saying that Ashley didn't deserve to be on the podium with her? I'm not selectively remembering things, I'm asking for a link. Examples.

Also I don't agree that she doesn't have anything but jumps. I have pointed in several threads that Graice got six elements in her LP with +GOE of 1.00 or higher. Five of those six elements were for non-jump elements. She may not have great choreography, execution, but to say she has nothing but jumps is just not true.

FlattFan · Sep 19, 2013

Mrs. P said:
Can you give me an example of when one of the other girls was deprived of an opportunity because of Gracie skating a poor program and getting held up for it? Can you give me a link that quotes Gracie saying that Ashley didn't deserve to be on the podium with her? I'm not selectively remembering things, I'm asking for a link. Examples. That's not an unreasonable request.

Samantha last weekend should beat her by 10 points in PCS. That's an example.
They will be deprived this coming National.

About the other one, she was quoted saying congrats to the other two medalists, they deserved to be on the podium with me. I certainly don't keep these article around and find these links for you.

aftertherain · Sep 19, 2013

Mrs. P said:
Can you give a link or something? I read the articles pretty thoroughly and I don't remember reading that. Or was a it a tweet?

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...sion-us-figure-skating-championships/1868265/

^ Honestly, I think people looked waaaay too much into this. Eh, whatever. I think I'll leave this thread now.

And I hope Gracie stays away from the internet. Can't be doing her already frayed nerves by reading what other people "speculate" about her.

Also, even if TSL didn't say anything, I'm quite sure there would still be many who were ready to pounce on Gracie's mistakes/missteps. It's like Ashley said in her own TSL interview---there are always those people who will certain skaters to do badly---perhaps just for the sake of it.

Mrs. P · Sep 19, 2013

aftertherain said:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...sion-us-figure-skating-championships/1868265/

^ Honestly, I think people looked waaaay too much into this. Eh, whatever. I think I'll leave this thread now.

And I hope Gracie stays away from the internet. Can't be doing her already frayed nerves by reading what other people "speculate" about her.

Also, even if TSL didn't say anything, I'm quite sure there would still be many who were ready to pounce on Gracie's mistakes/missteps. It's like Ashley said in her own TSL interview---there are always those people who will certain skaters to do badly---perhaps just for the sake of it.

Thank for the link, ATR.

Yeah, I remember that story now. Yeah, I didn't see anything specifically egotistical in that quote, rather that they deserved to be on the podium, just as she did. However, YMMV.

And she did say the following before that: "I just want to congratulate these other two women because they are amazing and they push me," she said.

Clearly she sees the value of her competitors.

I think I'll follow ATR on the way out.

FlattFan · Sep 19, 2013

^^ So you excused her "they deserved to be on the podium with me" nonsense, but you guessed your general feeling that TSL mocked Gracie.
Who talks like this? They deserved to be on the podium with me?

If you ask any logical person what does she mean by that, they will tell you she meant exactly what you don't want to hear.

Anyway, whatever. I thought she deserved to beat Ashley last year, but the way the Federation is pushing, they are turning this girl into a monster. Sad because I thought she had a lot of potential, and was rather likable young girl.

Now, the "haters" tweet, and the attitude, such a big turn off.

Gracie Gold is without coach

Sk8Boi

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