Page 14 of 17 FirstFirst ... 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 LastLast
Results 196 to 210 of 254

Thread: Can Yuzuru Hanyu close the gap on Patrick Chan?

  1. #196
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    991
    Quote Originally Posted by Kalina View Post
    If GOE is objective, then PCS must be objective as well, it's the same judges after all right? So this means that I can start believing that Yuzuru's skating skills ARE actually better than Kozuka's. Right.

    Or that Yuzuru's 3A-2T in the free is actually not so special after all, since Skate Canada's judges seemed to think it warranted a meager +0.57 GOE. No matter that commentators have been raving about it and fellow skater Jeremy Ten went so far as to describe it as 'godly'.
    Kozuka is the #5 man of Japan. He is clearly inferior to Hanyu.

    Skate Canada judges are typically home biased. Only +0.57 for Hanyu's 3A-2T which no one else can do. They were so much afraid of Hanyu's talent and wanted to downplay. OTOH, the judges at GPF gave +1.71 to Chan's ugly 3A. Actually his scores are more generous than TEB. In terms of TES, Hanyu will beat Chan anywhere but in Canada with just about same margins. They had so much trust in Hanyu and didn't need to hold down Chan's score.

  2. #197
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    4,943
    Quote Originally Posted by sky_fly20 View Post
    Yuzu also has another lucky charm
    Russian soil is very lucky for him
    It's also lucky for Chan, having won COR there last year with one of his highest scoring LPs and having won his first Worlds in Moscow.

  3. #198
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    4,943
    Another reason not to call Hanyu the number 1 guy: in the FS he's only successfully done 1/6 clean quad attempts on the GP circuit/GPF this season. Both quads having problems at Skate Canada (1 touchdown, 1 fall), both quads missed at TEB (1 popped, 1 fall). One quad missed at GPF (1 fall).

    He's fell in every FS this season so calling him the number 1 guy isn't accurate... I guess he's the number 1 guy if he skates totally clean (which we have yet to see in his FS) or if Chan makes errors like at the GPF. But there's no question that Chan is still the one to beat if Hanyu currently has to rely on Chan making errors and Japanese home ice to place ahead of him.

    He's certainly closed the gap though, even if he hasn't skated perfectly.

  4. #199
    Custom Title skateluvr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,589
    He has shown he can win when skating near his best, and if Chan makes errors. It was nice to see Hanyu do that well. And I hope it makes pat realize that he may not have it in the bag at Olympics. But Olys are in Russia, not Japan. Kovtun or Plushenko may surprise-I am glad to see the mens comp. is not a done deal. I do not think the Oly judges would pull a victory for Chan against a Japanese who skates lights out. Denis Ten is from ? where? ( I know where-no fed is my point). But Patrick can be outskated on any given night by a few Japanese men, Kovtun, Javi. If the judging is fair, Patrick may earn silver or bronze. I don't think he'll finish lower than bronze even if he Zambonis the ice and others skate 5 quads. But he was beaten at the GP final. Olympics will be judged harshly, aand he must really earn it with his jumps, not just skating skills PCS.

    I hope for steady nerves, as we could see the best mens event ever.

  5. #200
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    4,943
    Quote Originally Posted by skateluvr View Post
    He has shown he can win when skating near his best, and if Chan makes errors. It was nice to see Hanyu do that well. And I hope it makes pat realize that he may not have it in the bag at Olympics. But Olys are in Russia, not Japan. Kovtun or Plushenko may surprise-I am glad to see the mens comp. is not a done deal. I do not think the Oly judges would pull a victory for Chan against a Japanese who skates lights out. Denis Ten is from ? where? ( I know where-no fed is my point). But Patrick can be outskated on any given night by a few Japanese men, Kovtun, Javi. If the judging is fair, Patrick may earn silver or bronze. I don't think he'll finish lower than bronze even if he Zambonis the ice and others skate 5 quads. But he was beaten at the GP final. Olympics will be judged harshly, aand he must really earn it with his jumps, not just skating skills PCS.

    I hope for steady nerves, as we could see the best mens event ever.
    I think it could indeed be the best event ever, with many men attempting at least 2 quads and some with 3 quads. Hanyu really has the potential to have the most technically demanding Olympic FS ever, but that 4S has so far failed him this whole season (other than the one he managed to squeak out at Finlandia). Hopefully the GPF win improves his confidence, but that clean skate is something Hanyu still has yet to attain. Chan's camp really should continue to do what they've been doing, maintain a clean competition, with the likelihood of Hanyu making an error in one of his opening quads. If Hanyu goes clean in Sochi, I would imagine he scores above a clean Chan overall due to the technical advantage, but I would hope that if Hanyu falls (or Chan or whoever), they are placed behind a cleaner skater. It's been a while since an Olympic champion hasn't gone clean, although the difficulty has certainly progressed to unprecedented levels.

  6. #201
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    224
    I'm a fan of Yuzuru, and to be honest I don't think the situation has changed much in terms of who is the clear favourite going to the Olympics -- it's still Patrick, just like it was last month, and last season as well. He still has the highest likelihood of making it, the judges like him, he seems to be skating more consistently than ever, has previous Olympic experience. It's all there.
    What I do think is that if Yuzuru happened to skate completely clean in both programs,
    1. He would receive PCS similar to those received at GPF, if not higher (for a clean free) and
    2. His TES could very well be enough to surpass the PCS difference he would have with a clean Chan.
    This doesn't mean that I think Yuzuru has high chances of accomplishing this, obviously. He seems to be having a change of attitude as of late, regarding to how he approaches competition, so we'll see at Nationals what happens.

  7. #202
    Custom Title EricRohmer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    206
    Watching this all, I think again JSF is smart.
    Taking the GPF in Olympic season into Japan soil.
    I am sure that 17GPF too will be held in Japan like 05GPF, 09GPF, 13GPF.

  8. #203
    Custom Title spikydurian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    978
    Quote Originally Posted by NMURA View Post
    Kozuka is the #5 man of Japan. He is clearly inferior to Hanyu.
    Kozuka is NOT inferior to Hanyu. He just didn't have the consistent big jumps (quads) much like Daisuke.

  9. #204
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    4,943
    Quote Originally Posted by spikydurian View Post
    Kozuka is NOT inferior to Hanyu. He just didn't have the consistent big jumps (quads) much like Daisuke.
    Overall I disagree but Kozuka's actually skating itself is undeniably more refined than Hanyu.

  10. #205
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    208
    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    Another reason not to call Hanyu the number 1 guy: in the FS he's only successfully done 1/6 clean quad attempts on the GP circuit/GPF this season. Both quads having problems at Skate Canada (1 touchdown, 1 fall), both quads missed at TEB (1 popped, 1 fall). One quad missed at GPF (1 fall).

    He's fell in every FS this season so calling him the number 1 guy isn't accurate... I guess he's the number 1 guy if he skates totally clean (which we have yet to see in his FS) or if Chan makes errors like at the GPF. But there's no question that Chan is still the one to beat if Hanyu currently has to rely on Chan making errors and Japanese home ice to place ahead of him.

    He's certainly closed the gap though, even if he hasn't skated perfectly.
    How quickly one forgets 2013 World's when Chan fell how many times? AND WON!

  11. #206
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    4,943
    I've said I disagree with Chan's 2013 worlds win.

    However there are similarities to Yuzuru's win at the GPF. Firstly, Yuzuru skated a perfect short and built a commanding lead (yes, Ten skated cleanly and had a big deficit behind Chan whereas Patrick made mistakes in the SP at the GPF, which is a notable difference). However in the free skate Yuzu had a fall but due to high BV (and smashing his personal best PCS even with a fall) he still got a high score (Chan doubling a triple also helped). At worlds Chan fell (and his PCS was dropped well below his PB) but his higher planned difficulty, and Ten doubling two triples, lead to Ten winning the LP by 5 points which was not enough to win overall.

  12. #207
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Hollywood, CA
    Posts
    3,989
    Quote Originally Posted by CanadianSkaterGuy View Post
    I've said I disagree with Chan's 2013 worlds win.
    How about his 2008 Skate Canada win, 2008 TEB win, 2010 Skate Canada win, 2011 Japan Open win, 2011 Skate Canada win, 2011 GPF win, and 2012 Worlds win? The guy has been propped up as much as an infant.

  13. #208
    Custom Title spikydurian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    978
    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    How about his 2008 Skate Canada win, 2008 TEB win, 2010 Skate Canada win, 2011 Japan Open win, 2011 Skate Canada win, 2011 GPF win, and 2012 Worlds win? The guy has been propped up as much as an infant.
    You must be wearing blinkers or consumed with jealousy. Patrick is where he is today because of his skating skills.

  14. #209
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Hollywood, CA
    Posts
    3,989
    Quote Originally Posted by spikydurian View Post
    Patrick is where he is today because of his skating skills.
    And because all the other areas of his skating are often overscored, while at the same time other competitors' are held down.

  15. #210
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    141
    I'm getting tired of the idea of this mythical "skating skills" as the end-all be-all. In terms of fast speed, big jumps with difficult entries, interesting spins, Hanyu delivered all that. If a person has the speed and control to do big tricks like a quad out of steps or 3A with a difficult entry, that also says something about their "skating skills". The ability to do big, difficult tricks and "skating skills" are related.

Page 14 of 17 FirstFirst ... 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •