Random Figure Skating Questions

SoundtracksOnIce · Dec 1, 2014

golden411 said:
Thx, gravy. Appreciate the definitive word on how Nam himself pronounces his own name.

(But nothing wrong with other Nguyens choosing a different pronunciation for themselves. As you say, it varies.
Leonard Bernstein and his brother used different pronunciations of their last name, IIRC.)
).

Peter Graves and his brother James Arness also changed their names - James altered the spelling of their real family name, Aurness, and Peter used their mother's maiden name.

I went to school with a girl whose last name was Nguyen and I believe she pronounced hers "Hwhen".

KwanIsALegend · Dec 1, 2014

Will there be a World Team Trophy this year?

skatingfan4ever · Dec 1, 2014

Why does an element with all +3 GOEs have a final GOE of 2.1 and not 3? I get the part about using the trimmed mean, but even doing that, it still averages out to 3 in my head. What's going on?

ice coverage · Dec 1, 2014

skatingfan4ever said:
Why does an element with all +3 GOEs have a final GOE of 2.1 and not 3? I get the part about using the trimmed mean, but even doing that, it still averages out to 3 in my head. What's going on?

You have to convert the +3 according to the scale of values for the particular element.

http://static.isu.org/media/139590/1861-sandp_sov_levels-of-difficulty_goe_2014-15.pdf (single and pair)
http://static.isu.org/media/139620/1868-id-scales-of-values-2014_15.pdf (ice dance)

KwanIsALegend said:
Will there be a World Team Trophy this year?

Yes, the next WTT is scheduled for 2015.

KwanIsALegend · Dec 2, 2014

golden411 said:
Yes, the next WTT is scheduled for 2015.

Thank you.

skatingfan4ever · Dec 2, 2014

golden411 said:
You have to convert the +3 according to the scale of values for the particular element.

http://static.isu.org/media/139590/1861-sandp_sov_levels-of-difficulty_goe_2014-15.pdf (single and pair)
http://static.isu.org/media/139620/1868-id-scales-of-values-2014_15.pdf (ice dance)

Oh thank you. I don't know how I missed that before. It was sitting right in front of me in the SOV. :eek:

:

ETA: Why are the GOEs calculated differently for each element? Is it based solely on the "difficulty" of a certain type of element in relation to the other types of elements? (e.g. jump GOEs are calculated differently than spin GOEs or step sequence GOEs). Why is that? Apparently, all GOEs are not created equal. Who knew!

StitchMonkey · Dec 2, 2014

Is there a limit on repeated double jumps you can do before you Zayak all doubles.

i.e. In terms of the free skater, if i am not mistaken you can do two 2As and two 2Ts and be ok, but add on more of either and it will be a zero. Well what about a 2L? Is it like triples/quads that you can repeat 2 different ones and only one of each, or do doubles have their own rules. Can you do 3 (or more) sets of doubles?

Assuming a skater has already done one 2A, and no other doubles, at what point would something like a 2A 1/2 loop 2F 2T 1/2 loop 2S 2T 1/2 loop 2F 2L 1/2 loop 2S 2L as a sequence Zayak? Is there a limit on how silly they could get with the doubles in one sequence? What is the longest sequence we could think of that is allowed?

And yes i remember that sequences are based on the two highest value jumps *.8, but I am just trying to figure out how many you could tack on if for some reason someone wanted to. Call it elaborate attempt at GOE.

Mathman · Dec 2, 2014

StitchMonkey said:
And yes i remember that sequences are based on the two highest value jumps *.8, but I am just trying to figure out how many you could tack on if for some reason someone wanted to. Call it elaborate attempt at GOE.

I think you can jump your fool head off if you don't care about getting any points after the first two. I once saw Shizuka Arakawa do 14 double and single loops in a row, just for fun (not in competition). Michelle Kwan had an exhibition with four double Axels in a row. I guess the last two would get GOE for creative exit from the first two.

Edited to add: Here's a 37 jump combo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3lT3dQoU10

StitchMonkey · Dec 2, 2014

Mathman said:
I think you can jump your fool head off if you don't care about getting any points after the first two. I once saw Shizuka Arakawa do 14 double loops in a row, just for fun (not in competition). Michelle Kwan had an exhibition with four double Axels in a row. I guess the last two would get GOE for creative exit from the first two.

"Creative exits" was sorta what I was thinking was a good thing to call it. I suspect there could be some musical pieces out there that could work well with the series of doubles like this. Something with at one-two, one-two one-and-two, type beat to match with first double, second double, and the 1/2 loop on the sorta quick step half beat "and" in between beat some songs have. Can you tell I am not much of a musician?

Mathman said:
Edited to add: Here's a 37 jump combo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3lT3dQoU10

I love that! Even if I found it a bit dizzying. My better half blurted out at the end "That's gotta be hell on the knees"

I want to see someone like Rohene Ward that can jump both ways see how many they can doing going back and forth to get rid of the dizzy factor.

Mathman · Dec 2, 2014

Dan Hollander had a comic routine to a Richard Simmons exercise tape where Simmons says, "double," "single, "double, single" over and over and Hollander does double and single toe loops to the cadence. The brilliant one-and-only Kurt Browning had a routine to Easy by Barenaked Ladies in which he did a double Axel every time the word "easy" came up in the lyrics. Which was a lot of times.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A14DdvORx9s

MalAssada · Dec 2, 2014

This isn't stupid but it is also not thread worthy.

Regarding mental illnesses and doping: How are benzodiazepines handled in Figure Skating? Let's say we have a nervous skater before a competition - can she take, let's say, a Xanax (alprazolam)? What if she is officialy diagnosed with Panic Syndrome or Generalized Anxiety Disorder, is she allowed to take a "chill pill" before a big competition or would it be considered as doping/cheating?

StitchMonkey · Dec 2, 2014

bellflower said:
This isn't stupid but it is also not thread worthy.

Regarding mental illnesses and doping: How are benzodiazepines handled in Figure Skating? Let's say we have a nervous skater before a competition - can she take, let's say, a Xanax (alprazolam)? What if she is officialy diagnosed with Panic Syndrome or Generalized Anxiety Disorder, is she allowed to take a "chill pill" before a big competition or would it be considered as doping/cheating?

Ok stick with me for a moment on the trail.

According to this PDF that appears reasonably trustworthy, athletes are directed to www.globaldro.com for reference on drugs. You have to agree to their terms to view stuff (likely a CYI of "don't blame us if you test positive type thing", but you can run a search with variables like athlete or coach, and by sport.

For benzodiazepines/figure skating/athlete it found Three results

"Antipyrine/Benzocaine 54mg-14mg/ml Otic Solution"
"Docusol Plus with Benzocaine Rectal Enema Suspension"
" Benzocaine

Other Name(s):
Ethyl aminobenzoate"

(Their formatting)

all are showing as

"This ingredient is not currently included on the WADA Prohibited List."

If you are interested in something of a gray area. Adderall (used for ADD but technically a stimulant) is allowed out of competition, but prohibited in competition.

So case by case basis. The drug you mentioned seems ok, but some others may not be. My guess is the family the drug comes for has a lot to do with it.

peg · Dec 2, 2014

Of course, the other complication here is that common side effects of benzos are drowziness, dizziness, sedation, and loss of balance. Not necessarily what you want if you're on a slippery surface with narrow blades strapped to your feet. In fact, I suspect the side effects are part of the reason they're not banned - not really a competitive advantage.

MalAssada · Dec 2, 2014

Whoa, thank you. Can't believe you found it all so quickly :bow:

Edit: Deleted because of a little bit personal info.

KwanIsALegend · Dec 3, 2014

I think this definitely qualifies as a stupid question but here goes. What is the point difference when you do a triple jump step and then another triple vs. a triple/triple? The triple/triple is harder right because you don't get the break in the middle?

Just curious.

Thanks in advance.

penguin · Dec 3, 2014

KwanIsALegend said:
I think this definitely qualifies as a stupid question but here goes. What is the point difference when you do a triple jump step and then another triple vs. a triple/triple? The triple/triple is harder right because you don't get the break in the middle?

Yes it's much harder to do the triple-triple without any steps in between, because it requires not only stability, speed, and flow, but also tons of consistency to ensure that you can always add that second triple. When you do a step in between, that step can really help mask if you have a landing that's slightly off, so it's easier to do the second triple even if the first one isn't perfect. So the jump sequence (with a step or turn in between) awards fewer points and get 80% the total value.

Mathman · Dec 3, 2014

KwanIsALegend said:
I think this definitely qualifies as a stupid question but here goes. What is the point difference when you do a triple jump step and then another triple vs. a triple/triple? The triple/triple is harder right because you don't get the break in the middle?

Just curious.

Thanks in advance.

If you mean a triple-triple combination versus two separate triple jumps in two separate jumping passes, the points are the same. However, if you do a triple-triple then you still have an extra jumping pass in which you can throw up a double Axel or something, thus gaining more points.

silverfoxes · Dec 3, 2014

Has anyone ever made a comparison chart of the # of falls (with adjustments based on the number of skaters) at major competitions? It seems like a lot of people believe "splatfests" (referring mainly to the men) are just a recent phenomenon, but I think people tend to have short memories and I'd like to see if there has actually been a drastic increase, say, since the beginning of the quad era. Whether just at the Olympics, or Olys and Worlds...I think it would be interesting. But I don't want to gather the statistics myself. :slink:

gkelly · Dec 3, 2014

We'd have to look at a lot of competitions to get a really meaningful comparison. Any suggestions on where to start? Maybe we can divide the labor.

Anecdotally, I remember joking about 4 failed quad attempts from the 3 medalists in the 1998 Worlds men's event. (Yagudin popped a quad attempt, Eldredge fell on one, Plushenko fell on two as well as one of his triple axels and placed 4th in the freeskate)

DrMunchkyn · Dec 3, 2014

The drugs you mentioned are not the same as Xanax. However, I did run a search on alprazolam (generic name of Xanax) and it also came back not on the prohibited list.

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