Can Yuzuru Hanyu close the gap on Patrick Chan? | Page 2 | Golden Skate

Can Yuzuru Hanyu close the gap on Patrick Chan?

drivingmissdaisy

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Feb 17, 2010
Patrick isn't unbeatable, he peaked and while he holds his level quite well (which is impressive given that this level is anything but low), others have closed the gap. But for whatever reason there are still people doing this 'he will win anyway'-boo-boo-whining stuff, which the last season clearly showed isn't true. If Patrick manages to skate well, he has all the chances to win the OGM. But he is defintily not a shoe-in, not in the least.

What we learned from Worlds last year is that there are only a handful of men capable of beating him. Ten could not have skated much better and still lost, so probably Hanyu, Dai, Javier, and Evgeny make up the list of men who could beat Patrick in Sochi. If Plushenko is clean, the arena is going to erupt and his scores will be through the roof; Patrick would have to skate his best to win.
 

msteach3

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What we learned from Worlds last year is that there are only a handful of men capable of beating him. Ten could not have skated much better and still lost, so probably Hanyu, Dai, Javier, and Evgeny make up the list of men who could beat Patrick in Sochi. If Plushenko is clean, the arena is going to erupt and his scores will be through the roof; Patrick would have to skate his best to win.

I reallly don't see Plushenko as a contender. The other guys have reached his level technically and several including Hanyu execute more cleanly with better lines and flow. His body is beat up, he's old by figure skating standards, and even though the venue is Russia I doubt he can outscore the likes of Javi, Dai, Patrick, Yuzuru and possibly Ten.
 

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be
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If Plushenko skates two "perfect" programs and nobody else does, I'm pretty sure he will win. As long as he gives exciting performances like at 2012 Euros (he'll need a Quad in the SP, though).
 

Li'Kitsu

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Dec 29, 2011
drivingmissdaisy said:
What we learned from Worlds last year is that there are only a handful of men capable of beating him. Ten could not have skated much better and still lost, so probably Hanyu, Dai, Javier, and Evgeny make up the list of men who could beat Patrick in Sochi. If Plushenko is clean, the arena is going to erupt and his scores will be through the roof; Patrick would have to skate his best to win.

True, but that still means Chan isn't guaranteed the OGM. And it's been discussed to death, but for me he deserved to be placed over Ten (LP was backloaded, empty programs, he was very nervous and tight...). I'm pretty sure even though Ten is very talented, there are actually quite a few men who would beat them if they were clean - like Kozuka, Aaron, Reynolds, maybe even Amodio or Brezina...
And if Plush manages two clean skates with quads, he'll be really tough to beat :)
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Jan 25, 2013
Based on scoring, I think he can zamboni during the entirety of SP & LP and still win OGM.

I think this is just a point of view perpetuated by his critics. Clearly he's lost competitions where he has made errors across his SP and LP and lost (Skate Canada, GPF, World Team Trophy), even ones where he only fell once or twice over the course of both programs (and when those who placed higher than him have fallen, at that).

Yuzuru is still my pick for the OGM winner (even though Chan is an obvious choice). His PCS is catching up to Patrick but will not surpass him, but he does get excellent GOE on his elements and can certainly land 2 or 3 quads. Let's not forget that before Worlds, Hanyu also broke Chan's world record SP twice. The FS is his issue, but I would think that his issues would be sorted out a lot more this season. His axels are money jumps for him too. Interestingly enough, he had the highest TES in the FS of last year's Worlds.

I think a lot of people are pegging Javier to win, based on his Euro's performance, but he has yet to duplicate that. Javier also doesn't have the most consistent SP. As for Chan, he's been showing vulnerability in the past season, but still shows capability to land both quads, and needs to maintain focus in the rest of his program.
 

drivingmissdaisy

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If Plushenko skates two "perfect" programs and nobody else does, I'm pretty sure he will win. As long as he gives exciting performances like at 2012 Euros (he'll need a Quad in the SP, though).

I don't even think Plushenko has to be perfect, he just has to be cleaner than Patrick to win. I don't think people should rule him out based on previous best scores because when this event is in Russia you can throw all those out; Yuna beat her previous best by 15 points in Vancouver so if you bring it at the games you can get some great scores, particularly someone who has won OGM or OSM at the last 3 Olympics. (All this is assuming he comes with the necessary technical merit, without a quad he has no chance of gold)
 

msteach3

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If Plushenko skates two "perfect" programs and nobody else does, I'm pretty sure he will win. As long as he gives exciting performances like at 2012 Euros (he'll need a Quad in the SP, though).

Well if any of the top guys skate two perfect programs and nobody else does they'll win. :confused: The chance of Plushenko skating perfectly and everyone else faltering is about nil.
 

giulia95

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Jun 19, 2012
. Interestingly enough, he had the highest TES in the FS of last year's Worlds.

Yuzuru managed to earn 5 spots in London Worlds even if he was in a very miserable physical condition and his Notre Dame FS choreo was inadeuquate and unsuitable for him.

Nonetheless Hanyu had the highest TES in Nice Worlds , where he earned 4 spots with his epic R&J FS and grabbed the bronze medal .

We can definitely say Yuzu is a FS skater.
 

Big Deal

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Jan 23, 2004
Yuzuru is an EXCITING skater.
The excitement comes from :
1. The very high quality of his elements and the undoubtable "wow" factor.
2.His vulnerabity and not enough masculine style ( we look at him as our child, and it creates him a real supportive attitude around).

I think, when Chan is clean Hanyu is nowhere near to him.

The real question is Patrick Chan. When he has "his" day, nobody can recently catch him.
If not, at least 4 others can win and Hanyu is one of them.
 

emdee

Final Flight
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Feb 27, 2012
Yuzuru is an EXCITING skater.
The excitement comes from :
1. The very high quality of his elements and the undoubtable "wow" factor.
2.His vulnerabity and not enough masculine style ( we look at him as our child, and it creates him a real supportive attitude around).

I think, when Chan is clean Hanyu is nowhere near to him.

The real question is Patrick Chan. When he has "his" day, nobody can recently catch him.
If not, at least 4 others can win and Hanyu is one of them.

ITA.
I am a Chan fan but also love Hanyu. Hanyu's skating is exciting almost because of its wildness. Unfortunately for him it can also bring a lack of control. The complexity of Chan's skating and high level of difficulty, changing of edges etc give him the nod from the judges. He brings the 'figures' element back into figure skating but weaves this element into the intricate programs.
 

Jammers

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Hanyu still needs to figure out how to build his stamina up because the poor kid looks like he's going to collapse everytime he skates a LP.
 

wonderlen3000

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Nov 8, 2008
Well Hanyu got injured after/or before 4CC and lost time on training and it def show at world. And he has asthma, and only 18 so you cannot compare him to skater who are more senior by years like Chan. And Chan be going downhill since 2011 and men are getting notorious for triple splats as much as the ladies, so who know.
 

Jammers

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That's the huge disappointment for me. He tried to be more artistic last season but had very little improvement. In the meantime, his technics remain the same while everyone else is improving. That should have been the end of Kathy Johnson's fame. But no, he continues with this "coach" for the most important season of his skating life. I don't know what to think about him for this season anymore. We'll see. To answer the thread opener's question, yes, absolutely. Hanyu has already made the gap closer to Chan. He is capable of surpassing him this coming season too. Whether or not he will surpass Chan? We have to wait and see.
Well since Patrick is dating his coaches daughter he probably can't fire her. What was he thinking dropping a real coach like Christine Krall for someone who is NOT a real skating coach?
 

NCSkate_fan

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Aug 8, 2013
Hanyu is certainly capable of overtaking Chan. Technically I am far less nervous watching Hanyu execute a triple axel versus Chan. Artistically Hanyu is still young so a bit more refinement in his presentation along with consistency should make for an interesting showdown in Sochi should he skate clean in both programs.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Jan 25, 2013
I don't even think Plushenko has to be perfect, he just has to be cleaner than Patrick to win. I don't think people should rule him out based on previous best scores because when this event is in Russia you can throw all those out; Yuna beat her previous best by 15 points in Vancouver so if you bring it at the games you can get some great scores, particularly someone who has won OGM or OSM at the last 3 Olympics. (All this is assuming he comes with the necessary technical merit, without a quad he has no chance of gold)

I think he would have to be considerably cleaner than Patrick to win. Chan tends to get higher GOE and will certainly get higher SS and TR points. There are also a number of skaters, including Hanyu who can defeat even a perfect Plushenko. A Plushenko with 2 quads and 2 3A's will be very difficult for anyone, even Chan, to beat, though. I'm expecting bigger things from Fernandez and Hanyu. Even Ten I would expect bigger things. Obviously, we can't tell until people hit the ice. There's no telling that Chan/Yuzuru will get his act together, or if Plushenko will be able to do 2 quads again, or if Fernandez will be able to replicate his 3 quads, or if Ten can continue his success.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Hanyu is certainly capable of overtaking Chan. Technically I am far less nervous watching Hanyu execute a triple axel versus Chan. Artistically Hanyu is still young so a bit more refinement in his presentation along with consistency should make for an interesting showdown in Sochi should he skate clean in both programs.

Hanyu has the most consistent triple axel. I would trust him to land a 3A (and with +GOE) more than anyone in the men's field.
 

spikydurian

Medalist
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Jan 15, 2012
Chan already plateaued years ago, and is only going to continue declining from there (granted not much longer as he is entering his final season, so basically the question is can Hanyu catch and beat Chan next year, possibly at the Olympics, and to that I still say yes it is possible). But you can count on at least 3 mistakes by Chan every event after all.

Chan started his quads in late 2010 and his quads have become more consistent. His upper body movement has improved tremendously so to say Chan has plateaued years ago is not a fact. But of course knowing you, who has always mocked Chan, such comments are expected of you.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Jan 25, 2013
The 5 fall margin the judges still see Chan as having aside, I do think Hanyu can for one simple reason. Hanyu is still getting better while Chan already plateaued years ago, and is only going to continue declining from there (granted not much longer as he is entering his final season, so basically the question is can Hanyu catch and beat Chan next year, possibly at the Olympics, and to that I still say yes it is possible). Hanyu on his best day is now a better jumper. You can count on atleast 3 mistakes by Chan every event after all.

It's a bit up for grabs if Hanyu is a better jumper. Certainly his axels are much better but Chan's quad and ability to do quad triples gives him an edge. It's kind of a moot point to say that Chan is guaranteed three mistakes in every event when most of the field makes three mistakes on a more than nought basis.

As for Chan plateauing, the best he ever skated was the best ever skated under this system. Not to mention a world record SP last year. Yes, his consistency has declined but his overall skating and difficulty has gotten even better, and even with three falls (and not this 5 fall cushion you seem to try to consistently delude everyone into thinking he has) he is still better than most of the field. He still puts up high numbers and just because they weren't in the 280's doesn't mean he has plateaued. He's a 3-time World Champion and even with a loss to Ten he would have been the reigning world silver medallist. Hardly a huge decline on paper at least.
 
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