Ashley's R&J?! | Page 3 | Golden Skate

Ashley's R&J?!

TelmoFe

Rinkside
Joined
Oct 20, 2011
I like the program. She has a lot to improve, but it's normal. I love the final part and the end position.

Sasha's program was probably the best, but this music is very different. Nice choice.
 

w_darling

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 17, 2013
Dance of the knights is certainly the most powerful and well known piece from Prokofiev's R&J, but perhaps more suited to the role of Romeo, or Pair/Dance.

I don't know... I think even the more powerful sections of "Dance of the Knights" could fit with Juliet's character and the theme of her inner conflict and development. The heavy Capulets' theme returns at the end of the piece as Juliet sees Romeo for the first time and is obviously into him (to use modern parlance ;). Even without her knowing him to be Montague yet, I think being immediately drawn to someone else after having just danced with your intended husband would cause some pretty strong emotion. But YMMV :)

Speaking of "Dance of the Knights" though, the lighter middle section is completely centered on Juliet... but I suppose it's not as attention-grabbing as the rest of the piece.

Re: Ashley's costume, I thought it was pretty enough. I especially appreciated the beadwork in the close-ups. I do agree that a richer color might be better but I also tend to prefer darker colors in general. It's interesting though because Ashley herself had initially wanted a darker color: http://ashwagner2010.tumblr.com/post/62576342745/i-firmly-believe-that-a-costume-can-make-or-break

It seems she was (naturally) inspired by Olivia Hussey's Juliet costume which I think can be seen even in the beaded bodice and in the high waist (which I personally think looks quite flattering on Ashley) of her current costume.
 

skateluvr

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 23, 2011
The costume cut is flattering yes, but she needs a period look to be Juliet. This is a modern looking dress. Something like YuNa wore for les miz but in a teal green light velvet velour, or deep burgundy. This looks like a slip dress she could wear to a club. She needs to evoke the 14th century, and she should do her hair in a new and different style. She can have it out of her way-she should consult a really good stylist to get the right look. I'd rather see her return to black swan. Gee, I am surprised this is David Wilson...seems YuNa gets his best effort. I love Philip Mills-this is too bad they split. I'd rather see Camerlengo or Nichols do her LP.

This is very muddled-people will be confused, as I am. I much preferred Sasha, and I prefer the "warhorse" cuts, as people need to understand this is Juliet. Anyone have a link to her SP? Keep the dress for an exhibition. I hope she didn't spend a fortune on it. I know she likes to show off her arms and likes to copy MK a bit, but I really want everyone to know the music and the character from the beginning. This is her Olympic hopeful program and dress. I am underwhelmed in a huge way. She deserves better and has had much better in past. Wow, you can see she is not with Nicks/Mills anymore. Too bad.
 

tulosai

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 21, 2011
Thanks for the link to her blog. Assuming no one is helping her she's actually quite a decent writer. I wonder what she wants to do once she is done with skating.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
It is a work in progress but I admit I do not like the music cuts same with V and T same with Daisuke. I am unimpressed with the music for D and W as well. This is an olympic year too :( But it is early - of course the music or performance looks better when it is skated clean ie V and T - but look a t program with errors and then see how good it is.
 

semosk8tfan

Medalist
Joined
Mar 29, 2009
Country
United-States
For me a great Olympic program has to be audience friendly. The music needs to build to that moment that brings the crowd to its feet or tears to their eye or gives them goosebumps. In otherwords, it elicits emotion. This program doesn't have that, at least for me. I really like Ashley and I want her to have a great season so I hope she goes back to the drawing board.
 

Selene

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 7, 2012
I thought the music was a little too ponderous. There are some other cuts of Prokofiev's R&J that would have helped tell the story better. What's there would be difficult for anybody to interpret.

That was my impression as well. I think the program needs to be re-worked. I didn't buy Ashley as Juliet, and she seemed slow/like the music was overwhelming her at times. Her death scene at the end of the program delivers no impact, because she's not portraying the love-struck Juliet well earlier in the program.

I really liked Ashley's Black Swan and Samson & Delilah programs, but this program doesn't work for me.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Guys, it's simple. Wagner is just not at her strongest right now. In fact, I'd say that was probably the weakest I've seen her skate since the switch to Nicks...

The jumps are (mostly) there, the 3-3 is coming along (FINALLY!)...she needs to project the same confidence (which was missing here) and the rest will take care of itself.
 

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be
Record Breaker
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
Country
France
Projecting confidence does not "take care" of a poor program. Well not unless you have political backing, which Wagner doesn't have on the World stage. She isn't going to win an Olympic medal without a special performance, unless someone in the locked-in trio of Yu-Na/Asada/Kostner bombs. She needs to get on their level or at least very close to it, so that if they make some mistakes she moves up.
 

jenaj

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Country
United-States
I have to admit, I was a little disappointed in Ashley's R&J program. After her transformation in 2012 and 2013, this seemed like a step back. I miss the little things she did in her Black Swan and S&D programs that really made them stand out--the bent arms in her spiral in Black Swan and that really cool move into her Biellmann--following the beats of the music--in S& D. I really do not understand why she split with Mills, who I assume added those little nuances that were so effective. There is nothing really exciting in her R&J program and I don't like the music cuts. Warhorse music has a place in an Olympic year--I think Mao, for instance, is going to get extra points just for skating to the Rach 2, which is always a crowd-pleaser. Likewise, Max's skate to Carmen. If she was going to use the Proko R&J, she needed to use the familiar parts more. And why David Wilson, who will always save his best for Yu Na?
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
I have to admit, I was a little disappointed in Ashley's R&J program. After her transformation in 2012 and 2013, this seemed like a step back. I miss the little things she did in her Black Swan and S&D programs that really made them stand out--the bent arms in her spiral in Black Swan and that really cool move into her Biellmann--following the beats of the music--in S& D. I really do not understand why she split with Mills, who I assume added those little nuances that were so effective. There is nothing really exciting in her R&J program and I don't like the music cuts. Warhorse music has a place in an Olympic year--I think Mao, for instance, is going to get extra points just for skating to the Rach 2, which is always a crowd-pleaser. Likewise, Max's skate to Carmen. If she was going to use the Proko R&J, she needed to use the familiar parts more. And why David Wilson, who will always save his best for Yu Na?

IIRC, however, a lot of those choreographic flourishes were added as the season progressed.

I agree with RD, it's her first outing with this program, so to expect instant masterpiece is a bit much. What's more important at this point is the jumps look solid and the 3-3 does seem to be coming along.

We all can say how much Black Swan was great for her because of her success with it, but I remember I wasn't that impressed when she debuted it at Glacier Falls.
 

EricRohmer

On the Ice
Joined
May 31, 2010
And why David Wilson, who will always save his best for Yu Na?

I don't think Wilson is the type of choreographer who gives best effort (only) to his main top students.
Last season, Wilson gave good or great programs to Chan(LP), Javier(LP), Kozuka(SP), Korpi(SP), Elene G(SP) etc.
This season, among Wilson's works, for me Chan LP is awesome and Oda SP & Wagner LP are (very) good.
 

jenaj

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Country
United-States
I don't think Wilson is the type of choreographer who gives best effort (only) to his main top students.
Last season, Wilson gave good or great programs to Chan(LP), Javier(LP), Kozuka(SP), Korpi(SP), Elene G(SP) etc.
This season, among Wilson's works, for me Chan LP is awesome and Oda SP & Wagner LP are (very) good.

It may not be entirely intentional, but she is like his muse. There is a similar dynamic between Lori Nichol and Carolina Kostner. All of his work is very good, but I suspect Yu Na gets his best.
 

Sara

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 6, 2013
Does anybody know how many choreos Wilson has done for the top skaters this season? I usually like his work but this choreo for Ashley isn't that good! I also think Ashley is over-interpreting this ponderous music, to the extent that it is not convincing. Even before taking the starting position she already has this bizarre look on her face ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40rKETWhuxw ). I like Ashley a lot and was hoping to see something wonderful for the Oly season, especially now that she's working with Wilson.
 

drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
I think the performance will get better as the season unfolds. It's pretty clear that it is an unfinished program, as she seemed to be skating around aimlessly at times.
 

gourry

Final Flight
Joined
Nov 7, 2007
Okay before I made any evaluation, I've watched this program three times past several days.(it wasn't that interesting for me to watch it back to back in one day. ^^;;; )
And my verdict is, not bad!
The best part for me was the spread eagle in the beginning. And I'm really glad that Ashley finally tried 3-3 in a competition! And it wasn't that bad either.
The music is definitely not familiar, and a bit confusing, but fits the concept. The way I see it, this Juliet is a desperate, daring girl enough to drink coma inducing poison(first part), and after waking up the coma in which she had a brief dreaming of sweet romance(the little bit of soft and romantic melody in the middle), she only finds out her love of life is dead, so she goes crazy. Not bad really.
I also like the color on her. Ladies LP groups will be full of all shades of blue costumes, so she'll look fresh. I'm not so sure about the fit though. From that low resolution video it wasn't that flattering on her, but maybe it looks better in HD or in person?
Overall, I think as season goes by, this program will be refined and it will look quite nice. Go Ashley!!!
I really wish Ashley can be the world champion after the Olympics.
 

Icey

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 28, 2012
Sara, re the opening look on her face: she looks like she has already stabbed herself. The dress looks a different color on this vid than others I have seen, liked it better on this one. So, what color is it? She should skate the music and not Juliet, for this is a case of miscasting imo.
 

lavender

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
I just never get the Olympic year anymore. The music these skaters choose baffle me for the Olympic year these days seem like it's just any other year. I don't love any of the music (cuts) except for D and W, Mao and Jason Brown so far. Some I have not watch yet.
 
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