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Thread: Lionfish could destroy Atlantic Ocean ecosystem

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    Custom Title Johar's Avatar
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    Lionfish could destroy Atlantic Ocean ecosystem

    http://news.yahoo.com/invasive-lionf...214513936.html

    This is very scary, folks. Scarier than any halloween movie because it's reality.

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    Yes, the rise of invasive species with no natural enemies is completely scary. It's too bad we can't make this fish a food delicacy; then it could be over-fished just like tuna.

    The species invasions that make me maddest are the ones done on purpose by irresponsible humans: for example, owners of "pet" pythons who just release their snakes into the wild in Florida, so that now they're endemic.

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    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    we have it up here, too, with Pike... we catch and kill (it's a law, you catch one you kill it). they've killed entire salmon and trout populations.

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    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    But it is also true that this has been going on since the beginning of time. Ecosystems change. Species change their habitat. You want scary, consider what the different Ice Ages did to their respective ecosystems.

    You could call what we have along the East Coast right now "invasive species" or you could recognize that since the water in Long Island Sound is warmer than it was in the twentieth century that warm-water loving southern species are moving north-and so are cold-water loving species fleeing before them to find cool water. Our lobsters and the lobsters of Rhode Island and Massachusetts have been migrating to Maine. Maine now has so many that the price of lobster has tanked. Here in CT, there is a moratorium on lobster fishing.

    Fish and marine life have never stayed stuck right where you put them. There are no undersea fences to keep them penned into one area.

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    The article said the Lion fish is native to the Pacific, and had no natural predators in the Atlantic. What is controlling it in the Pacific?

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    Our oceans are screwed. Oversishing and pollution is going to be the end of them.

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    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KatEll View Post
    The article said the Lion fish is native to the Pacific, and had no natural predators in the Atlantic. What is controlling it in the Pacific?
    This site corrects some of the info in the initial report.

    http://newswatch.nationalgeographic....bout-lionfish/

    Wikipedia lists these predators, but wiki is always a bit ???

    Moray eels (family Muraenidae),[12] bluespotted cornetfish (Fistularia commersonii) and large groupers, like the tiger grouper (Mycteroperca tigris)[13] and Nassau grouper (Epinephelus striatus), have been observed preying on lionfish.[14][15][16] It remains unknown, however, how commonly these predators prey on lionfish.[17] Sharks are also believed to be capable of preying on lionfish with no ill-effects from its spines.[18] Park officials of the Roatan Marine Park in Honduras have attempted to train sharks to feed on lionfish as of 2011 in an attempt to control the invasive populations in the Caribbean.[19] Predators of larvae and juvenile lionfish remain unknown, but may prove to be the primary limiting factor of lionfish populations in their native range.[12]

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    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    But it is also true that this has been going on since the beginning of time. Ecosystems change. Species change their habitat. You want scary, consider what the different Ice Ages did to their respective ecosystems.

    You could call what we have along the East Coast right now "invasive species" or you could recognize that since the water in Long Island Sound is warmer than it was in the twentieth century that warm-water loving southern species are moving north-and so are cold-water loving species fleeing before them to find cool water. Our lobsters and the lobsters of Rhode Island and Massachusetts have been migrating to Maine. Maine now has so many that the price of lobster has tanked. Here in CT, there is a moratorium on lobster fishing.

    Fish and marine life have never stayed stuck right where you put them. There are no undersea fences to keep them penned into one area.
    That is very true... though in order to migrate to the lakes and streams that the Pike are in in Alaska they had to be carried

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    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Yes, it is very true that humans redistribute species. A lot. More than other natural causes. But so do birds that drop live fish. So do flooding streams, and other natural events.

    Consider this strange & unlikely event:
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-Lajamanu.html

    If the fish fell into a pond, they may not have died on impact.

    So what's going on with fish redistribution is something that has always gone on, but humans are making it happen faster.

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    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    Yes, it is very true that humans redistribute species. A lot. More than other natural causes. But so do birds that drop live fish. So do flooding streams, and other natural events.

    Consider this strange & unlikely event:
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-Lajamanu.html

    If the fish fell into a pond, they may not have died on impact.

    So what's going on with fish redistribution is something that has always gone on, but humans are making it happen faster.
    Not arguing that point

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    Custom Title heyang's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    Consider this strange & unlikely event:
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-Lajamanu.html
    LOL - makes 'Sharknado' a slim possibility!


    It's not just fish. Starlings and stink bugs are problems, too. I believe Stink bugs arrived on cargo vessels and have no natural enemies in US. Apparently, there's some kind of hornet in China that preys on stink bugs, but I think I'd rather deal with the stink bugs vs hornets, at least for now.

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    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    The business of importing predators for this and that invasive species is all too much like the kindergarten song:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8a13-JbxC98

    and importing things on purpose that turn out badly is not new
    http://www.si.edu/Encyclopedia_SI/nm.../gypsymoth.htm

    Loosestrife has nearly exterminated the native Joe Pye weed.

    The English sparrow is hugely common, and I'm sure, has taken habitat from native species.

    Dutch elm blight came here from the Netherlands, and killed most all the elms on America's numerous Elm Streets.

    I have hated for years the Oriental bittersweet that is strangling plants & trees in our eastern US forests.

    But somehow the old ecosystem turns into the new ecosystem.

    And thus it ever was.

    And with climate change, it better well had continue to be that way. That's how the earth will survive.

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    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    And with climate change, it better well had continue to be that way. That's how the earth will survive.
    I agree, and while Humans are a factor in both, we are just as much a "victim" of climate change just as they were during the Ice Age(s) and other major weather/climate changes in the Earth's many ears (we can argue how old it is on a different thread lol) and eons.

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    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    We don't have to get into a how old is the earth discussion-even in historic times there have been huge shifts from time to time.

    During Roman times, it is a fact that North Africa (now desert) was the breadbasket of the Roman Empire.

    That's a pretty radical change right there.

    Not to mention the so-called Little Ice Age that occurred after the Medieval Warm Period,
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Ice_Age
    from 1350 to 1850.

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    Our Great Lakes are under serious threat from Asian Carp.

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