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Thread: Ashley's R&J?!

  1. #46
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    It is a work in progress but I admit I do not like the music cuts same with V and T same with Daisuke. I am unimpressed with the music for D and W as well. This is an olympic year too :( But it is early - of course the music or performance looks better when it is skated clean ie V and T - but look a t program with errors and then see how good it is.

  2. #47
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    For me a great Olympic program has to be audience friendly. The music needs to build to that moment that brings the crowd to its feet or tears to their eye or gives them goosebumps. In otherwords, it elicits emotion. This program doesn't have that, at least for me. I really like Ashley and I want her to have a great season so I hope she goes back to the drawing board.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oreo View Post
    I thought the music was a little too ponderous. There are some other cuts of Prokofiev's R&J that would have helped tell the story better. What's there would be difficult for anybody to interpret.
    That was my impression as well. I think the program needs to be re-worked. I didn't buy Ashley as Juliet, and she seemed slow/like the music was overwhelming her at times. Her death scene at the end of the program delivers no impact, because she's not portraying the love-struck Juliet well earlier in the program.

    I really liked Ashley's Black Swan and Samson & Delilah programs, but this program doesn't work for me.

  4. #49
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    Guys, it's simple. Wagner is just not at her strongest right now. In fact, I'd say that was probably the weakest I've seen her skate since the switch to Nicks...

    The jumps are (mostly) there, the 3-3 is coming along (FINALLY!)...she needs to project the same confidence (which was missing here) and the rest will take care of itself.

  5. #50
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Projecting confidence does not "take care" of a poor program. Well not unless you have political backing, which Wagner doesn't have on the World stage. She isn't going to win an Olympic medal without a special performance, unless someone in the locked-in trio of Yu-Na/Asada/Kostner bombs. She needs to get on their level or at least very close to it, so that if they make some mistakes she moves up.

  6. #51
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    I have to admit, I was a little disappointed in Ashley's R&J program. After her transformation in 2012 and 2013, this seemed like a step back. I miss the little things she did in her Black Swan and S&D programs that really made them stand out--the bent arms in her spiral in Black Swan and that really cool move into her Biellmann--following the beats of the music--in S& D. I really do not understand why she split with Mills, who I assume added those little nuances that were so effective. There is nothing really exciting in her R&J program and I don't like the music cuts. Warhorse music has a place in an Olympic year--I think Mao, for instance, is going to get extra points just for skating to the Rach 2, which is always a crowd-pleaser. Likewise, Max's skate to Carmen. If she was going to use the Proko R&J, she needed to use the familiar parts more. And why David Wilson, who will always save his best for Yu Na?

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenaj View Post
    I have to admit, I was a little disappointed in Ashley's R&J program. After her transformation in 2012 and 2013, this seemed like a step back. I miss the little things she did in her Black Swan and S&D programs that really made them stand out--the bent arms in her spiral in Black Swan and that really cool move into her Biellmann--following the beats of the music--in S& D. I really do not understand why she split with Mills, who I assume added those little nuances that were so effective. There is nothing really exciting in her R&J program and I don't like the music cuts. Warhorse music has a place in an Olympic year--I think Mao, for instance, is going to get extra points just for skating to the Rach 2, which is always a crowd-pleaser. Likewise, Max's skate to Carmen. If she was going to use the Proko R&J, she needed to use the familiar parts more. And why David Wilson, who will always save his best for Yu Na?
    IIRC, however, a lot of those choreographic flourishes were added as the season progressed.

    I agree with RD, it's her first outing with this program, so to expect instant masterpiece is a bit much. What's more important at this point is the jumps look solid and the 3-3 does seem to be coming along.

    We all can say how much Black Swan was great for her because of her success with it, but I remember I wasn't that impressed when she debuted it at Glacier Falls.

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenaj View Post
    And why David Wilson, who will always save his best for Yu Na?
    I don't think Wilson is the type of choreographer who gives best effort (only) to his main top students.
    Last season, Wilson gave good or great programs to Chan(LP), Javier(LP), Kozuka(SP), Korpi(SP), Elene G(SP) etc.
    This season, among Wilson's works, for me Chan LP is awesome and Oda SP & Wagner LP are (very) good.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by EricRohmer View Post
    I don't think Wilson is the type of choreographer who gives best effort (only) to his main top students.
    Last season, Wilson gave good or great programs to Chan(LP), Javier(LP), Kozuka(SP), Korpi(SP), Elene G(SP) etc.
    This season, among Wilson's works, for me Chan LP is awesome and Oda SP & Wagner LP are (very) good.
    It may not be entirely intentional, but she is like his muse. There is a similar dynamic between Lori Nichol and Carolina Kostner. All of his work is very good, but I suspect Yu Na gets his best.

  10. #55
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    Does anybody know how many choreos Wilson has done for the top skaters this season? I usually like his work but this choreo for Ashley isn't that good! I also think Ashley is over-interpreting this ponderous music, to the extent that it is not convincing. Even before taking the starting position she already has this bizarre look on her face ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40rKETWhuxw ). I like Ashley a lot and was hoping to see something wonderful for the Oly season, especially now that she's working with Wilson.

  11. #56
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    I think the performance will get better as the season unfolds. It's pretty clear that it is an unfinished program, as she seemed to be skating around aimlessly at times.

  12. #57
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    Okay before I made any evaluation, I've watched this program three times past several days.(it wasn't that interesting for me to watch it back to back in one day. ^^;;; )
    And my verdict is, not bad!
    The best part for me was the spread eagle in the beginning. And I'm really glad that Ashley finally tried 3-3 in a competition! And it wasn't that bad either.
    The music is definitely not familiar, and a bit confusing, but fits the concept. The way I see it, this Juliet is a desperate, daring girl enough to drink coma inducing poison(first part), and after waking up the coma in which she had a brief dreaming of sweet romance(the little bit of soft and romantic melody in the middle), she only finds out her love of life is dead, so she goes crazy. Not bad really.
    I also like the color on her. Ladies LP groups will be full of all shades of blue costumes, so she'll look fresh. I'm not so sure about the fit though. From that low resolution video it wasn't that flattering on her, but maybe it looks better in HD or in person?
    Overall, I think as season goes by, this program will be refined and it will look quite nice. Go Ashley!!!
    I really wish Ashley can be the world champion after the Olympics.

  13. #58
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    Sara, re the opening look on her face: she looks like she has already stabbed herself. The dress looks a different color on this vid than others I have seen, liked it better on this one. So, what color is it? She should skate the music and not Juliet, for this is a case of miscasting imo.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by jenaj View Post
    And why David Wilson, who will always save his best for Yu Na?
    and yet some are complaining about david's generic choreography on yuna's programs..

  15. #60
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    I just never get the Olympic year anymore. The music these skaters choose baffle me for the Olympic year these days seem like it's just any other year. I don't love any of the music (cuts) except for D and W, Mao and Jason Brown so far. Some I have not watch yet.

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