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Thread: 2013-2014 Skate America - Ladies Championshps

  1. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    You can still have plenty of artistry with CoP, the problem is the judges don't reward it:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovkJMZmhFe8

    This deserved the highest PCS of the the Ladies competition at Skate America, but instead she only got the 5th highest. She also got screwed over on some of the level calls (Layback called as Level 1 when it's clearly Level 3? Footwork only called as Level 2, should have been level 3. Combination spin was a Level 4, but she only got credit for Level 3).
    I've never really watched Cesario before, but my goodness--she has that "it" factor. That program does what I think choreography should do: use music to create character and incite emotion in the viewer. I was very impressed.

  2. #107
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poodlepal View Post
    Lately, there's been a few stories in the news about how the media's portrayal of girls as being soft, delicate, etc. is so terrible. (A "Survival Book for Girls" was banned from a small bookstore because the things to "survive" were so stupid; also, I've seen a couple of articles against frilly, girly Halloween costumes, one suggesting that girls dress like Amelia Earhart or Susan B. Anthony instead of Disney Princesses.)

    It's ironic, then, that female figure skaters seem to be going in the other direction, becoming more girly and princessy than ever. That's why I miss people like Tonya, Midori and even Irina. They may have been many things, but delicate princesses were not one of them.
    In the USA, it is perhaps not coincidental that the only steady work in skating is the Disney ice shows these days.

    What bugs me about most of these roles is that becoming a princess in real life is an impossible goal. And Amelia Earhart was gutsy but died young, not something I'd want my granddaughter to emulate particularly.

    OTOH, I can't see her dressing up as Admiral "Amazing" Grace Hopper or Hillary Clinton or Mother Teresa or Susan B. Anthony-none of them liked pink as much as my granddaughter.

  3. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by yunasashafan View Post
    To be honest, I am getting a bit tired of the refrain "COP killed the sport popularity." Would Mao have won over Ashley under 6.0 had they skated like they did at SA this past weekend? Maybe someone more familiar could help enlighten me, but I would think yes, even with the fall (it would maybe have been a 5-4 split, but a win nevertheless). I would think judges would find ways to reward her for the 3A attempt, not to mention the always-elusive artistry mark.

    In any case, I think skating's demise in the USA is mostly due to the lack of a star who can consistently dominate on the world stage in the ladies discipline*. Not many casual fans would want to make the trek to Detroit to watch Ashley lose to Mao, or Yuna, or Carolina. Just look at Korea: when Yuna is skating, the events are full to the brims. When she's not, it is not the same. In Japan, there is an embarrassment of riches as far as talent is concerned, but what will happen after the current crop retires? will Japanese fans still fill arenas? For us on this and similar forums, we watch skating because we are passionate about it, and we will keep watching regardless of where the champions are from. For the causal fan, nationalism plays a big role in sports following at the international level, imo. How many people in the US stopped watching the Tour of France after the Armstrong retirement and following fiasco? A lot, I would think.

    In the US, the introduction of IJS coincided with the retirement of Michelle, hence the start of the decline. After Sasha retired in 2006, it was the kiss of death.

    Another factor that is playing a key role in this phenomena is the technological developments of the internet age. How many would choose to save on time, cost and effort and opt to watch an event from the comfort of their home instead of traveling to the arena?

    * I realize that ladies is not the only discipline, but it seems to be the only one of interest in the US. Case in point: the successes of Davis and White and Evan Lysacek
    The popularity decreases when stars retire mostly because a lot of people don't care about skating, they simply want to support their skaters against competitors form rival countries (like Japan and Korea, etc).

  4. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    In the USA, it is perhaps not coincidental that the only steady work in skating is the Disney ice shows these days.

    What bugs me about most of these roles is that becoming a princess in real life is an impossible goal. And Amelia Earhart was gutsy but died young, not something I'd want my granddaughter to emulate particularly.

    OTOH, I can't see her dressing up as Admiral "Amazing" Grace Hopper or Hillary Clinton or Mother Teresa or Susan B. Anthony-none of them liked pink as much as my granddaughter.
    But that's exactly why we dress up as princesses--because one can't aspire to it in real life. There's nothing wrong about playing princess at an early age or a later age. For a long time, through the 1970s, many people seemed to feel that girls would grow up stronger if they played with unisex toys and dressed powerfully and androgynously. Then princesses crept back into vogue. So did fewer girls grow up to be doctors and jet pilots? On the contrary: more girls are doing those things. I think there's a streak in many girls that yearns for princesses and/or for velvet dresses. It doesn't correlate with a fear of math or a lack of aspiration. There's no need to wear dreary, virtuous Halloween costumes in order to keep oneself motivated to aim for the stars. (Though I admire Grace Hopper!) A little frivolity and glamor won't lower the IQ.

    I bet your granddaughter looks great in pink, and I bet she's inherited Grandma's facility with math and research as well.

  5. #110
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    But that's exactly why we dress up as princesses--because one can't aspire to it in real life. There's nothing wrong about playing princess at an early age or a later age. For a long time, through the 1970s, many people seemed to feel that girls would grow up stronger if they played with unisex toys and dressed powerfully and androgynously. Then princesses crept back into vogue. So did fewer girls grow up to be doctors and jet pilots? On the contrary: more girls are doing those things. I think there's a streak in many girls that yearns for princesses and/or for velvet dresses. It doesn't correlate with a fear of math or a lack of aspiration. There's no need to wear dreary, virtuous Halloween costumes in order to keep oneself motivated to aim for the stars. (Though I admire Grace Hopper!) A little frivolity and glamor won't lower the IQ.

    I bet your granddaughter looks great in pink, and I bet she's inherited Grandma's facility with math and research as well.
    A harmless break from reality never hurt anybody... in fact it can be very healing (granted my pocketbook may disagree, but I think a trip down Disney lane is always a good thing!)

  6. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    OTOH, I can't see her dressing up as Admiral "Amazing" Grace Hopper or Hillary Clinton or Mother Teresa or Susan B. Anthony-none of them liked pink as much as my granddaughter.
    Please forgive me for going off topic but I wanted to thank Doris for the reference to Admiral Hopper. She is one of my heroes (heroines?). I was fortunate to hear one of her speeches at the Naval Base in California where I worked. I fondly remember one of the lines of her talk about the first computer bug when she said: "It was World War II so of course we were working in a World War I temporary building." This statement has seemed to apply several times during my college years and my career working for the Navy. One of my prized possessions is a navy baseball cap with the name of the US destroyer named after her. I bought it when I was fortunate to work on the pre-deployment tests of the combat systems for the DDG-70 (USS Hopper).

  7. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulE View Post
    Please forgive me for going off topic but I wanted to thank Doris for the reference to Admiral Hopper. She is one of my heroes (heroines?). I was fortunate to hear one of her speeches at the Naval Base in California where I worked. I fondly remember one of the lines of her talk about the first computer bug when she said: "It was World War II so of course we were working in a World War I temporary building." This statement has seemed to apply several times during my college years and my career working for the Navy. One of my prized possessions is a navy baseball cap with the name of the US destroyer named after her. I bought it when I was fortunate to work on the pre-deployment tests of the combat systems for the DDG-70 (USS Hopper).
    What a wonderful story! She's also someone I admire. (A shero? Whatever the word, she's it.) I'm jealous that you got to hear her. I didn't realize they named a destroyer after her. A well-deserved accolade. How I learned about her was years ago, one of the major magazines (Time, LIFE, or one of those) had a special issue about accomplished women, and she was one of them. While she may not make it as a Halloween costume, she certainly should be someone that girls learn about. Boys, too!

  8. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    What a wonderful story! She's also someone I admire. (A shero? Whatever the word, she's it.) I'm jealous that you got to hear her. I didn't realize they named a destroyer after her. A well-deserved accolade. How I learned about her was years ago, one of the major magazines (Time, LIFE, or one of those) had a special issue about accomplished women, and she was one of them. While she may not make it as a Halloween costume, she certainly should be someone that girls learn about. Boys, too!
    Whatever happened to "heroine"? Is that deemed to be insufficiently stern these days?

    I'm sorry, but "shero" sounds like a Saturday morning cartoon.

  9. #114
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robeye View Post
    Whatever happened to "heroine"? Is that deemed to be insufficiently stern these days?
    Could be. A heroine might mean the beautiful princess that spends the whole story sitting around waiting to be rescued by the dashing knight errant. A hero, or hoagy, could be male or female, i think?

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