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Thread: Stupid Questions Thread

  1. #391
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    Ah, i see. Thanks, gkelly! I remember Arakawa did the 3-3-2 at 2004 Worlds. The 2 at the end looked unnecessary but thanks for explaining & giving great examples. =D

  2. #392
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    Okay, I have another question. I saw a couple people in a comments section/board/can't quite remember make some jokes about Alaskan figure skating, as if the state had some special infamy for turning out poor skaters. Does it? Which regions are considered to be the weakest and strongest in the US?

  3. #393
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Keegan Messing from Girdwood,AK, is a very good skater.

    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keegan_Messing
    Keegan was 4th at Jr Worlds twice, won Cup of Nice once, and was 3rd at Nebelhorn.


    So was Sydne Vogel a good skater.
    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydne_Vogel

    Sydne was Jr. World and US Jr champion.

  4. #394
    Missing Tdizzle and SDiggity golden411's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ruffledgrouse View Post
    Okay, I have another question. I saw a couple people in a comments section/board/can't quite remember make some jokes about Alaskan figure skating, as if the state had some special infamy for turning out poor skaters. Does it? Which regions are considered to be the weakest and strongest in the US?
    FWIW, Ashley Wagner began skating at age 5 in Eagle River, Alaska.

    (How long she skated there is a separate question. As a military brat, she had to relocate nine times as she grew up.)

  5. #395
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    Oh, interesting! I didn't know she lived in Alaska. As for the nine moves, military folk are usually transferred every 2-3 years. Google shows Eagle River is a suburb of Anchorage, which makes sense. The only two clubs I could find in AK are in Anchorage and Juneau.

  6. #396
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    Quote Originally Posted by ruffledgrouse View Post
    Okay, I have another question. I saw a couple people in a comments section/board/can't quite remember make some jokes about Alaskan figure skating, as if the state had some special infamy for turning out poor skaters. Does it? Which regions are considered to be the weakest and strongest in the US?
    The Northwest Pacific region is the smallest region in the US in terms of number of skaters -- but one of the largest in land area since it includes Alaska. That means that traveling to club competitions, for practice competing and to get exposed to what other skaters are doing at the various levels below the top televised seniors is inconvenient and expensive, so skaters from remote areas may have less experience than those in more densely populated areas.

    Even if the average quality of skating in the region is comparable to that in larger regions, because the total number of skaters is smaller, the fields at regionals are smaller. Skaters who finish third and fourth at regionals and move on to sectionals will not always be as far above average as those from larger regions. I.e., the average quality of skating at sectionals by skaters from smaller regions will tend to be weaker than that from the larger regions.

    Southwest Pacific region is one of the largest and strongest in the country, and Central Pacific somewhere in between. So SWP tends to have the best showing at Pacific Coasts and the most representation at Nationals. But any individual skater from NWP who is especially strong can beat skaters from other regions and move on to Nationals and beyond (including a junior world title for Sydne Vogel).

  7. #397
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Rory Flack (Burghard) lived and coached in Alaska for many years. She was better known as a professional skater (her split jumps were spectacular) than as a competitive skater.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rory_Flack

  8. #398
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    Yes - certain Regions are tougher than others. From what I have read, only the Juvenile and Intermediate levels have residency/home ice requirements; I believe these requirements are dropped at Novice and higher.

    Remember that only the top 4 from each Region go to Sectionals and the top 4 from Sectionals reach Nationals. As a general rule, the bigger the region (more skaters), the tougher it is to make it to Sectionals. In my region, there are 100+ Juvenile girls all vying to be in the top 4.

  9. #399
    Sometimes bad skating happens to good people... LiamForeman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandpiper View Post
    Yeah, I've heard of the whole Katarina Witt situation. I think it created a costume rule because of how... revealing... the bottom area was.

    She still managed to win two OGM despite her outfit being too sexy for the judges. Has there been any costume that's been dinged simply for being too bad?
    Simone Koch's costumes were equally revealing if not more. But since she wasn't a gold medal contender they just didn't care. Sometimes with Simone you just wish she'd have gone out in a swimsuit, there was hardly anything covering the bare minimum of her pelvic area. Plus she was doing Bielmanns!!! Sort of like Witt's Euros SP costume.

  10. #400
    Sometimes bad skating happens to good people... LiamForeman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandpiper View Post
    This was way before my time, so maybe I'm just clueless, but looking at the videos... I didn't get what was so wonderful about Manley's performance? Didn't she land the same number of triples as Witt? (She has 3Lz, but no jump combo, while Witt at least had 3T-2T). Manley's skate also looks very frenetic and dated, while Witt's still looked like a lovely performance even if it technically was quite meh. Not to mention, Manley won the LP--it just wasn't enough to win overall. If anybody was robbed in the LP, it was Midori Ito.
    Yep, Sandpiper, I still cannot understand what Manley did better than Ito...... Ito should have won the free skate. No question. Manley's lines were just as undeveloped as Ito's. Manley was such a whiner. She never saw a world podium before Calgary and then she thinks she lost the gold medal due to judging shenanigans? J Sale took a page out of the whining book of Manley. uggh. Canadians.

  11. #401
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    I once saw a 'track sheet', but I don't remember whose: lines on a paper following a skater's long program as it would appear on the ice.

    If you watch a skater's track you could see how far s/he skates and how well the skater covers the ice. From this you should be able to estimate their speed, which is often discussed. I understand that if a skater does lots of crossovers they fare longer than if they do intricate moves, but still.

    The stupid or not questions:
    * Do skaters usually draw track sheets or whatever they are called?
    * How? From recording from above, using some other technique or randomly draw?
    * Do skaters/coaches use track sheets only for them selves?
    * Wouldn't skaters who cover a lot of ice and have a long track want to show it publicly? Hoping the judges got to see it?
    * I would like to see some if anyone knows where to find them

  12. #402
    Sometimes bad skating happens to good people... LiamForeman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandpiper View Post
    ^Isn't that cheating? (the applause track) Also, I think it's a terrible idea--what if you fall? You'll just look like a fool, having your soundtrack applaud you after a fall. There are a few 6.0 skaters who might be able to pull it off, but it's the last thing I'd recommend for a COP skater.

    RE: The Feeling Begins. I still think it was the best SP of Worlds 2004. Screw their stupid time deductions.
    The only egregious applause soundtrack I can remember is Vanessa Gusmeroli's 1997 LP. How she ever made the podium is beyond me.

    I also have this very vague recollection of Michael Weiss adding claps to one of his programs. I think he did a flamenco SP so that may be it. He, Audrey, and that wife of his were in the studio clapping if I can remember correctly.

  13. #403
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Rory Flack (Burghard) lived and coached in Alaska for many years. She was better known as a professional skater (her split jumps were spectacular) than as a competitive skater.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rory_Flack
    Rory's split jump is one of the featured moves in IN's recent voting game.

  14. #404
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowflake View Post
    I once saw a 'track sheet', but I don't remember whose: lines on a paper following a skater's long program as it would appear on the ice.
    IIRC Peggy Fleming's autobiography The Long Program used this (in two pieces) as endpieces.

    Yup, here it is -- on three pages at the beginning of the book.

    The stupid or not questions:
    * Do skaters usually draw track sheets or whatever they are called?
    * How? From recording from above, using some other technique or randomly draw?
    * Do skaters/coaches use track sheets only for them selves?
    As far as I know -- and I cannot speak from personal experience with elite skaters -- skaters, coaches, or choreographers may draw them by hand as a choreography tool, mostly to keep track that the program is visiting all parts of the ice in interesting patterns.

    A few weeks ago my coach drew part of such a pattern for me to suggest exiting a jump and entering the next one in a different direction in the program we were putting together.

    Judges might sketch in travel patterns during the performance in progress as part of their note taking if they have adequate room on the papers they're given to take notes. But if they devote a lot of attention to mapping out the program they won't have time or attention to take many other notes and also input their GOEs into the computer during the performance.

    * Wouldn't skaters who cover a lot of ice and have a long track want to show it publicly? Hoping the judges got to see it?
    A hand-drawn sheet wouldn't have any more value than the planned program content sheet -- it's what the skater plans to do, but the judges have to judge what the skater actually does during the competition. For all sorts of reasons the performance might not live up to the plan, and also a freehand drawing made during/after a performance will not be a strictly accurate reflection of what the skater actually did.



    * I would like to see some if anyone knows where to find them
    If we're talking about the same thing, there wouldn't be any archive of such things. Skaters/coaches/choreographers might draw them on paper and then either throw them away or keep them in their own records for future reference. (E.g., could be useful for reviving an old program)

    My coach had an app on her tablet where she could draw it on the screen with her finger. And then she didn't save/deleted it immediately.

  15. #405
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    Quote Originally Posted by LiamForeman View Post
    Yep, Sandpiper, I still cannot understand what Manley did better than Ito...... Ito should have won the free skate. No question. Manley's lines were just as undeveloped as Ito's. Manley was such a whiner. She never saw a world podium before Calgary and then she thinks she lost the gold medal due to judging shenanigans? J Sale took a page out of the whining book of Manley. uggh. Canadians.

    It's been pointed out earlier in this thread that Ito skated very early in the LP b/c her school figures scores were so low. As a result, she didn't get the kind of high scores in the LP that she might have received if she'd skated later. The judges were "leaving room" for later skaters. Not saying it's fair, though. (I really have to watch both of those programs again!)

    http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/sho...-Thread/page26

    Something else that's unfair: sweeping statements about various nationalities, e.g., "Canadians," "Americans," etc.

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